1/2 or 3/4 ton ?

[John in Santa Cruz]

right, the customer has to ask for the service. most pumps have a handicapped sign on them that says to honk for service.

[TZBrown]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

I guess if you plan to sell a vehicle right away there is no need to fill, though when I have sold vehicles I always do so with a (near) full tank, as otherwise you look like you are cheaping out.

Reminds me of my wife, she used to buy cat and dog food in a 5 lb bag.....

My response was Don't you plan on the pets living long enough to eat more than that?

about 2 weeks in most cases.

We came home with 25 lbs for each

[Patandlinda]

Our 1992 f-250 has two tanks 16 and 19 . We generally run one tank down to 1/4 full then switch to other tank 1/4 full then will start looking for gas . Comes in handy because never want to run out of gas and sometimes have eaten into the gas still in tanks but gives us extra time to find a station . If gas is we think is high ,will just fill up the one tank and wait until we find a better price . Love the capacity of two tanks . We get almost 15 + not towing and 9-11 towing with a 5.8 gas engine and it is a long 8 bed. . Extra gas capacity would be the first item on our list if ever replacing . Pat

[drmemory]

Been pulling our 21 with an old '06 1/2 ton suburban for about a year and 1/2. Been up them steep passes in the rockies and further west. We never had a problem. Would I like more grunt? Who ever gets enough torque or horsepower?

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by drmemory

Who ever gets enough torque or horsepower?

Actually, a friend who has managed Toyota dealerships told me that many customers opted for the RAV4 with the 4 cylinder versus the V6. The V6 puts out 269 HP and the vehicle can be squirrely when you punch it, but it's great for towing and getting up to highway speed on the on ramp.

[Little Richie]

Originally Posted by jkordzi

The Escape 21 is a little lighter than the 5.0TA we own, which we tow with a 2017 GMC Canyon V6. We have been all over the west and just drove from Dallas to Sequim WA, via a number of parks in UT. We get 15-16 MPG towing and 25+ on the highway. See my previous post about how we did on our maiden voyage about a year ago. Really like the GMC Canyon. So you really don't even need a 1/2 ton and a 3/4 ton is way overkill.

Yes, but....
A fifth wheel may result in 10-15 percentage point increase in weight on the truck. It is just the nature of the beast. Consequently, what kind of tow is just as important as the weight of the tow. What may work for a tag along may not work for a fifth wheel.

[Little Richie]

A quick note: in some areas, e.g. Chicago land, there are summer gas requirements for gasoline that are EPA mandated. This results in a jump in gasoline prices in addition to demand driven increases.

[Tworainy]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Actually, a friend who has managed Toyota dealerships told me that many customers opted for the RAV4 with the 4 cylinder versus the V6. The V6 puts out 269 HP and the vehicle can be squirrely when you punch it, but it's great for towing and getting up to highway speed on the on ramp.

My wife says the same thing about our RAV4 V6. That's why I park it now in the off-season and use it almost exclusively for towing. Use our LEAF the rest of the time...especially with gas at C$1.729/L (U$4.80/gal)!

[dan55]

Just curious was your tow speed is. Recently towed with my 2013 Silverado 5.3 tow package averaged about 11.5 mpg towing at 68 mph in lightly rolling interstate.

[Hawkeye Ed]

This topic started as a discussion of the choice between a 1/2 ton truck and a 3/4 ton truck (plus some alternatives). It's clear from the responses that there are many variables to individual situations including, best of all, pure personal preference.

We're going up to Chilliwack next week for the orientation on our new 5.0TA so I did some weight calculations for our rig. You might find them interesting and I'd sure appreciate any feedback you may have about my numbers.

Our tow vehicle is a 2011 F-250, a 3rd generation (2011-16) Super Duty 4X2 Supercab with a 6.2 liter gas engine, 3.73 axle and camper package. We got it to haul a camper. It’s probably overkill for a 5.0TA but what the heck - it’s paid for and has less than 50K miles. Maximum cargo weight rating is 2265 pounds and maximum loaded trailer weight rating is 12,500 pounds, according to Ford’s 2011 RV and Trailer Towing Guide. BTW, the truck has a 35 gallon gas tank; at 13.5 mpg (seemingly no matter what the load or speed) I’m running on fumes at about 450 miles per fill up.

Dry weight of a 5.0TA is 3810 pounds; gross vehicle weight rating is 5,500. That gives us about 1700 pounds to stuff the trailer with before exceeding the trailer GVWR. We know from experience that we’ll load ‘er up; that’s the beauty of a strong-pulling tow vehicle.

Ford recommends a 5th wheel king pin weight of 15-25% of the loaded trailer weight. Worst case scenario then is that we put 25% of the GVWR (1375 pounds) into the truck bed via the king pin. That leaves us 890 pounds of the maximum cargo weight rating for ourselves, stuff in the cab, and other stuff in the bed. That’s being real conservative, but explains why I choose to go with a bigger truck, even at the cost of truck suspension ride and gas mileage.

All comments welcome.

[Chotch]

I haven’t heard of any 5.0TA putting any where near 1350 lbs on the pin. My tow is a 2016 F150 2.7 Ecoboost which usually gets around 14 mpg towing. I’ve done as good as 15 and worse 12.5. When not towing 22 average highway, to as good as 26 using 87 octane regular. This truck never stops amazing me. It easily tows my 5.0 TA just put it in tow/haul mode set the cruise control and enjoy the ride. And the ride and handling on a 1/2 ton is far more comfortable than a super duty. Escape doesn’t make a trailer that’s not easily towed by a properly spaced out 1/2 ton or mid sized truck for that matter. Contrary to what some say bigger is not always better.

[Jim Bennett]

I have my trailer weight right up near the 2,500 kg (5,500 lb) mark (this after some weight weaning) with all the custom work I have done, plus what we bring on long trips. My pin weight is at 350 kg (770 lbs) which is real close to 15%. I have never seen in my truck manual any fifth wheel weight suggestions, but maybe I can have another look.

Towing with my F-150 with the 3.5L EcoBoost is a piece of cake, and it tows wonderfully with zero stability issues even in strong winds.

Most hear have already heard, but I drove F-250 and F-350s with the Power Stroke Diesel for near 25 years and was sure glad to downsize to a more comfortable, somewhat smaller and fuel efficient (especially in fuel cost) truck.

There is nothing wrong with using a 3/4 or 1 ton truck if that is what you have, and what you need for other uses, but it is most definitely not needed for towing the 5.0TA. Do watch the cargo capacity of the pickup you want to ensure you will have adequate capacity.

[John in Santa Cruz]

5th wheel pin weight directly translates to payload for the truck, since its over the axle.

so whatever your trucks payload is, subtract the pin weight to get the remaining payload.

[arniesea]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeEZ

Dry weight of a 5.0TA is 3810 pounds; gross vehicle weight rating is 5,500. That gives us about 1700 pounds to stuff the trailer with before exceeding the trailer GVWR.

All comments welcome.

From a practical perspective, the "wet" payload of the 5.0 with the fresh tank full and the grey and black tanks empty is ~ 387 KG. depending on build options. That is 853 Lbs U.S.

Here is a picture of my weight sticker. (Edit: blacked out my VIN for privacy)

[ThomasG]

In the past Escape said the max pin weight for the 5.0TA was 900 lbs. Currently, their website says "Hitch Weight 630 lbs".

Check the cargo weight for *your truck* on the sticker inside the driver's door, not the info from the factory website.

Don't forget to include the weight for all the parts of your hitch system as cargo weight. We went with the aluminum Andersen Ultimate to help keep our cargo weight down (as well as for other reasons). However, that probably won't be a problem for your 3/4 ton truck.

[James Gang]

"Our tow vehicle is a 2011 F-250, a 3rd generation (2011-16) Super Duty 4X2 Supercab with a 6.2 liter gas engine, 3.73 axle and camper package. We got it to haul a camper. It’s probably overkill for a 5.0TA but what the heck - it’s paid for and has less than 50K miles. Maximum cargo weight rating is 2265 pounds and maximum loaded trailer weight rating is 12,500 pounds, according to Ford’s 2011 RV and Trailer Towing Guide. BTW, the truck has a 35 gallon gas tank; at 13.5 mpg (seemingly no matter what the load or speed) I’m running on fumes at about 450 miles per fill up."

I am surprised at your cargo weight rating. It seems low to me. I have a 2012 F250SD XL 4X2 crew cab also with the 6.2L. My cargo rating is 3400 pounds. My mpg ranges from 11 (@ sea level) to a little over 14 at high altitudes.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by HawkeyeEZ

Maximum cargo weight rating is 2265 pounds...
...
Dry weight of a 5.0TA is 3810 pounds; gross vehicle weight rating is 5,500. That gives us about 1700 pounds to stuff the trailer with before exceeding the trailer GVWR. We know from experience that we’ll load ‘er up; that’s the beauty of a strong-pulling tow vehicle.

Ford recommends a 5th wheel king pin weight of 15-25% of the loaded trailer weight. Worst case scenario then is that we put 25% of the GVWR (1375 pounds) into the truck bed via the king pin. That leaves us 890 pounds of the maximum cargo weight rating for ourselves, stuff in the cab, and other stuff in the bed. That’s being real conservative, but explains why I choose to go with a bigger truck, even at the cost of truck suspension ride and gas mileage.

That's all good information and sound reasoning.

Ford's recommendation is for typical fifth-wheel trailers, but the Escape 5.0TA is not typical in proportions. 25% of gross trailer weight on the pin would be way too high, and likely excessive for the frame structure at full GVWR. About 16% is typical, and 20% would be extreme. With a more reasonable pin weight, a properly configured F-150 would accommodate the same 890 pounds of people and cargo in the truck... but of course the SuperDuty works, too.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

That's all good information and sound reasoning.

Ford's recommendation is for typical fifth-wheel trailers, but the Escape 5.0TA is not typical in proportions. 25% of gross trailer weight on the pin, especially at full GVWR, would be way too high, and likely excessive for the frame structure. About 16% is typical, and 20% would be extreme. With a more reasonable pin weight, a properly configured F-150 would accommodate the same 890 pounds of people and cargo in the truck... but of course the SuperDuty works, too.

fwiw my f250 has *way* better brakes than similar year f150 and e150's I've driven. when I hit bumps in the E150 and in borrowed F150s, I could feel the whole vehicle shudder. The F250 just goes ka-bump, not a bit of shudder or shimmy.

[Chotch]

Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz

fwiw my f250 has *way* better brakes than similar year f150 and e150's I've driven. when I hit bumps in the E150 and in borrowed F150s, I could feel the whole vehicle shudder. The F250 just goes ka-bump, not a bit of shudder or shimmy.

🤔 And a Mack truck has even bigger brakes and also goes ka-bump, what’s your point? You better have those guys get their F150s checked out because something is amiss. My 2016 F150 handles great whether towing or not. I have absolutely no complaints with the suspension or the brakes. The truck rides tight and stabile under any reasonable circumstances. It also seems the newer F150 is 1 of the most popular tow vehicles on this forum and I don’t remember anyone who actually owns 1 that doesn’t like them or have I missed something here?

[steve dunham]

I have no personal knowledge of the Ford F150 vs Ford F 250
I have driven and towed with a Ram 1500 , a Ram 2500 and a Ford 350
The 2500 and 350 handled road bumps and braking differently than my 1500
My 1500 handles and brakes like a car , the 2500 & 350 handles and brakes like a truck.
Ones a pleasure vehicle , the other is a work truck , towing is work in my book .
The major reason I bought a 1/2 ton truck over a 3/4 ton truck was one thing “COST”