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Old 03-10-2016, 01:51 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
It is possible to have a air-cushioned hitch with a ball, although it takes some custom fabrication...
I also stumbled across another option: the enormous and enormously heavy air-ride Trailersaver TS3 fifth-wheel hitch offers a gooseneck ball accessory. The ball appears to bolt into a socket on the top of the air suspension mechanism in place of the usual fifth-wheel head, so the weight when used with a ball would be much lower. Due to the height of the hitch, this might put the ball at a workable height for an Escape. It would be used with just the coupler from Andersen, or a similar coupler/adapter from another source.
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Old 03-10-2016, 01:54 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
Having had a Scamp 19 which uses a coupler and ball setup (which I hated), and knowing how precise coupler to ball alignment must be to hook up versus the true 5th wheel hitch, in addition to the need for safety chains, I personally don't get the rampant fascination with the Ultimate Hitch. removed from the king pin with a couple of wrenches. Just my opinion.....
Quite simply.......weight.

Not only is there less payload weight, it will be much easier to remove. Lisa can carry it with no problem.
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:08 PM   #23
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Quite simply.......weight.

Not only is there less payload weight, it will be much easier to remove. Lisa can carry it with no problem.
I do understand the desire to have less weight, but my Curt Q16 comes apart in two manageable pieces. The wife would have no reason to try to carry either piece , slthough she probably could. While I wouldn't mind having lighter weight, when I weigh lighter weight versus the greater difficulty in aligning a ball and coupler, it is a no brainer FOR ME. Ease in aligning wins by a landslide.
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:15 PM   #24
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I don't quite understand the whole alignment problem. I have had to do it thousands of times with a bumper mount hitch. What makes it tougher with the Anderson hitch? And with the new kingpin coupler, it allows an alignment range of 6", should be just about able to drive a semi through there.

I am only used to fifth wheel hitches on big rigs, but even there we had to check to make certain our height and alignment were close before coupling. Can you clearly see the fifth wheel hitch in a pickup bed?
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:22 PM   #25
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I am selling my F-350 fairly soon, and will be using the F-150 for work. The hitch will have to be put in and taken out after every trip with the 5.0. I am liking the weight and ease of it for that.

For those who are happy with the conventional hitch, and have one working good for you, that is great. After lots of researching I decided on the Anderson, and I bet that will work for me too. I have heard lots, and lots, of good stories about them.
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:48 PM   #26
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Coupling a fifth wheel hitch was a breeze for me. Set the plate slightly below the hitch height and back in. The hitch will lift the trailer's front legs and guide the pin into the coupler. Get out and latch the coupler, finish cranking the legs up. And drive off.

For the gooseneck you can imagine trying to align it, then go back and crank up the trailer legs hoping it engages in the ball. And do it again until it couples. Did it on Grandpa's farm a lot and it worked great there, often the ground was uneven and the haul was short. Quick and easy tow and toss a load on the bed anytime.

For me and my 5th wheel trailer I would have needed a ladder to get in the box and hook up chains. With the tail gate down I could not fit comfortably to slide in from the back.

My biggest frustration with the fifth wheel hitch was the wasted space in the tow vehicle dedicated to the 5th wheel hitch. And a few times we had kids jump in the back for a ride to the other end of the campground and they got grease on 'things' and clothes from the hitch.

Not to mention lifting it in/out to use my pickup bed for hauling. And not having the canopy anymore, too much lifting etc.

To me IF you have a big trailer the 5th hitch is the way to go but all that hassle for a small light trailer isn't worth it. So I went with the 19' hooked by ball only to a V8 4runner. It's a sweet combo for our style of quick pick up and go camping. And I bought a nice utility trailer for hauling.
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:27 PM   #27
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To me IF you have a big trailer the 5th hitch is the way to go but all that hassle for a small light trailer isn't worth it. So I went with the 19' hooked by ball only to a V8 4runner. It's a sweet combo for our style of quick pick up and go camping. And I bought a nice utility trailer for hauling.
For larger trailers, this is definitely true, I would not consider one of those huge bumper pulls, but for me much of the reason to go with the 5.0 was the layout, and the shorter overall length, while providing plenty of storage. The advantages of the weight loading and and better towing were well back on the list of advantages.

Plus, I can tow another trailer behind it around here if I want.
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:31 PM   #28
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Hi: Klem... This past winter a camper at Ocala Nat. Forest had deep V's imprinted in both sides of his box rails. Either his monster fifth came detached or he hit one heck of a dip in the road. OUCH!!! Alf
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:36 PM   #29
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Anderson Weight Savings

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Originally Posted by barry View Post
Ditto .......

I have a Curt Q16 with the dual locking jaws and it weighs 109 lbs according to my bathroom scales. The Anderson apparently weighs in at 40 lbs but then you have the extra weight of the safety chains and the adapter to convert it to the king pin so by then you are only probably saving 20 or 30 lbs for the headache of the ball hookup. A gym membership could take care of that ....

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My calculations of the weight of my Curt Q16 were similar to Barry's. I went thru this debate a year ago re Anderson versus traditional fifth wheel hitches. Difficult to figure out the weight savings online as many of the manufacturers such as Curt and Reese will include the rails (at around 35 lbs. in their specs.). The Anderson fifth wheel gooseneck style hitch was 40 lbs. at the time without the rails. Since I have pulled my hitch out several times recently in order to move my truck camper about the yard, this thread piqued my interest enough to go weigh the head and the frame with a bathroom scale. The head was 40 lbs. and the frame was 66 lbs., very close to what Barry got.

For those of you trying to figure out what the total weight addition is to your truck will be here are my numbers for my Q-16. The under bed hardware and the rails weights I had to pull from a website as they are way too difficult for me to easily pull out, but from memory they do seem accurate as I installed them myself.

Head: 40 lbs.
Frame: 66
Rails: 35
Under bed hardware: 30
Total 171 lbs.

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Old 03-10-2016, 06:38 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Jim Bennett View Post
I don't quite understand the whole alignment problem. I have had to do it thousands of times with a bumper mount hitch. What makes it tougher with the Anderson hitch? And with the new kingpin coupler, it allows an alignment range of 6", should be just about able to drive a semi through there.

I am only used to fifth wheel hitches on big rigs, but even there we had to check to make certain our height and alignment were close before coupling. Can you clearly see the fifth wheel hitch in a pickup bed?
I have the Extra Cab which is smaller than the King Cab. The greater distance between the driver and the rear window of either, and the fact that the hitch is below the bottom of the rear window (and I have an aluminum tool box also) means the hitch cannot be seen fron the driver's seat. With the Scamp 5er it was "go forward an inch, nope, that's too much, pull forward and try to get the ball an inch further to the left. Good, come straight back. Stop....too far, pull forward a bit. Good, put it in park. Oops, when you put it in park it moved an inch backward so it needs to go forward a bit." And that was the typical conversation when hooking up. That doesn't happen with the 5th wheel hitch. Maybe some people can hitch up with a ball and coupler without all the minor adjustments for alignment; I couldn't unless I got real lucky. I have zero desire to go back to a coupler and a ball even if it would save 60-80 pounds. FOR ME, the aggravation when hooking up isn't worth the weight savings. All I am saying is that someone with no 5th wheel experience may get the impression that the Anderson Ultra is the cat's meow and jump on the Anderson bandwagon, when in fact they might be better off with a conventional 5th wheel hitch. Given the cost, it might be wise to try to get some practical experience with both before spending a lot of money on either one. The point I would make is just because someone touts the features of a Volkswagon Beetle, it doesn't mean it is the ideal car for someone who is 6'6" tall. As Brian stated in an earlier post there are Scamp 19 owners who have gone through a lot of effort and cost to change the coupler to a pin box. I understand why they would do this. Does anyone without 5th wheel experience using both systems to get a comparison understand why? I've used both and I know what works for me.
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Old 03-10-2016, 07:20 PM   #31
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So, the difference between the conventional and Andersen is about 60lbs, total savings. I can understand the ease of hitching is with the conventional, but there is also the towing experience, does the Andersen tow better than the conventional over our well kept road system
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:06 PM   #32
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FWIW: A Harbor Freight folding engine lift makes removing a conventional 5th wheel hitch a fairly easy task in a shop/garage or on a concrete pad. Set your removed hitch on a dolly and you can store it under a work bench. One man can remove/install a hitch without killing your back.
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Old 03-10-2016, 11:03 PM   #33
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FWIW: A Harbor Freight folding engine lift makes removing a conventional 5th wheel hitch a fairly easy task in a shop/garage or on a concrete pad. Set your removed hitch on a dolly and you can store it under a work bench. One man can remove/install a hitch without killing your back.
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My garden cart works fine for moving the hitch from the driveway to the shed, it's a bit lower then the open tailgate. The only hassle is moving the hitch from the center of the truck bed to the end of the tailgate, then swinging it onto the cart. Not a big issue at 60, but if I'm still traveling by the time I'm 70, it's gonna be replaced by whatever is lightweight by then.

In my experience ease of hooking up is mostly just a matter of getting enough practice, no matter what kind of hitch you have. Even lining up the bumper pulls get easier with practice.

As far as does the Anderson ride better then a conventional, I'd be hard pressed to think of how the ride could be improved. There's no play in the B&W, no clunking, no bucking, no sway, no nothing. I think if the Anderson tows as good as the B&W you'll be happy. Don't know about the other conventional hitches. Of course some of the good towing ride could come from having a good sized truck.
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Old 03-10-2016, 11:23 PM   #34
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There are only three axes (pitch, roll, yaw) - what's the fourth? Maybe you mean three axes of pivot, plus vertical displacement (due to the spring).

The brilliance of a ball-and-socket hitching system is that it accomodates all three axes of rotation very simply, in contrast to the multiple parts needed in a pin-and-plate fifth-wheel. Commercial truck fifth-wheels don't pivot in roll (side-to-side) so they are simpler, and they take vastly higher loads so a ball wouldn't be practical. I don't see much reason to use the pin-and-plate design for a little RV... other than avoiding those pesky safety chains.
Whoops, I think you missed that I didn't write any of that post except the intro. It is just an example of how far some folks take it.
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Old 03-11-2016, 08:22 AM   #35
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I don't quite understand the whole alignment problem. I have had to do it thousands of times with a bumper mount hitch. What makes it tougher with the Anderson hitch? And with the new kingpin coupler, it allows an alignment range of 6", should be just about able to drive a semi through there.

I am only used to fifth wheel hitches on big rigs, but even there we had to check to make certain our height and alignment were close before coupling. Can you clearly see the fifth wheel hitch in a pickup bed?
Jim, I agree, having used both a Reese 5th wheel and a Andersen Ultimate, neither is easier than the other. Both take getting used to, and you need to be properly aligned was well as the correct height for both to make a secure connection.
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Old 03-11-2016, 10:15 AM   #36
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Jim, I agree, having used both a Reese 5th wheel and a Andersen Ultimate, neither is easier than the other. Both take getting used to, and you need to be properly aligned was well as the correct height for both to make a secure connection.
Let's wait and see what Jim thinks when he starts using his Anderson. He says he has experience with 5th wheel hitches. Maybe he will agree. I just know I hated the Scamp ball and coupler but love the Curt Q16. But I was advised ahead of time to by a jaw type hitch rather than a sliding bar.
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Old 03-11-2016, 01:43 PM   #37
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Whoops, I think you missed that I didn't write any of that post except the intro. It is just an example of how far some folks take it.
Ah, that explains the degree of enthusiasm and the lines of dashes. So there won't be an answer to the "4-axis" question, but the comments still apply.

The quoted section was apparently from a thread called 5th wheel hitch VS goose neck in Diesel Place: Chevrolet and GMC Diesel Truck Forums. The original question in that discussion was:
Quote:
I am in the hunting stages for a 5th wheel camper and would like to get some feedback on hitches. While I do not have a goose neck trailer my brother does and would be nice to be able to pull it if the need arises. Should I convet the camper to a goose style or leave it as a 5th wheel? What are the pro and cons of each?
This person specifically wanted a floor-level ball for compatibility, leading to a different set of options and issues than Escape owners considering the Andersen Ultimate. That thread provides good examples of the structural problems with tall pin box extensions (the Andersen is not one of these).
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Old 03-11-2016, 02:03 PM   #38
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Old 03-11-2016, 08:18 PM   #39
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Using quotation marks and making attribution is highly encouraged.

Trying to find the quote button. I see it above and will try [/quote] here [/quote]
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Old 03-11-2016, 08:33 PM   #40
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It's right here, but if you are quoting from some other site, you need to add "quotes" manually and you should state the site and/or author. Providing a link to the full site is also helpful.
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