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Old 12-12-2017, 12:01 AM   #1
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escape 21 braking experience

Ok if this has been covered, I apologize.

My wife and I are going to order a 21, and would like to hear from owners who have experience on very long steep descents. We travel in the Pacific Northwest USA, and have been over some very high passes with our camper, so I have a lot of respect for the size of some of those hills.

The Escape people tell me that the trailer will handle itself fine without help from the truck, but these are drum brakes, and that leaves me nervous about fading or overheating on long descents.

Any experience out there? Has anyone managed to damage these brakes from overheating, or experienced significant fading of brake power on long descents?

Thanks,

Allan Edie
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:25 AM   #2
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I'm not going to test my brakes on long descents so I can't say at what point they might fade. I just use common sense. I have them checked and adjusted yearly. I don't ride the brakes and I gear down early.
And, when I see signs for trucks to check brakes, I try to remember to look at my brake controller to ensure my 7-pin is still connected.
Been through the Coast Mountains and Rockies many times. Brake pads are original that came with the trailer in 2008.
The 21' has four brakes. My 17' only has two.
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Old 12-12-2017, 01:06 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
I'm not going to test my brakes on long descents so I can't say at what point they might fade. I just use common sense. I have them checked and adjusted yearly. I don't ride the brakes and I gear down early.
And, when I see signs for trucks to check brakes, I try to remember to look at my brake controller to ensure my 7-pin is still connected.
Been through the Coast Mountains and Rockies many times. Brake pads are original that came with the trailer in 2008.
The 21' has four brakes. My 17' only has two.
I could be wrong... but I thought the 21' had brakes on 2 wheels, not 4.



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Old 12-12-2017, 01:13 AM   #4
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I could be wrong. Has two axles, four wheels.
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Old 12-12-2017, 05:01 AM   #5
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It has brakes on all 4 wheels. This is where, IMHO, the integrated brake controller is preferred over the add on type. The truck and trailer become one unit. While in "tow mode" the truck's gearing changes and while descending the engine starts to drag as the transmission downshifts and braking efficiency is increased. It is a lot different than the old days where your foot was glued to the brake pedal. With 4 wheel disc brakes and 4 wheel drum on trailer, your unit stops well.
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Old 12-12-2017, 05:59 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanEdie View Post
Ok if this has been covered, I apologize.

My wife and I are going to order a 21, and would like to hear from owners who have experience on very long steep descents. We travel in the Pacific Northwest USA, and have been over some very high passes with our camper, so I have a lot of respect for the size of some of those hills.

The Escape people tell me that the trailer will handle itself fine without help from the truck, but these are drum brakes, and that leaves me nervous about fading or overheating on long descents.

Any experience out there? Has anyone managed to damage these brakes from overheating, or experienced significant fading of brake power on long descents?

Thanks,

Allan Edie
Hi: Allan Edie... I usually "Fade" long before the trailer brakes do!!! Being a "Flat lander" most of my brake use is 65 to 0 on the multi lanes not mountain passes. When we first got the 5.0TA I did use the brake controller and trailer brakes to slow the rig down and scuff the shoes in. My RVTech does a complete clean, adjust, and pack for $39. per axle + seals and tx's so I have it done regularly. Four discs on the truck and four drums on the trailer can't be beat!!! Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:39 AM   #7
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It is just as important for the tow vehicle to have adequate braking capacity to stop itself and the trailer in the event of trailer brake failure. Also a good idea to test your trailer brakes every time you start out, especially before a descent.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:42 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
It has brakes on all 4 wheels. This is where, IMHO, the integrated brake controller is preferred over the add on type. The truck and trailer become one unit. While in "tow mode" the truck's gearing changes and while descending the engine starts to drag as the transmission downshifts and braking efficiency is increased. It is a lot different than the old days where your foot was glued to the brake pedal. With 4 wheel disc brakes and 4 wheel drum on trailer, your unit stops well.
In tow mode my Silverado works like cruise control in reverse. The transmission automatically shifts down to control speed. A pleasure to drive on downhills compared to manually shifting down in the old days. That said shifting down my automatic transmission in past GM trucks while towing worked quite well. The 21' seems to have adequate brakes as well.

If you were negligent and did not shift down or go to tow mode (that has the auto shift down) I suspect you would have issues with brake fade on tow vehicle and trailer. I don't know why you would take the chance.
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Old 12-12-2017, 07:44 AM   #9
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Brakes

Our 21 was previously towed by a Grand Cherokee and a Durango, We tow with a Highlander. I keep the trailer brakes adjusted up so they are “right there” when I need them.
Here’s my procedure
1. Check out information on the upcoming pass(es) the night before I pull them.
2. Make sure my adjustable brake controller setting is where I want it for descent..
3. Tap the brakes a couple times as we crest the pass or as I stop to take a picture. The trailer need to be able to take care of itself.
4. Slap the shiftable transmission into 4 as I start down,
5, Watch the speedometer and when I feel the rig starting to cannonball, knock about 5 to 10 mph off with the brakes and shift to the next lower gear.
6 Lather rinse and repeat the rest of the way down towing as low as 2 and buzzing the engine up around 5500 rpm regularly.
7. Bump the shifter up when I can and down when I need to.
8. Flatten out on the bottom and repeat that old line from the cartoon Mickeys Trailer
“ I brought you down, safe and sound”. Babe
Been doing it like this or a close equivalent for lots of years.
Works for me. My Highlander had 80,000 on the fronts 111,000 on the rear brakes when I replaced them. No warped rotors either. Keep your nuts torqued evenly and inspect the shoes for even wear at least once a year.
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Old 12-12-2017, 09:04 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanEdie View Post
... My wife and I are going to order a 21, and would like to hear from owners who have experience on very long steep descents. ..
Allan, One of the reasons I find the "Ike Gauntlet" videos so informative is that they test tow vehicles going both uphill and downhill on a long, challenging grade in the Colorado Rockies West of Denver (Eisenhower Tunnel area; view example in link).
2017 Ford F-150 Ike Gauntlet Towing Review: How Good Are the New EcoBoost and 10-Speed? [Video] - The Fast Lane Truck
They score various aspects (some objective, some subjective) to come up with a single overall score for comparative purposes. Pick your favorite truck (trucks are their thing), and google "Ike Gauntlet" for that make, model and year.
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Old 12-12-2017, 09:08 AM   #11
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I have always set the brake controller to control the trailer brakes. Generally I set it such that the TV and trailer brake at the same time.

Frank
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Old 12-12-2017, 09:49 AM   #12
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Thanks all for the thoughtful feedback. I appreciate it. This is a remarkable forum!

Cheers,

Allan Edie
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Old 12-12-2017, 10:24 AM   #13
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Dave, thanks for that specific info on the Highlander. It'll refine what I have been doing. (Highlander family-- daughter '17, me '13, son has daughter's former '10 and previously my former '05.)
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:25 PM   #14
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For long hills coming out of passes, etc I depend on the tow vehicle's transmission. The "rule" is to choose the gear your vehicle would use going up the hill for providing holding going down.

If you speed up faster than the limit or the engine reaches maximum RPM, apply the brakes hard & short to slow down saves overheating. I (and I suspect, most) that tow in hilly country use this technique & don't have overheating problems.
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Old 12-12-2017, 12:38 PM   #15
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I have always set the brake controller to control the trailer brakes. Generally I set it such that the TV and trailer brake at the same time.

Frank
My rule is to set them such that things still feel "normal", like they felt BEFORE hooking up the trailer. That may not be possible on all trailers, but on the ones I've towed so far it has been. It adds much comfort to the whole experience since things still feel familiar and stable.
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Old 12-12-2017, 01:52 PM   #16
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I haven't noticed any problems on long descents. Like the others I downshift, moderate my speed, and keep an eye on things. I leave my lights on so I can look in the outside mirror and see the trailer's running lights; that way I know the 7-pin connector is still connected. I have had it come loose a few times.
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Old 12-12-2017, 02:07 PM   #17
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I have had no problem on descents in our 5 TA. Not sure if it’s an option for you but in our Tundra I have the option of a manual gear shifter. I just gear the truck down so that it doesn’t Get up too much speed. Helps a bit,
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Old 12-12-2017, 02:51 PM   #18
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i just put my F150 truck in tow mode and let it do all the work- no stepping on the break - stays a consistent speed. It is one of the things i really like about my new truck.
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Old 12-12-2017, 03:22 PM   #19
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Yes the Tundra has that as well. Good option although on some really steep descents I prefer the manual shift.
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Old 12-12-2017, 03:28 PM   #20
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Yes the Tundra has that as well. Good option although on some really steep descents I prefer the manual shift.
Hi: Mark James... My problem in "Steep descents" is I can never find the "Shift manual". Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie
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