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Old 11-07-2015, 12:56 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Bennett View Post
Bob, how do you measure your pin weight?
I don't know what Bob does, but two good methods come to mind:
  1. Weigh both truck axles (preferably together) on a truck scale, with and without the trailer, and without changing other loads (such as passengers). The difference is the pin weight. I use the highway scales run by government agencies for commercial vehicle enforcement; they're freely available for public use in Alberta, British Columbia, and some other places.
  2. Place a Sherline tongue weight scale between the pin and a suitably tall structure... such as blocking in the truck box.
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Old 11-07-2015, 01:03 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
If the wheels are located at the same pivot point, why is the 5.0 that much heavier than the 21?
Other than additional metal frame but less f/g shell? Does not add up. Also are you adding in your hitch weight to your pin weight to get the total impact on GVWR?
Less shell? The 5.0TA is a 21' plus a big bedroom loft right up front, with an extensive frame to rise up to in and support it, a massive pin box (designed for an eight-ton trailer, because lighter pin boxes are not readily available), and whatever is in the loft (cabinets, mattress, whatever stuff people put up there). That's not a criticism at all, just an acknowledgement of reality.
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Old 11-07-2015, 01:29 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by thoer View Post
I don't know it this helps much but found it in the 2016 Tacoma manual concerning TWR - trailer weight rating: TWR is calculated assuming base vehicle with one driver, one front passenger, towing package (if available), hitch and hitch systems (if required).
Additional optional equipment, passengers and cargo in the vehicle will reduce the trailer weight rating so as not to exceed GCWR, GVWR and GAWR.


Probably more applies to trailers other than 5th wheels
First, a fifth-wheel trailer is a trailer. Aside from that terminology issue...

Sometimes the manufacturer decides to limit total trailer weight based on the hitch weight capacity (so if the truck can handle up to 500 pounds on the hitch, it is only allowed up to 5000 pounds of total trailer). In that case, a fifth-wheel configuration would allow more trailer, since the truck can handle more on the fifth-wheel hitch over the axle than on the conventional hitch behind the bumper.

The GCWR, GVWR, and GAWR limitations are exactly the same regardless of the hitch type. Of course, carrying the hitch load further forward shifts load from rear axle to front axle, reducing the chance of reaching the rear GAWR.

I think you'll find that pickup truck trailer ratings are often based solely on the truck's Gross Combined Weight Rating and the curb weight, although large pickup with very high towing ratings do typically list higher capacity for fifth-wheels, so they are setting conventional trailer weight limits based on either hitch weight limits or (unlikely) stability concerns.
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Old 11-07-2015, 01:35 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
First, a fifth-wheel trailer is a trailer. Aside from that terminology issue...
.
I believe I said: "Probably more applies to trailers other than 5th wheels" But thank you for letting me know that a fifth wheel is a trailer,
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Old 11-07-2015, 02:00 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by thoer View Post
I believe I said: "Probably more applies to trailers other than 5th wheels" But thank you for letting me know that a fifth wheel is a trailer,
Sorry, I misread that as "rather" than fifth-wheels ... lots of people (including some on this forum) have insisted that a fifth-wheel is not a trailer.
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Old 11-07-2015, 02:40 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
Sorry, I misread that as "rather" than fifth-wheels ... lots of people (including some on this forum) have insisted that a fifth-wheel is not a trailer.
Lets round those people up and set them straight!
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Old 11-07-2015, 09:00 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by BCnomad View Post
Another article, if you missed it. Seems recently updated.

Nissan Titan Review - Motor Trend
That page includes this comment:
Quote:
Nissan reps admit the gross vehicle weight rating will top 8,500 pounds (at least on some models), so the EPA will think of those as full-on HDs, and no official city/hwy numbers will be measured on them.
EPA fuel consumption ratings are far from perfect, but - just like the big diesel pickups and for the same reason - fuel economy information for buyers will be entirely a matter of rumours. After purchase, buyers will either be pleased or suffering buyer's remorse.

Another part of the same page:
Quote:
Base and XD Titans employ different fully boxed frames, the half-ton's evolving from the current Titan and the XD's based on the NV commercial van chassis.
Since the current Titan and the big NV use two generations of the same design - which Nissan calls their "F-Alpha Architecture", they will have similar layout of the front suspension/steering/engine mounting and some shared parts, but many different parts because they are built to different load capacities. The Frontier shares this design (and almost no parts), so this isn't saying much about the new Titan's actual capacity or performance.

Quote:
One Nissan first: Using the remote key fob, a Trailer Light Check system can be triggered, cycling all the relevant lamps so the driver can remotely verify the trailer connection and functionality of the lightbulbs.
Cool
... although not particularly relevant to towing a 5.0TA versus any other trailer.
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Old 11-08-2015, 09:58 AM   #58
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Weight descriptions

This is handy for weight descrictions:
Understanding RV Weights
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Old 11-25-2015, 07:12 PM   #59
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Last Sunday, I finished driving my 2013 Tacoma TRD Sport 2WD w/ tow package truck from Chilliwack, BC to Florida as I brought my new 5.0TA home. It was about a 4K drive. I knew I was light on truck when I started and it preformed pretty much as I expected. You won't be passing much and the vehicle felt best at 60 to 65MPH. I also felt we maintained control of the vehicle well as, remember the main concern is stopping the rig. We will be added some additional supports to the leaf springs but overall I think it went very well. I got between 14 and 18 mpg. The 18 was with a 40 mph tail wind out of Vegas where the main problem was keeping it under 75mph. I get 17 around town wo/ the trailer attached. I think having 8 tires on the ground helped and wind caused by passing semi's or natural cross winds didn't cause much concern. We also dealt with ice, snow, rain and it worked out fine. Slow and steady and don't lets the other fools on the road bother you. I also found the long haul truckers to be very professional and I swear some ran traffic interference for me in Salt Lake and Dallas. I would offer that I plan to get to a full size truck in a few years after I retire as I want to visit the Rockies but the Tacoma will be fine for the flat lands of Florida and SE USA.
BTW, and as expected the new 5.0TA, or "Escape Pod #58" as I like to call her, was awesome to travel in. There are only 58, by now maybe 60, of them in the world. Everything worked great and we stayed warm and comfortable. Meeting all the staff at ETI was great too.
But to answer your original question, if you're going to be in the mountains the majority of time, or if you like to drive fast you might want to trade up to a full size truck.
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Old 11-25-2015, 08:04 PM   #60
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Thanks so much for your response. Very helpful and was what I expected. FYI I finally gave in and purchased the double cab Tundra with the 5.7 litre V8. Love the power and the drive. Planning on ordering the 5 next year. Pleased to hear your great review. My driving will be in some more mountainous areas. Cheers!
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