F-150 payload - Escape Trailer Owners Community

Go Back   Escape Trailer Owners Community > Escape Tech > Towing and Hitching
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 02-27-2018, 02:59 PM   #1
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
F-150 payload

2011 ford manual. On page 257 it gives steps for determining your truck's load limits. Here they are, simplified:

1) Locate the Yellow Sticker payload number.

2) "Determine the combined weight of the driver and passengers that will be riding in the vehicle."

3) Subtract "the combined weight of the driver and passengers" from the Yellow sticker payload.

4) "The resulting figure equals the available amount of cargo and luggage load capacity"

Summary: driver weight (150#) is NOT included in Ford's payload number.

There is mentioned an assumed 150 lb driver towards the max tow capacity but that has nothing to do with payload.

1. Payload is what the truck can carry. How much weight you can put in the cab, in the bed, on the roof, on the racks, on the hitch, before the GVWR and axle ratings are exceeded.

2. Towing capacity is how much the truck can pull. The weight of the fully loaded trailer and all of the stuff jammed into it.

3. Combined Weight Rating - the weight of the truck, the trailer, and all of the junk crammed into both.

Since the hitch weight of the trailer gets added into #1 above, the GVWR is likely to be exceeded before the towing capacity is reached.

Tin.
__________________

Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 04:30 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Olympia wa, Washington
Trailer: 5.0TA 2017
Posts: 1,908
if you got additional pay load would that be included in the door sticker?
__________________

Fox hunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 04:39 PM   #3
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
Yes it would.
Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 05:53 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Chotch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Naugatuck, Connecticut
Trailer: 2017 50 TA, 2016 F150, 2.7 Ecoboost
Posts: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox hunt View Post
if you got additional pay load would that be included in the door sticker?
The sticker on your truck is specifically for that truck with factory installed options. The high payload option would definitely be a factory installed option.🙂
Chotch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 06:00 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Chotch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Naugatuck, Connecticut
Trailer: 2017 50 TA, 2016 F150, 2.7 Ecoboost
Posts: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin View Post
2011 ford manual. On page 257 it gives steps for determining your truck's load limits. Here they are, simplified:

1) Locate the Yellow Sticker payload number.

2) "Determine the combined weight of the driver and passengers that will be riding in the vehicle."

3) Subtract "the combined weight of the driver and passengers" from the Yellow sticker payload.

4) "The resulting figure equals the available amount of cargo and luggage load capacity"

Summary: driver weight (150#) is NOT included in Ford's payload number.

There is mentioned an assumed 150 lb driver towards the max tow capacity but that has nothing to do with payload.

1. Payload is what the truck can carry. How much weight you can put in the cab, in the bed, on the roof, on the racks, on the hitch, before the GVWR and axle ratings are exceeded.

2. Towing capacity is how much the truck can pull. The weight of the fully loaded trailer and all of the stuff jammed into it.

3. Combined Weight Rating - the weight of the truck, the trailer, and all of the junk crammed into both.

Since the hitch weight of the trailer gets added into #1 above, the GVWR is likely to be exceeded before the towing capacity is reached.

Tin.
For 2016 Ford did allow 150lbs for driver. This I got from their website when researching my vehicle. Newer or older couldn’t say. Bottom line here is if the weight of the driver can make or break your payload needs you might want to upgrade your tow. Just saying🙂
Chotch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 06:53 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Somewhere, Florida
Trailer: 1804 Schooner
Posts: 1,642
In reality, the only difference between an F250 and an F350, the F350 having a greater cargo capacity, is the addition of one more leaf (spring) in the rear suspension. If you do not believe me, go ask someone who knows at your local Ford dealer. Perhaps the head salesman or the service manager, but not the girl (or guy) who answers the phone. In some cases, higher load rated tires may be installed as it comes from the factory. However, the cargo capacity of any F150 can be increased by alterations to the rear suspension (helper springs, Roadmaster Active Suspension). I am a fan of the Roadmaster because it is adjustable and it does not stiffen the ride when no payload is being transported. It utilizes a horizontal coil spring and works progressively as more payload is added. One really does not need to spend thousands of dollars upgrading an F150 to a beefier truck to safely tow a 5.0TA and carry additional equipment.
__________________
“Quoth the Raven, ‘Nevermore’......” E. A. Poe
C&G in FL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 07:42 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Chotch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Naugatuck, Connecticut
Trailer: 2017 50 TA, 2016 F150, 2.7 Ecoboost
Posts: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
In reality, the only difference between an F250 and an F350, the F350 having a greater cargo capacity, is the addition of one more leaf (spring) in the rear suspension. If you do not believe me, go ask someone who knows at your local Ford dealer. Perhaps the head salesman or the service manager, but not the girl (or guy) who answers the phone. In some cases, higher load rated tires may be installed as it comes from the factory. However, the cargo capacity of any F150 can be increased by alterations to the rear suspension (helper springs, Roadmaster Active Suspension). I am a fan of the Roadmaster because it is adjustable and it does not stiffen the ride when no payload is being transported. It utilizes a horizontal coil spring and works progressively as more payload is added. One really does not need to spend thousands of dollars upgrading an F150 to a beefier truck to safely tow a 5.0TA and carry additional equipment.
You can upgrade your payload in any number of ways from Timbren or Sumo poly springs, airbags, adding to or replacing the leaf springs right up to complete replacement of rear suspension with an air ride set up. As long as wheels and tires match your up grade your good to go. Unless you find yourself in a situation where you have to be weighed.😫
Not sure how often that happens towing a camper.
Chotch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 07:44 PM   #8
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
In reality, the only difference between an F250 and an F350, the F350 having a greater cargo capacity, is the addition of one more leaf (spring) in the rear suspension. If you do not believe me, go ask someone who knows at your local Ford dealer. Perhaps the head salesman or the service manager, but not the girl (or guy) who answers the phone. In some cases, higher load rated tires may be installed as it comes from the factory. However, the cargo capacity of any F150 can be increased by alterations to the rear suspension (helper springs, Roadmaster Active Suspension). I am a fan of the Roadmaster because it is adjustable and it does not stiffen the ride when no payload is being transported. It utilizes a horizontal coil spring and works progressively as more payload is added. One really does not need to spend thousands of dollars upgrading an F150 to a beefier truck to safely tow a 5.0TA and carry additional equipment.
I do not know who gave you this information but it is all pretty much incorrect.
The item mentioned do NOT increase your payload and the difference between a 150 to 250 and 350 is much much more than than a leaf spring.
Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 07:50 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Notasulga, Alabama
Trailer: 2010 EggCamper (#083); 2017 Escape 21 (#053); 2016 F-150 5.0L FX4
Posts: 1,734
I ordered my 1999 F-250 with a heavy duty suspension option. From what I recall, they added yet another leaf to the rear springs, added slightly longer spring shackles so the frame could squat a little more under load (which raised the rear end about 1 1/2 inches), then raised the front end higher to level the frame. And I think it came with load range E tires. Now that I think of it, I'm not really sure what they did to raise the front end. I need to take a close look at the front suspension sometime to see how they did that.
War Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 07:58 PM   #10
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chotch View Post
You can upgrade your payload in any number of ways from Timbren or Sumo poly springs, airbags, adding to or replacing the leaf springs right up to complete replacement of rear suspension with an air ride set up. As long as wheels and tires match your up grade your good to go. Unless you find yourself in a situation where you have to be weighed.��
Not sure how often that happens towing a camper.
You can install third party add on's to improve your handling or add Timbren or Sumo to level your truck but you are not increasing your vehicles pay load you are actually decreasing it by adding more wieght .
Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 08:06 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Chotch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Naugatuck, Connecticut
Trailer: 2017 50 TA, 2016 F150, 2.7 Ecoboost
Posts: 788
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin View Post
You can install third party add on's to improve your handling or add Timbren or Sumo to level your truck but you are not increasing your vehicles pay load.
Legally no, technically yes. That’s my point about having to get weighed, the numbers have to match your registration.
Chotch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 08:16 PM   #12
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
One way to increase your payload would be to take a factory part off your truck. Like say the tail gate/back seat or anything else that came with your truck from the factory.
Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 08:17 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North of Hertel, Wisconsin
Trailer: TBD
Posts: 2,110
The way it was explained to me is that the payload shown on your vehicle sticker is your payload limit
If you modify your vehicle ( leaf springs , air bags , sumo springs etc etc) your payload is still the payload # shown on the vehicle sticker
You can improve your vehicles handling but you cannot improve / change the payload limit
Tin stated it correctly in regards to payload and the differences between a 1/2 , 3/4 , 1 ton trucks .
The rules for payload do not just apply to Ford as some would lead us to believe. I know for my Ram 1500 the rules are exactly the same !
steve dunham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 08:53 PM   #14
Tin
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NA, Arizona
Trailer: 2017 5.0TA
Posts: 468
Payload = Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) and subtracting the truck’s curb weight from that figure.
The Yellow sticker on your door jam represents this calculation as it leaves the factory. Anything your dealer adds or you add increases the trucks curb weight there for decreasing the available payload of your truck.

Your trucks Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) does not change
Tin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 09:21 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 11,814
Quote:
Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
... the only difference between an F250 and an F350, the F350 having a greater cargo capacity, is the addition of one more leaf (spring) in the rear suspension.
While this may or may not be true (depending on year, and on other options), I'll note that this is comparing two variants of the same series of truck, the Ford F-SuperDuty, only the two most similar variants, and only the single-rear-wheel F-350.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin View Post
... the difference between a 150 to 250 and 350 is much much more than than a leaf spring.
Yes, but the F-150 is a completely separate vehicle from the F-SuperDuty (F-250 and up); that would be why Carl didn't include the F-150 in his comparison.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 09:30 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 11,814
Quote:
Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
In reality, the only difference between an F250 and an F350, the F350 having a greater cargo capacity, is the addition of one more leaf (spring) in the rear suspension...
If that is true, it implies that every other component of the F-250 which limits the GVWR is already strong enough to meet the requirements of the F-350's GVWR. Obviously, there will significant limits on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by C&G in FL View Post
...the cargo capacity of any F150 can be increased by alterations to the rear suspension (helper springs, Roadmaster Active Suspension).
...
One really does not need to spend thousands of dollars upgrading an F150 to a beefier truck to safely tow a 5.0TA and carry additional equipment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chotch View Post
You can upgrade your payload in any number of ways from Timbren or Sumo poly springs, airbags, adding to or replacing the leaf springs right up to complete replacement of rear suspension with an air ride set up.
While stiffer springs can certainly help the ability of a vehicle to handle loads within its rating well, it does not change the rating. The capacity of the truck is limited by many components, not just the springs.

If you put the springs from a gravel truck on an F-150, would it be able to handle 20 tons of cargo? Of course not, and no one is suggesting that... but where is the limit? How would anyone outside of Ford's engineering department know?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chotch View Post
As long as wheels and tires match your up grade your good to go.
Sure... if you really meant the wheels, tires, axle, brakes, frame, and probably some components that I have forgotten.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chotch View Post
Unless you find yourself in a situation where you have to be weighed.😫
Not sure how often that happens towing a camper.
I don't know how often, either, but I have heard reports of British Columbia's CVSE running checks on recreational rigs.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2018, 10:55 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Front Range, Colorado
Trailer: 2017 5.0 TA picked up in July 2017.
Posts: 525
You are not LEGALLY increasing the payload of your vehicle but you are increasing the safety and handling factor by adding SUMO Springs or other air bags. Also on a 5.0TA you can decrease the pin weight by emptying the black tank, (and grey) filling the fresh tank, moving heavy cargo out of the front storage areas and putting them behind the axles, using only one propane tank, adding a bicycle rack or cargo box to the back of the trailer. As long as you aren't hauling lead or gold bars you probably can't make the pin weight so light that the trailer becomes dangerous. A fifth wheel design which puts the pin weight on or just ahead of the axle is inherently more stable and aerodynamic than a bumper pull. If you want a 5.0TA and your sticker says your 1/2 ton truck only has 1200 to 1350 Lbs. cargo capacity go ahead and get the 5.0TA and just be careful what you are hauling. Also, the towing and cargo capacity figures also assume a worst case, ie... hauling the payload plus the "fudge factor" up Colorado I 70 to the Eisenhower tunnel and then down into Silverthorne while maintaining a speed of 65 mph, followed by driving over some serious bumpy roads. They closely monitor the handling, anti sway, breaking including emergency braking and monitor the short and long term wear and come up with a very safe number which can last for a long life. There is a lot of fudge in those numbers. The max numbers are not based on I 70 eastbound thru Kansas or I 95 to Florida.
SFDavis50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2018, 01:48 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Olympia wa, Washington
Trailer: 5.0TA 2017
Posts: 1,908
I am comfortable that I am staying with in my trucks pay load. If I want to bring something heavy I will put it in the rear of the trailer. Knowing all this shouldn't scare anyone away from this set up if you like it just keep it in mind while you pack your truck. With my hitch in my short bed truck there isn't much room to pack much when hauling my 5.0 anyway!
Fox hunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2018, 06:30 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Somewhere, Florida
Trailer: 1804 Schooner
Posts: 1,642
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFDavis50 View Post
You are not LEGALLY increasing the payload of your vehicle but you are increasing the safety and handling factor by adding SUMO Springs or other air bags. Also on a 5.0TA you can decrease the pin weight by emptying the black tank, (and grey) filling the fresh tank, moving heavy cargo out of the front storage areas and putting them behind the axles, using only one propane tank, adding a bicycle rack or cargo box to the back of the trailer. As long as you aren't hauling lead or gold bars you probably can't make the pin weight so light that the trailer becomes dangerous. A fifth wheel design which puts the pin weight on or just ahead of the axle is inherently more stable and aerodynamic than a bumper pull. If you want a 5.0TA and your sticker says your 1/2 ton truck only has 1200 to 1350 Lbs. cargo capacity go ahead and get the 5.0TA and just be careful what you are hauling. Also, the towing and cargo capacity figures also assume a worst case, ie... hauling the payload plus the "fudge factor" up Colorado I 70 to the Eisenhower tunnel and then down into Silverthorne while maintaining a speed of 65 mph, followed by driving over some serious bumpy roads. They closely monitor the handling, anti sway, breaking including emergency braking and monitor the short and long term wear and come up with a very safe number which can last for a long life. There is a lot of fudge in those numbers. The max numbers are not based on I 70 eastbound thru Kansas or I 95 to Florida.
I did not mean to create a “fecal material storm” with my post regarding the differences between the F250 and F350, and even the F150, but what I stated about the number of leafs in the spring assembly is true.
Steve stated my point of view better than me. Years ago (early 1980s) I had to move a bunch of sand from my house to a neighbors house about 1/2 miles down a rural road. We shoveled the sand into the bed of a Toyota pickup to the point that the springs were compressed and the front wheels were barely touching the ground. Handling was a bit squirrelly but the speed was kept under 10 mph. Was it legal in terms of cargo capacity? Doubtful. Was it safe? Neither I nor my passenger were ever in danger. Could the truck have been damaged? Yes, it could have been but it wasn’t.
Knowing engineers, I doubt that those at Ford who determined the formula for rating payload capacity reached a consensus. And I would bet money that the legal staff (lawyers seem to think they are engineers, doctors, nurses, coffee baristas, etc.) played a big role in setting the numbers.
Steve really hit the nail on the head. Towing a 5.0TA with an F150 does not constitute a road hazard. Perhaps if one were going to enter the combination in the Baja Endurance Event it might. But as Brian so aptly put it, nobody is going to put springs from a dump truck on an F150 and expect it to haul 10 tons of gravel. We are not talking a 40-foot 5th Wheel here, we are talking about a pinweight typically in the range of 700 to 750 lbs. Fully loaded, my pinweight is 722 lbs, based on a certified scale weight. Even with a cargo bed tool box and accessories in the back seat, I am still below the max cargo weight rating of my F150, and it does not have the added payload option.
__________________
“Quoth the Raven, ‘Nevermore’......” E. A. Poe
C&G in FL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2018, 08:12 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Notasulga, Alabama
Trailer: 2010 EggCamper (#083); 2017 Escape 21 (#053); 2016 F-150 5.0L FX4
Posts: 1,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin View Post
I do not know who gave you this information but it is all pretty much incorrect. The item mentioned do NOT increase your payload and the difference between a 150 to 250 and 350 is much much more than than a leaf spring.
It can get tricky fast (due to different engines, trim levels, options, etc.) trying to compare base curb weights, but if you at least standardize to 2-wheel drive, single rear wheels (not dualies), there is a 300-400 pound increase in base curb weight each time you move up in model from F-150 "half ton" to F-250 "three quarter ton" to F-350 "one ton". Beefier build (frame, drive train, etc.) as you move up the model line.
__________________

War Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off






» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Escape Trailer Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.
×