Is the V6 tacoma enough truck for the 21

[Sean Murry]

Did you ever total up your total combined vehicle weight? It doesn't seem to take much to get to or exceed a gross combined vehicle weight. Which would be the weight of your truck, loaded with canopy, people, hitch, dog and whatever gear you have, plus the loaded weight of the trailer. I was thinking of the Honda Ridgeline, which has a 5,000 towing capacity in AWD, to tow a 19, but by the time you add everything up it is only just capable at sea level. Honda also reduces the GCVW by 2% for every 1000 ft of elevation gain. I was also looking at the Frontier, which is a bit better, but with a canopy, two people, a hitch, and a trailer loaded at 4000 lbs, it only allows 200 lb to put in the truck. My dog would take 75 lb of that, leaving only 125 lb. Not enough space if you want to throw a couple kayaks on the roof, and a bit of stuff in the box of the truck.

[float5]

Originally Posted by wetzk

The Tacoma already has synthetic transmission fluid from the factory. Which is why they charge a small fortune to replace it !!!!!
It also has a transmission cooler the size of a mans open wallet.
We have been pricing various coolers and one that Etrailer sells seems to be the best option its a plate and fin type measuring 11W x 8-3/4T x 7/8D Inch.

Bought our 4Runner new in 2011 and the transmission fluid was changed as required at 90,000 miles. The car came with what it came with --- standard--- and has not had anything added.

The towing capacity is, AFAIAC, whatever the SAE new testing says it is. Toyota was the first company to actually use those standards. Less than 20% of the time, we are towing. In other words, unless your TV is a dedicated towing vehicle, you likely can follow the usual requirements for fluid changes. Whatever we paid for transmission fluid change was part of a package in which a number of items were changed. The Tacoma may be similar. You might want to have a look at that.

[float5]

Originally Posted by Sean Murry

Did you ever total up your total combined vehicle weight? It doesn't seem to take much to get to or exceed a gross combined vehicle weight. Which would be the weight of your truck, loaded with canopy, people, hitch, dog and whatever gear you have, plus the loaded weight of the trailer. I was thinking of the Honda Ridgeline, which has a 5,000 towing capacity in AWD, to tow a 19, but by the time you add everything up it is only just capable at sea level. Honda also reduces the GCVW by 2% for every 1000 ft of elevation gain. I was also looking at the Frontier, which is a bit better, but with a canopy, two people, a hitch, and a trailer loaded at 4000 lbs, it only allows 200 lb to put in the truck. My dog would take 75 lb of that, leaving only 125 lb. Not enough space if you want to throw a couple kayaks on the roof, and a bit of stuff in the box of the truck.

I am not sure what you are saying here unless you have the GVWR mixed up with the GCWR.

[Bill and Earline]

Originally Posted by wetzk

The Tacoma already has synthetic transmission fluid from the factory. Which is why they charge a small fortune to replace it !!!!!
It also has a transmission cooler the size of a mans open wallet.
We have been pricing various coolers and one that Etrailer sells seems to be the best option its a plate and fin type measuring 11W x 8-3/4T x 7/8D Inch.

The Tacomas warning light is designed to go off at 300 degrees, which will cook the fluid. Lots of Tacoma users tow and have no clue how hot it might be getting. We can monitor both the pan and torque converter and torque converter locking so we get a early warning.
We also have a oil/water heat exchanger which seems to do a decent job, the oil stayed near the radiators temperature which never went over 199 degrees.
When we were hitting the high temperature we were in stop and go slow traffic going up a steep hill. Pretty much the worse condition you can experience. I ended up dropping to second and third while moving along at 15 to 20 mph. We did climb to 215 on other climbs where I could maintain speed so we figure a larger cooler is needed.

When we were towing with our 4Runner, I added a passive t-cooler like you mentioned. The install was not too hard, but if I had it to do over again, I'd consider a fan powered unit, since my eyes were glued to the ScanGauge to watch tranny temps, even with the passive cooler. I'm confident it helped some, but it still wasn't what I'd call relaxing.

[steve dunham]

My transmission temps run around 190 F to 195 F under normal driving conditions , 205 F to 220 F when towing and up to 240 F when towing up a long grade or in stop and go traffic .
The temps are correct and safe according to the vehicle and the transmission manufacturer .
I have the factory transmission cooler and a 5 year warranty / 100,000 mile drivetrain warranty
I am not an automotive engineer and Ram tells me that the newer transmissions are designed to run warmer than previous versions and the synthetic fluids are designed to take the heater
My truck purposely is designed to bring the transmission fluid up to 190 F as quickly as possible so it shifts properly in cold weather .

Why would I add a aftermarket transmission cooler to compete with / defeat the factory engineered design because I have decided that the temps are wrong or too high ?

Throwing parts at an imagined problem makes no sense to me. !

[Sean Murry]

When towing a trailer, a few factors have to be considered when choosing a tow vehicle:
-Towing capacity
-Payload capacity
-GVWR Which is simply the curb weight of the vehicle plus your payload, including driver, passenger, tongue weight, canopy, hitch weight and any gear
-GCWR, Which is the total weight of the loaded truck and the weight of the loaded trailer.
In the case of a Nissan Frontier SV Crew Cab, the towing capacity is 6100 lbs, payload is 1220 lbs, GVWR is 5,809 lbs and the GCWR is 11,230 lbs
In the case of the Honda Ridgeline, the towing capacity is 5,000 lbs, payload is 1,518 lbs GVWR is 6006 lbs and the GCWR is 9755 lbs (Though Honda reduces this by 2% for every 1,000 ft of elevation gain) So at 5,000 ft of elevation the GCWR is only 8,779 lbs

When I look at towing a loaded Escape 19 weight 4,000 lbs (tongue weight 400 lbs), two people in the truck weighing 300 lbs total, a canopy weighing 200 lbs, hitch weighing 100 lbs, dog weighing 75 lbs, couple of kayaks weighing 100 lbs, I quickly run out of payload capacity on the Frontier, but have room to spare on the Ridgeline. But when it comes to GCWR I have room to spare on the Frontier, and run out of room on the Ridgeline.

[thoer]

Sean - good points.

GCWR and GVWR are the numbers anyone should use for calculations before buying a tow and/or trailer. Added to that is to decide how much stuff you actually plan to bring along and how much you plan to have in all your fresh and waste water tanks while traveling.

Based on the fairly minimalist loading Mary and I do, our Highlander numbers all work out with our 21. For others who like to take more stuff along, travel with full or partly full tanks, a Highlander could easily run out of capacity with even a 19. I am fine with slowing down significantly on steep mountain grades, and since we live in the Midwest, our Highlander will spend far less that 1% of its time on those grades and most of its time on relatively flat ground. Other folks live in mountainous areas and some don't want to have to slow down at all going up steep grades.

Running all the calculation using GCWR and GVWR is essential along with an honest appraisal of how much stuff you plan to put into the trailer and tow. What works for one person, might not work for another. As Donna says: YMMV

[float5]

I can see now that you are actually looking at the GCWR (up above you had GCVW so I was trying to figure out to which number you were referring!). You see what a difference it makes to consider the GCWR which many of us have tried to point out to those considering tow vehicles.

Eric is a long-time tow-er and Mary is light ---hehe--- and he does not have to worry about loading nearly as much as most others do with their much heavier cargoes. A Highlander may not work, or a Ridgeline, for many (also depending upon the model) because of the GCWR. You are exactly right to see that. Too bad more people do not look at those numbers. Those are the ones everyone should be considering for their Escape.

Originally Posted by Sean Murry

When towing a trailer, a few factors have to be considered when choosing a tow vehicle:
-Towing capacity
-Payload capacity
-GVWR Which is simply the curb weight of the vehicle plus your payload, including driver, passenger, tongue weight, canopy, hitch weight and any gear
-GCWR, Which is the total weight of the loaded truck and the weight of the loaded trailer.
In the case of a Nissan Frontier SV Crew Cab, the towing capacity is 6100 lbs, payload is 1220 lbs, GVWR is 5,809 lbs and the GCWR is 11,230 lbs
In the case of the Honda Ridgeline, the towing capacity is 5,000 lbs, payload is 1,518 lbs GVWR is 6006 lbs and the GCWR is 9755 lbs (Though Honda reduces this by 2% for every 1,000 ft of elevation gain) So at 5,000 ft of elevation the GCWR is only 8,779 lbs

When I look at towing a loaded Escape 19 weight 4,000 lbs (tongue weight 400 lbs), two people in the truck weighing 300 lbs total, a canopy weighing 200 lbs, hitch weighing 100 lbs, dog weighing 75 lbs, couple of kayaks weighing 100 lbs, I quickly run out of payload capacity on the Frontier, but have room to spare on the Ridgeline. But when it comes to GCWR I have room to spare on the Frontier, and run out of room on the Ridgeline.

[Sean Murry]

Sorry Float 5, my fat fingers were hitting the wrong keys.
It does worry me when I see people who are looking at tow vehicles and only look at towing capacity. The number that usually comes up short is either the payload or the GCWR.
For me, I do mostly boondocking, so taking fully loaded fresh water tanks is important, therefore the trailer will be on the heavy side. Gotta keep personal weight down too, or someone will be left home.
I don't want to go full size on a truck, but the GMC Canyon, Chevy Colorado are looking good, at least from a towing capacity, payload and GCWR. Hopefully their quality will live up to the Toyota and Nissan

[Sean Murry]

I am also concerned how little the sales people know at car dealerships. I was recently at a dealership looking at a mid size truck and asked the sales person what the payload capacity was. He looked at me like I had two heads. He had absolutely no clue, let alone what the GCWR was. So bottom line it is up to the consumer to do his or her research and put the numbers together. Some website don't list the GCWR but the vehicles owners manual do, so looking up each vehicles owners manual on the web is a worthy exercise.

[float5]

Originally Posted by Sean Murry

I am also concerned how little the sales people know at car dealerships. I was recently at a dealership looking at a mid size truck and asked the sales person what the payload capacity was. He looked at me like I had two heads. He had absolutely no clue, let alone what the GCWR was. So bottom line it is up to the consumer to do his or her research and put the numbers together. Some website don't list the GCWR but the vehicles owners manual do, so looking up each vehicles owners manual on the web is a worthy exercise.

Sales people. Hahahahehehhohoho. I remember one telling me that I could just tow well past the towing capacity, no problem. Yes, you have to look up the numbers because they would have no idea. Of course, they cannot know what load you are towing or your trailer's requirements. Have to figure it out yourself. They will sell you anything and assure you that you can tow whatever.

[Iowa Dave]

Salespeople are just like all other occupations. Some know what they are doing and some do not. When I was selling and did not know the answer I made a concerted effort to find the information the potential customer wanted. I then got back to him or her and used my excellent presentation skills and charming personality to guide the person to the purchase. Sometimes it worked sometimes not. That's life, that's what all the people say, You're riding high in April, Shot down in May. Consider the fact that salesmen often sell to other salesmen. Mull that over. If you are not personally well informed or intelligent enough to research the answers for yourself you must at least realize that SOME people will lie to you. Highlanders will tow and a hell of a lot more than a 13 ft trailer. And Safely. If you know what you are doing.
Dave

[Wardb]

Does anyone know if the tail gate of 2018 4 door 4x4 Tacoma goes all the way down when foot escape?

[AKCamper]

Originally Posted by Wardb

Does anyone know if the tail gate of 2018 4 door 4x4 Tacoma goes all the way down when foot escape?

Could you reword that. I have a 2016 4 door Tacoma same body style. What do you mean all the way down?

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by Wardb

Does anyone know if the tail gate of 2018 4 door 4x4 Tacoma goes all the way down when foot escape?

I had no trouble opening the tailgate on my 2008 Tacoma 4x4 with an appropriately long enough towbar with either my Casita 16 or my Escape 21. With my F250 SuperDuty, which has an enormous tailgate, I needed a longer towbar

[steve dunham]

Remember when you extend your hitch you lower your allowable tongue weight
I have a 12” hitch extension that according to the extension hitch label lowers your tongue weight limit by 50% . ( Lever / fulcrum)
An Escape 21 has an average tongue weight of 500 lbs
I can not lower my tailgate with a standard stinger but I can utilizing a WDH
A WDH may be something to consider especially when towing with a small pickup truck ?

[salmo7000]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

Remember when you extend your hitch you lower your allowable tongue weight
I have a 12” hitch extension that according to the extension hitch label lowers your tongue weight limit by 50% . ( Lever / fulcrum)
An Escape 21 has an average tongue weight of 500 lbs
I can not lower my tailgate with a standard stinger but I can utilizing a WDH
A WDH may be something to consider especially when towing with a small pickup truck ?

The tailgate on my Colorado clears the electric jack on my 19 by a hair, and only when the truck and trailer are absolutely straight. Any angle at all and it does not. I have the WDH installed by Escape; a regular stinger would put me out of business. So I agree, this is another good reason to have a WDH. Tailgate clearance was not something I ever considered when I decided on the electric jack, so it was an eye opener and an unanticipated variable we've had to manage. That said, it's been manageable, and the electric jack makes life easier. I'd say it's worth the trouble.

[AKCamper]

Originally Posted by Wardb

Does anyone know if the tail gate of 2018 4 door 4x4 Tacoma goes all the way down when foot escape?

If you mean does the tailgate open when hooked up, we have a weight distribution hitch and when the jack handle is in the right position I can open our tailgate,

[rjreeves]

I tow my 2019 21' with a 2017 Tacoma, using the Fastway E2 8K WD hitch. It tows easy peasy. The caveats are: the 21' is wider than the 19' which might be an issue for you as the available aftermarket tow mirrors for Tacoma are slim pickings. The optional rear view camera helps some. "Objects in camera are WAAY closer than they appear"... Also, I tried to keep my build's weight down, i.e. no AC, no rooftop solar, no awning, no tongue toolbox. I try not to load anything behind the rear axle in the truck, I carry the beer in the backseat of the truck, not in the trailer, etc etc. You could travel with an empty H2O tank (I don't) and the like. Just be weight conscious as you are using a significant percentage of your TV's capacity and you'll be fine. IMHO.