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Old 07-09-2016, 03:34 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbryan4 View Post
Pat, GVWR is the maximum weight of the trailer with all cargo. Your 19 can weigh (with trailer plus all contents) up to 4008 lbs. The shipping weight is the same as dry weight - 2525lbs. The dry weight is your starting point. So, 2525 lbs plus all options will give you your actual dry weight. The difference between your actual dry weight and your GVWR is your cargo capacity. Yes, the weight of the water in your tanks is part of the cargo. Your axle rating has nothing to do with calculating these numbers, although it is one part of the equation the factory uses to determine GVWR. It just means each axle can support up to 2500 lbs.
Thanks Robert . I forgot I did add 3 reenforced walls too to build too. So they list my CC at 336 kg which comes to 740 lb.So I need to watch that figure for everything I add . I think we are ok though coming from a camper already elimated stuff . We put stuff in bed of truck not trailer anyway ice chest , chairs , rugs , etc . Pat
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Old 07-09-2016, 03:34 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patandlinda View Post
Took a look at our 2013 19 ft trailer . We have AC, front box, dual batteries , microwave , foam , extra insulation and Windows , oven . Sticker says GVWR 1818 kg =4008 lb . 1145 kg shipping weight =2525 lb . 336kg CC =740 lb . Waste tanks 204 kg =450 lb . Water heater 27 kg =60 lb . Fresh water at 90kg = 199 lb . Our axles are 2500lb each .At this time not worried with Ford which can tow 8600 lb . We have a class 3 hitch at 5000lb. I am guessing the figures on tanks are filled ? My difference in weight carrying capacity is my options is subtracting from GVWR ? I want to learn too even though I think I have plenty of wiggle room . Pat
Pat, no, no worries with 8600 tow capacity!
I am supposing that anyone would empty the fresh to have the others full, or half empty the fresh to have the others half full, but someone might just fill the fresh in some odd case and not empty the tanks.

On the GCWR, just to give an example for others:

If the towing capacity for the vehicle is 5000
And total weight allowed for the loaded vehicle is 6300
Then, if the manufacturer says that the GCWR is 11,300, FINE. No problem.

If the GCWR given is less than what the other two add up to, then you may have to subtract some of the weight you put in the vehicle from your towing capacity. That is often the case with passenger vehicles so that the towing capacity is less than what they have told you. Eric is giving his situation above.
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Old 07-09-2016, 03:38 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thoer View Post
Doesn't the shipping weight posted on the trailer include the specific options on that trailer?

I asked Tammy how to determine the exact weight of our 17B and she said to use the sheet of paper glued in the cabinet. To take the GVWR and subtract the CC (cargo carrying capacity) and that is the dry weight of our trailer with all options.

So for ours 1590kg - 441kg = 1149 kg or about 2533# which seems to agree with weighing we have done
Makes sense to me Eric, but I've seen too many placards with the exact same number, even though the trailers had quite a variance in options. So, I err on the side of caution.

If you want accuracy, to me there's no substitute for getting the trailer weighed on a certified scale - both empty and loaded.
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Old 07-09-2016, 03:44 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by Rossue View Post
Hi Jeff(freespirit)- I knew you meant discrepancy and it is not hard to see why some are confused(then disappointed) when looking at ETI's website and see the 19 listed at 2600 lbs. dry weight. To get to 3740# with a few options probably wouldn't occur to many and points out the need for an updating to their website pointing out the new dry weight for the Gen2 model.

Yes, they do weigh the trailers when completed.
I agree Rossue other companies do this for example, following an inquiry to Lance, we received a quote as well as an itemized options list with the price and weight of each option. Something closer to this level of communication would certain reduce the chance of confusion and disappointment. The reality is, on reading the ETI weight estimate we reconsidered several other trailers but still came to the conclusion that an Escape 19 is the right trailer for us.

We also concluded that we like the new insulated windows including bath and kitchen, added spray foam insulation, new medicine cabinet, new awning, 6 cu ft fridge, exterior shower, dual 6 volt batteries,surge protector, 2 captains reading lamps, LED awning light strip, air conditioner, 7500 k max fan, extra door at the end of the bench, extra drawer under the wardrobe, storage box, and reinforced walls.

So we will have to get a tow vehicle with a tow rating of more than 5000lbs. Just would have made planning a bit more realistic if more information on weights was available. Perhaps this will come as ETI gains more experience with the Gen 2s.

Now to research diesel and body on frame SUVs, that should be fun
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Old 07-09-2016, 03:59 PM   #125
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Perhaps we should all read this sticky in trying to understand what all is being mentioned here
Understanding RV weight terms
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Old 07-09-2016, 04:12 PM   #126
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Dry weight

The definition in the linked sticky topic of "dry weight" assumes base equipment. That's not literally the meaning of "dry weight" (which simply means without fluids), but the dry weights published on the Escape website are indeed for
  • dry condition (no fluids in the tanks),
  • base/standard equipment (no options or accessories), and
  • empty (none of your stuff)
I suggest being explicit: use dry or wet, base or as-equipped, and empty or loaded with cargo - that's three bits of information to make any weight value meaningful.
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Old 07-09-2016, 04:13 PM   #127
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New-style / 2nd Generation / 2017 17B weight

Quote:
Originally Posted by skyfree View Post
Got it from Escape today for the 17B: Dry 2400, which would make Wet (20+6 gallons) 2660 lbs. This is an increase of 230 lbs. over the classic.

New GVWR is 4,000 lbs though
...
We typically travel pretty light so I will be rolling with probably right around 3,400 lbs which is less than 1/2 the towing capacity of our Touareg TDI.
Is the Gross Axle Weight Rating (GAWR) still 3500 pounds? If so, then to load the trailer up to a gross weight of 4000 pounds, at least 500 pounds of that must be carried by the hitch (tongue weight). That's 12.5%, which is reasonable, but this would a rare case of lower tongue weight causing an overloading problem - of the trailer's axle/suspension.

This not a concern with a total weight of 3400 pounds, but if the axle rating hasn't been raised it will be a factor to consider for anyone pushing close to the new GVWR of the 17B.
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Old 07-09-2016, 04:19 PM   #128
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That's a very good point Brian. If the GVWR went up, it stands to reason that the axle rating should have gone up as well. Hmmm.
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Old 07-09-2016, 04:26 PM   #129
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So, I’m puzzled.

For simplicity, I’m going to use the 19 Gen 1 specs, which state the following (weight without options).

Dry Hitch Weight – 256 lbs
Dry Axle Weight – 2354 lbs
Total Dry Weight – 2610 lbs

Where I’m confused is that I’ve heard the hitch weight (256) is applied to the vehicles payload weight. If the payload max were 1000 lbs, then one would have 744 lbs left for people, stuff, etc. in the vehicle (1000 – 256). If this were true, would only the dry axle weight be applied to the vehicles towing capacity (2354 and not 2610)?
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Old 07-09-2016, 04:26 PM   #130
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The limit with a value of 9828 pounds is Gross Combined Weight Rating or GCWR, but other than that small notational tweak I agree with Eric - this is an excellent explanation of the issue which many people ignore when considering ratings and trailer weight:
Quote:
Originally Posted by thoer View Post
The number that is easy to overlook (and sometimes hard to find) is the GCVW gross combined vehicle weight, or the grand total of vehicle and trailer both fully loaded. For example our 2016 Highlander has a GCVW of 9828#. The curb weight of the Highlander is 4464#, leaving 5364# capacity for trailer, us, everything loaded into the Highlander and trailer, and all cargo, fresh water and waste tanks. So, while the Highlander is rated at 5000# towing, if you towed a trailer at that weight, the occupants plus anything in the Highlander could not be more than 364#. That would leave this overweight guy plus Mary with about a change of clothes.
This varies greatly by vehicle, which is why you need to dig for the relevant data, as Eric has. Some think I was crazy for discussing towing a 19' with our Sienna - which has a 3500 pound max trailer weight rating - but in my case a 3500 pound trailer still leaves over a thousand pounds for people and cargo. Of course the weight increase kills the idea of towing a new style 19' with the Sienna.
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