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Old 12-02-2019, 05:58 PM   #161
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
and Bigfoot....
Bigfoots as you know are a much boxer design and historical very HEAVY on the tongue making them IMO a poor choose for layout or weight comparison.....
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:03 PM   #162
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The only layout I reasonably like in a currently built Airstream is the Eddie Bauer model. Other than the fact it's too long, too wide and too heavy and I don't care for the rear opening door... it's perfect.
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:16 PM   #163
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The only layout I reasonably like in a currently built Airstream is the Eddie Bauer model. Other than the fact it's too long, too wide and too heavy and I don't care for the rear opening door... it's perfect.
Pretty sure they stopped doing the Eddie Bauer model a few years ago. The current Flying Cloud and International 25’ ‘s are pretty well the same layout without the lift up back end though. Agree both are to big for me as well. And for sure bigger than what Escape has planned ...... or at least for now. LOL
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Old 12-02-2019, 06:27 PM   #164
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I think we may be forgetting that a lot of us are here as a result of owning prior fiberglass trailers, such as Scamp/Casita/Burro/Trilliums/Eggcamper where the interior/exterior were very small, light, very little free space and relatively less expensive than Airstreams. There are smaller molded units and bigger molded units out there, Oliver and Bigfoot are two and they fill a niche that Escape does not, just as Escape fills a niche that the smaller units do not. Both are bigger and heavier and more expensive molded trailers. Trying to build an Escape to emulate an Airstream, or Bigfoot just seems counter intuitive...just my thoughts... Does Escape want to compete with them?
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Old 12-02-2019, 08:07 PM   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I think we may be forgetting that a lot of us are here as a result of owning prior fiberglass trailers, such as Scamp/Casita/Burro/Trilliums/Eggcamper where the interior/exterior were very small, light, very little free space and relatively less expensive than Airstreams.
I think you're right. Our Scamp 13 was "small", our 19 was "medium small" and the 21 "large small" but that's the way we think of them. Our #1 priority is a relatively small lightweight trailer and to our way of thinking we're now at the upper limit of that spectrum. I'll follow the developments for larger trailers with interest but without any thought of going larger than I am now.

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Old 12-02-2019, 09:16 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I think we may be forgetting that a lot of us are here as a result of owning prior fiberglass trailers, such as Scamp/Casita/Burro/Trilliums/Eggcamper where the interior/exterior were very small, light, very little free space and relatively less expensive than Airstreams. There are smaller molded units and bigger molded units out there, Oliver and Bigfoot are two and they fill a niche that Escape does not, just as Escape fills a niche that the smaller units do not. Both are bigger and heavier and more expensive molded trailers. Trying to build an Escape to emulate an Airstream, or Bigfoot just seems counter intuitive...just my thoughts... Does Escape want to compete with them?
I haven't forgotten! I am someone who has been around since the first Escape was turned out of the back yard and camped beside it and pretty well every other model of Escape that has been made since. I can also still remember what brand and size of fiberglass trailer many members here had prior to owing their Escape. ;-)

I can also remember sitting in a campground and discussing with Tammy the issues they may be creating for the lovers of real small trailers by making the Escape just a little wider - just before they actually did it! LOL

I also do not believe that Escape is going to attempt to emulate an Airstream or a Bigfoot with their new 23' x 8' wide trailer! I sure hope not as I would stick with what I have if that's the case. But there is no reason they can not turn out with a wee bit more room a more comfortable/functional layout for those who are wanting their trailers a bit larger.

Yes there is Bigfoot but I think we can agree they are less than aerodynamic and one HEAVY trailer! And in regards to them holding the bigger trailer nich goes they always have made a 17' and were making a 20' that's now a 21' trailer, so Escape long ago decided to go into the same length market, but by building a lighter less expensive version and not attempting to emulate them. Can not see it being any different with Escapes new 23'.

There is also as you say Oliver, which some might suggest has in someways attempted to emulate Airstream at least in regards to interior finish quality. But again the narrow trailer presents layout restraints for those looking for or a bit more storage &/or comforts. In regards to the bigger trailer market nich goes, again Escape is already in the same size market as Oliver as they also make a 19'. And If I am not mistaken they were also making a 17' at the same time Escape started making them!

Adding 3" of width to either side of the current 21' trailer is not as some suggest going to have much in any impact on where the majority of folks here take their current trailers. I like to camp off grid in well treed locations and I know that having an 8' wide trailer has never impacted my ability to go where my much narrower 6' 8" wide trailer went! But going from a 16' to a 23' did! LOL As did the extra height, but you learn to watch for low slung tree branches fairly quickly!

Bottom line is Escape has not said they are going to make all their line up wider. Those folks who love the smaller and narrower trailer still have that option. Its the buyers who are looking for a slightly bigger more comfortable trailer that Escape is hoping to attract.

Jim, you may not like the idea, but Escape IS going to make a bigger wider trailer and I assure you there are folks such as myself who are REALLY happy to hear it. And I am pretty darn sure there are other fiberglass trailer owners who are as well, even some who already own an Escape! So would it be Escape number 4 or 5 for you sorry I have lost count over the years.

My only hope is they do not take to many of their design/layout ideas from folks who claim to not want or need a bigger trailer!
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Old 12-02-2019, 09:26 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by Ron in BC View Post
we're now at the upper limit of that spectrum. I'll follow the developments for larger trailers with interest but without any thought of going larger than I am now.

Ron
LOL Ron that's what you say now, but wait until your wife sees the larger bathroom, closets and more kitchen pantry space! Perhaps even an easier bed to make!
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Old 12-02-2019, 10:18 PM   #168
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Right On Fiberglass Fan! Most folks resist change yet from all I've seen so far, the new team at ETI is delivering!
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Old 12-02-2019, 10:26 PM   #169
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I'd love to bet on that one. After more than 30 years of owning cruising sailboats that may be much longer but actually in some ways have less space we know what we want. We cook and eat the majority of our meals in the trailer. The longer kitchen counter and the larger fridge in the 21 and the minor cost to upgrade made it worthwhile. My wife's happy, I could happily live with the 19, chances of going larger are nil.

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Old 12-02-2019, 10:50 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Fiberglass Fan View Post
The Flying Could is not the smallest it is basically the trim level and the start of the dual axle models
I was just saying that the 23' is the smallest of the Flying Clouds, so people could find the plan and specs.
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:09 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by Fiberglass Fan View Post
As Escape is planning on introducing a new longer and wider trailer that some of us have been waiting for years for them to do.

It might be nice to throw up some floor plan ideas that work on a 23’ long and 8’ wide trailer they are proposing......trust me when I say not every one is a big fan of bathrooms beside beds and or of them being in the middle of the trailer or having to give up hanging clothes closet to get added pantry/kitchen storage. ;-)
What is the issue with the bathroom being next to the bed ?
We spend most of our day outside and having the bathroom near the entry door in our 21 is handy plus stops a lot of dirt from being dragged through the trailer
The bathroom has to go someplace - near the kitchen ?
near the dining area ?

We like the floor plan of our Escape 21 but a dual closets
( shelved / hanging clothes ) would be nice . Escape has it’s weaknesses / faults but floor plans isn”t one of them
IMHO . No one can put 10 lbs of S__T in a 5 lb. bag and please everyone .

For us there is a lot to like about the Bigfoot and the constant chant that it’s heavy doesn’t hold much weight with us . Light weight isn’t always a desirable attribute .
Look at the so called “ Light Weight “ stick built trailers .
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Old 12-03-2019, 11:59 AM   #172
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larger size?

What's all this talk of going larger?
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Old 12-03-2019, 02:03 PM   #173
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What is the issue with the bathroom being next to the bed ?
We spend most of our day outside and having the bathroom near the entry door in our 21 is handy plus stops a lot of dirt from being dragged through the trailer
The bathroom has to go someplace - near the kitchen ?
near the dining area ?

We like the floor plan of our Escape 21 but a dual closets
( shelved / hanging clothes ) would be nice . Escape has it’s weaknesses / faults but floor plans isn”t one of them
IMHO . No one can put 10 lbs of S__T in a 5 lb. bag and please everyone .

For us there is a lot to like about the Bigfoot and the constant chant that it’s heavy doesn’t hold much weight with us . Light weight isn’t always a desirable attribute .
Look at the so called “ Light Weight “ stick built trailers .
Steve you have made some excellent points and confirm my point that one glove does not fit all! Which is why if Escape wants to continue to grow they can not remain static in regards to what they offer simple because those who currently own one like them just the way they are.

Re bathroom by the bed, again it’s just a personal preference that my sleep not be interrupted by the sounds of someone using the bathroom right beside my head ;-)

I also like Bigfoots as well but they do tend to be pretty heavy on the tongue once you get into the 20’ and larger trailers with some coming in at 1000lbs which compared to Escapes or those other round top shiny trailers of same size, the Bigfoot is the heavy weight. As a result a tow vehicle upgrade may also be needed by many to accommodate that.

In fact if anyone happens to have a 17’ Bigfoot of newer vintage they would like to part with asp please let me know.. Been looking hard for one to use this winter while waiting on Escape to produce a 23”. :-) Would also be equally happy to find a 2 or 3 year old Escape 21’ in the BC/Alberta area asap.
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Old 12-03-2019, 02:12 PM   #174
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Would also be equally happy to find a 2 or 3 year old Escape 22’ in the BC/Alberta area asap.
Are you referring to the E21, please keep the numbers relevant. As far as one glove fitting all or stagnant, I find Airstreams to be that way and yet they remain to be popular. Try asking airstream to move a wall or add an outlet or even delete air conditioning, you will not get too far. They seem to believe in the old WYSIWYG adage, what you see is what you get, no changes.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:10 PM   #175
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Would also be equally happy to find a 2 or 3 year old Escape 22’ in the BC/Alberta area asap.
Are you referring to the E21, please keep the numbers relevant. As far as one glove fitting all or stagnant, I find Airstreams to be that way and yet they remain to be popular. Try asking airstream to move a wall or add an outlet or even delete air conditioning, you will not get too far. They seem to believe in the old WYSIWYG adage, what you see is what you get, no changes.
Thanks Jim miss type should have stated read 21', will correct.

As previously stated the discussion is not about Airstream! The layouts and specs of 23' Airstream was originally posted to show that:

A) the weight some where suggesting the new 23' Escape might weigh was probable being over stated. As you correctly point out Airstream does not normally turn out any dual axle 23' without heavy items such as AC, Ovens, dry bath, etc as stock, yet its weight is not what was suggested the new 23' Escape will be.

B) It shows what an addition 6" of width to a trailer can result in a number of different layouts including the option of a walk around bed that some might actually like. ;-0
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:19 PM   #176
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I will issue a guarantee.
No matter what the layout that ETI comes up with for the new 23/25 some people will like it, and some people will not like it.
As in any company, sales will determine which group will prevail.
Now, we just need to see it, can't wait.
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:09 PM   #177
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21 layout

We solved the "storage" issue, for us, by adding a big "wardrobe size" cabinet above where that 2 drawer cabinet usually is and having ETI puit shelves in both wardrobe cabinets..we use totes 95% for clothes storage, and do not hang stuff while camping..works for us. The occasional coat maybe, but that can go into the truck or onto the umbra hooks we are adding. Pix of entire setup on another thread
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:07 AM   #178
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We did the same thing on our 21 Holly love the extra storage
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:48 AM   #179
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We have the same basic cabinet layout with shelves in both upper cabinets
Yes ; we did gain some storage space but we still have no cabinet space to hang clothes
We installed some 3M Command hooks which do work for hanging clothes but also add to the cluttered / unkempt look and the hanging clothes are constantly in our way .
Hope the new 23 has both types of storage .




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Old 12-04-2019, 10:27 AM   #180
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I will issue a guarantee.
No matter what the layout that ETI comes up with for the new 23/25 some people will like it, and some people will not like it.
As in any company, sales will determine which group will prevail.
Now, we just need to see it, can't wait.
Exactly.

“You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time”.

John Lyngate. Later adapted by Abe Lincoln.
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