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Old 07-23-2018, 04:49 PM   #1
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We've owned our escape 21 for a while, 5 trips. I'm several weeks into another rotator cuff surgery, due to this getting in and out of bed in our camper is painful just to be kind. We are thinking of going to an Oliver with twin beds, we had rather sleep together or our other pick a Bigfoot with the walk around bed in the rear, please don't throw stones.

I'm asking if anyone on this forum has any negative things to say about these campers. Don't misunderstand there isn't anything about the Escape that has disappointed us aside from my physical issues.
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Old 07-23-2018, 05:06 PM   #2
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We've owned our escape 21 for a while, 5 trips. I'm several weeks into another rotator cuff surgery, due to this getting in and out of bed in our camper is painful just to be kind. We are thinking of going to an Oliver with twin beds, we had rather sleep together or our other pick a Bigfoot with the walk around bed in the rear, please don't throw stones.

I'm asking if anyone on this forum has any negative things to say about these campers. Don't misunderstand there isn't anything about the Escape that has disappointed us aside from my physical issues.
I know what that pain is about . Last December completely torn my rotator cuff from the bone . I declined surgery though . I did do PT though which has strengthened the other muscles in the shoulder . But I will have to do for rest of my life . I haven't had a good nights sleep since last Dec. At home changed out the bed to adjustable it helps to be able to get head up . Pain is getting better as long as I keep up the exercises . I don't baby my arm but no lifting anymore .
Both your choices would be great and I understand why . In trailer we sleep on mostly a very soft latex bed . Me lots of pillows , can't sleep flat anymore , need head up . I also need to be at side to get out , no scouting out for me . Hope you can find something to work and can get some relief. Pat
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Old 07-23-2018, 05:08 PM   #3
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Olivers are very heavy, maybe another 1000# plus over the Escape....
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Old 07-23-2018, 05:43 PM   #4
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We has been looking at the Froli sleep system after people started discussing the need for ventilation under the mattress. When you mentioned keeping your head up, I remembered this adjustable headrest that looks like it can be added without the full sleep system. Just a thought!

https://froli-systems.myshopify.com/...able-head-rest
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Old 07-23-2018, 05:49 PM   #5
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What we didn't like about the Oliver (we did like a lot) was the length, weight and bed layout. If those three items don't bother you I would not try to talk you out of making the jump to an Oliver.
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Old 07-23-2018, 06:04 PM   #6
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those Olivers are nice.. problem is they are heavy and they cost a lot..
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Old 07-23-2018, 06:34 PM   #7
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We has been looking at the Froli sleep system after people started discussing the need for ventilation under the mattress. When you mentioned keeping your head up, I remembered this adjustable headrest that looks like it can be added without the full sleep system. Just a thought!

https://froli-systems.myshopify.com/...able-head-rest
That's pretty cool . There is a lot more though . One for me I am not a back sleeper but I have too a lot of the time . Sleeping on either side because of the rotator cuff . Getting your head up helps with shoulder I guess staying in the socket it is supposed to be in and then less pain . PT and time is helping a little . You learn to make adjustments along the way too. I totally understand his dilemma. Truthfully like both his choices . If our bed doesn't work any longer , We would be going that route too. Pat
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Old 07-23-2018, 06:34 PM   #8
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I don't particularly care for the Oliver. It has some nice features, but overall it's not the trailer for me. IF sleeping separately is okay, why not make up the dinette into a bed? Yes it may be a PITA to convert back to a dinette on a daily basis, but maybe that's not needed every day. But it sure would save you a bunch of $$$ because you're changing trailer brands.


I have the u-shape dinette (with filler board and extra cushion), the back portion of the dinette is a twin bed size and I've taken some marvelous sleeps back there.
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Old 07-23-2018, 06:54 PM   #9
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What about a re configuration of a 21? By putting a 19 kitchen in a 21, and moving fridge and wardrobe up by eliminating the drawer cabinet, there should be room to put two single beds in the back. A dinette can be placed where the bed is.
Maybe worth asking Reace? There are more people that might be interested in an option like this.
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Old 07-23-2018, 07:56 PM   #10
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A friend moved from a Casita to a Bigfoot and she was very happy. If you do make the switch please report back.
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Old 07-23-2018, 08:19 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Snuffy2 View Post
We've owned our escape 21 for a while, 5 trips. I'm several weeks into another rotator cuff surgery, due to this getting in and out of bed in our camper is painful just to be kind. We are thinking of going to an Oliver with twin beds, we had rather sleep together or our other pick a Bigfoot with the walk around bed in the rear, please don't throw stones.

I'm asking if anyone on this forum has any negative things to say about these campers. Don't misunderstand there isn't anything about the Escape that has disappointed us aside from my physical issues.
Nobody is going to throw stones. Folks have every right to choose what they feel works best.

I am one who would never go to an Oliver, while a great built trailer, the looks and layout do not work for us.

Now a Bigfoot would, and has been, a consideration. Another quality built trailer. I like both the 25B25RQ (rear queen) and the 25B25RT (rear twin). I favour the rear twin which has more storage space, and two 36x80 beds, so full sized twin mattresses. These trailers are near 5,000 lbs dry, so you do need a bigger tow vehicle, but a F-150 would work fine.

25B25RQ.JPG

25B25RT.JPG
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Old 07-23-2018, 08:40 PM   #12
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Weight and $ are the main things to me, the 21 being 3200 base, the Oliver 4600, and the Bigfoot 5600. Both of your options are about double the 21, $ wise. If you don't have one already, you'll be needing a full size TV for the BF, maybe a 3/4 ton. Between it's extra weight and extra foot of width, you might consider a diesel. From what I've seen they are both very nice trailers, nicer then the 21, if you don't mind the above.

I know the Olivers are first rate, haven't looked at the BF since they went out of business during the recession. Being completely different, go look them over and see which style you prefer. That dry bath would sure be nice.
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Old 07-23-2018, 08:54 PM   #13
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Weight and $ are the main things to me, the 21 being 3200 base, the Oliver 4600, and the Bigfoot 5600. Both of your options are about double the 21, $ wise. If you don't have one already, you'll be needing a full size TV for the BF, maybe a 3/4 ton. Between it's extra weight and extra foot of width, you might consider a diesel. From what I've seen they are both very nice trailers, nicer then the 21, if you don't mind the above.
Bob, the dry weight of the biggest Bigfoot is listed at just under 5,000 lbs. I regularly tow at least 8,000 lbs and sometimes up to 10,000 lbs with my 3.4 litre EcoBoost with no problem. At Quartzsite there were a few F150s towing the Bigfoots.

A new loaded price for the 25' Bigfoot trailers is around $68-73k CAD. Not cheap, but in my opinion if it is what you want, it is not a bad price. I had strongly considered one and still think about it, but it was not cost, it was weight and size that made me go the way of the 5.0TA.
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Old 07-23-2018, 09:02 PM   #14
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Have you tried a wedge pillow to help you sleep with your head up? They are about $20 at WM.? It helps people with Gerd too.
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Old 07-23-2018, 11:37 PM   #15
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If it matters to you, note that the Bigfoot so-called "rear queen" isn't a true queen bed. It's only 74" (6' 2") from head to foot, not 80" (6' 8"). Didn't Lil' Snoozy offer a twin bed option early on in production? I don't think they do anymore.
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Old 07-24-2018, 01:10 AM   #16
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Quick bed making

I installed a Springfield gas operated table pedestal in my 19 ft Escape...it honestly took 10 seconds to lower the table into a cushion ready bed platform.10 seconds to make it back into a table as the gas lifts it back up. The bed is at the opposite end so if you partner snores the distance is preferable to twin beds...of course, I did it mainly for grandkid visits but it made bed making EASY. Just a thought.
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Old 07-24-2018, 02:10 AM   #17
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Just completed our Build Sheet for A 19’ Reverse Floorplan with a Double bed in front plus a U-Shaped dinette in back that converts to another Double bed ~ for the very same reasons. BTW - We are former owners of a Oliver Twin bed model, and looking forward to our Escape build.
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Old 07-24-2018, 03:05 AM   #18
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Just completed our Build Sheet for A 19’ Reverse Floorplan with a Double bed in front plus a U-Shaped dinette in back that converts to another Double bed ~ for the very same reasons. BTW - We are former owners of a Oliver Twin bed model, and looking forward to our Escape build.
Very interesting, a convert from the subject of the convert......Perhaps the newcomer would elaborate the reasons for the switch (trailers, not beds)
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Old 07-24-2018, 06:43 AM   #19
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Bob, the dry weight of the biggest Bigfoot is listed at just under 5,000 lbs. I regularly tow at least 8,000 lbs and sometimes up to 10,000 lbs with my 3.4 litre EcoBoost with no problem. At Quartzsite there were a few F150s towing the Bigfoots.

A new loaded price for the 25' Bigfoot trailers is around $68-73k CAD. Not cheap, but in my opinion if it is what you want, it is not a bad price. I had strongly considered one and still think about it, but it was not cost, it was weight and size that made me go the way of the 5.0TA.
I got the weight off the Bigfoot site, didn't see specs for the twin bed unit. I used the front bed, you must have looked at the rear queen, no big deal. See below.

I've never towed more then the 5.0TA with the F150 so I'll deffer to your experience on what the EcoBoost can do.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg FB.jpg (45.1 KB, 32 views)
File Type: jpg RQ.jpg (47.3 KB, 39 views)
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Old 07-24-2018, 07:39 AM   #20
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Weight and $ are the main things to me, the 21 being 3200 base, the Oliver 4600, and the Bigfoot 5600. Both of your options are about double the 21, $ wise. If you don't have one already, you'll be needing a full size TV for the BF, maybe a 3/4 ton. Between it's extra weight and extra foot of width, you might consider a diesel. From what I've seen they are both very nice trailers, nicer then the 21, if you don't mind the above.

I know the Olivers are first rate, haven't looked at the BF since they went out of business during the recession. Being completely different, go look them over and see which style you prefer. That dry bath would sure be nice.
We regret selling our 2003 25B25RQ Bigfoot, but it was 15 years old and things were starting to need attention. How many 2003 stickies are just starting to need attention, much less still going down the road. Fiberglass campers are a whole different ballgame!

Our Ford F-150 XLT with the max tow package and 3.5 Ecoboost had no problem pulling the Bigfoot at 6,300+ #'s with nearly 1,000# tongue weight. The Blue Ox hitch with 1,000# bars set the truck perfectly level, and there never was any sway, even without the hitch when towing the trailer 250 miles home.

We loved the Bigfoot's layout, the bathroom was huge, the walk-around queen was great, ducted heat, including the tanks, fantastic insulation, with argon gas dual pane windows (the windows would turn gold in the sun), and it had storage and drawers everywhere. It was built like a tank, but also weighed like one. The problem was we looked at a decked out new one, but without solar, that sold for $56,000, which was too much for us to afford. We see the 21' Escape as a scaled down Bigfoot, but still ticks most of our boxes, is affordable, will tow more like our Casita, and will get 3 extra mpg down the road. I know we'll be happy.

Two years ago we had a chance to purchase a year old, former showfloor Oliver for $39,000 and foolishly let that one go. We could have made $10,000 just flipping the Ollie. It was that stark, sterile, white interior that Terry didn't like. However, the build quality on the Oliver was surreal.

Snuffy2, you have to decide what works best for you. We see three great upper-end fiberglass campers in the Oliver, Bigfoot, and Escape. Each one has it's different strengths and weaknesses. We've never purchased a camper new, but we're so convinced this is the one for us we're finally making the plunge on a new, 21' Escape.

Enjoy,

Perry
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