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08-12-2016, 05:44 PM
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#81
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southwick, Massachusetts
Trailer: None, sold my 2014 5.0TA
Posts: 7,124
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3M has all sorts of HD Velcro, although that's not it's real name, with a wide assortment of adhesives. Some are for high temps, some not. I think it was acrylic vs rubber adhesive, but there was more to it. We used the HD product quite a bit at work, finding a source was the only issue, they are not hardware store items. The 3M site has/had good info on the subject.
__________________
Happy Motoring
Bob
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08-12-2016, 05:52 PM
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#82
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padlin
3M has all sorts of HD Velcro, although that's not it's real name, with a wide assortment of adhesives. Some are for high temps, some not. I think it was acrylic vs rubber adhesive, but there was more to it. We used the HD product quite a bit at work, finding a source was the only issue, they are not hardware store items. The 3M site has/had good info on the subject.
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Good tip, Bob.
3M uses the generic term "hook and loop":
3M™ Hook and Loop
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08-12-2016, 10:54 PM
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#83
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Rossland, British Columbia
Trailer: 2016 Escape 19 classic "Escapade", Tow: 2020 Honda Ridgeline
Posts: 95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tractors1
Figure out how to replace awning fabric with flexible solar material and you could just roll out as much as you thing you need. Probably wouldn't even need to tilt it!
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You mean like this rolable solar material
R60 60 Watt Rollable Solar Panel - PowerFilm Solar
Very expensive now but costs will come down around the time my awning needs replacement.
John
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08-12-2016, 10:58 PM
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#84
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Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Rossland, British Columbia
Trailer: 2016 Escape 19 classic "Escapade", Tow: 2020 Honda Ridgeline
Posts: 95
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Whoops sorry, didn't see tractors1 second post with the rollable panel link.
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08-13-2016, 05:19 AM
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#85
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southwick, Massachusetts
Trailer: None, sold my 2014 5.0TA
Posts: 7,124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P
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Look at the Dual Lock instead.
This is the PDF on the product Selector, on my laptop the link downloads the pdf, may or may not work on yours. There's more info on their site but you have to poke around to find it.
http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/7...electGuide.pdf
__________________
Happy Motoring
Bob
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08-13-2016, 12:22 PM
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#86
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padlin
Look at the Dual Lock instead.
This is the PDF on the product Selector, on my laptop the link downloads the pdf, may or may not work on yours. There's more info on their site but you have to poke around to find it.
http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/7...electGuide.pdf
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Thanks - I wouldn't have guessed this product from the "Dual Lock" name. The product selection PDF downloaded fine for me.
Link to product section of 3M website: 3M™ Dual Lock™ Reclosable Fasteners
The original Velcro® is a hook-and-loop system, but this is not (in name or design). Here's their description:
Quote:
Mushroom-shaped stems interlock to provide five times the closure strength of hook and loop closures yet easily peel apart
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It's like a whole bunch of snaps (again, like used on clothing flaps) but tiny and you don't need to line them up accurately - they just snap into whatever area of the same stuff they hit. An advantage over hook-and-loop is that it doesn't snag threads of fabric the way the hook side of hook-and-loop does.
3M sells this in their Command fastener line as "poster strips", so I was familiar with it, but didn't know the name or that it came in rolls. I agree those would work much better for mounting. While they are still supposed to be peeled apart, they work much better between rigid objects than hook-and-loop. The mirror on the bathroom door of my current RV is held up by these strips.
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08-13-2016, 04:52 PM
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#87
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Area 51, New Mexico
Trailer: pondering.....
Posts: 728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P
Thanks - I wouldn't have guessed this product from the "Dual Lock" name. The product selection PDF downloaded fine for me.
Link to product section of 3M website: 3M™ Dual Lock™ Reclosable Fasteners
The original Velcro® is a hook-and-loop system, but this is not (in name or design). Here's their description:
It's like a whole bunch of snaps (again, like used on clothing flaps) but tiny and you don't need to line them up accurately - they just snap into whatever area of the same stuff they hit. An advantage over hook-and-loop is that it doesn't snag threads of fabric the way the hook side of hook-and-loop does.
3M sells this in their Command fastener line as "poster strips", so I was familiar with it, but didn't know the name or that it came in rolls. I agree those would work much better for mounting. While they are still supposed to be peeled apart, they work much better between rigid objects than hook-and-loop. The mirror on the bathroom door of my current RV is held up by these strips.
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used a similar type in mfg to attach large metal to metal items that were designed to separate for access without tools, however depending on the size of the fasteners you would almost need a small crowbar to get enough leverage to make them separate...usually the adhesive backing would give first .
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08-13-2016, 06:14 PM
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#88
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freespirit
used a similar type in mfg to attach large metal to metal items that were designed to separate for access without tools, however depending on the size of the fasteners you would almost need a small crowbar to get enough leverage to make them separate...usually the adhesive backing would give first .
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The moderate flexibility of "bendable" solar panels would certainly make removing them more practical.
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08-13-2016, 06:24 PM
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#89
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Area 51, New Mexico
Trailer: pondering.....
Posts: 728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P
The moderate flexibility of "bendable" solar panels would certainly make removing them more practical.
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yes.... "peeling" a small area at a time should release easier
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08-15-2016, 02:47 PM
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#90
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: petaluma, California
Trailer: 2015 Escape 21 2002 Tundra 4x4 V-8 tow package.
Posts: 163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC
Sun is shinning on my panel. Top surface temperature is 46 C; underside is 51 C. I was a little surprised by that but I took multiple readings. So fair to say that the panels slightly increase the surface temperature of the fiberglass.
On the other hand I'm not sure there is any harmful effect to the f.g. I've done things like pour molten lead onto fiberglass without any apparent harm.
Ron
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I just took some temp readings on my solar panels. The surface is 112F and directly under the panel in the shade is 95F and the roof in direct sunlight is also 95F. Interesting. The edges of the panel are 3 or so inches from the roof and the center is less than one inch, both were the same temp.
I got tilting solar panels to help when I'm in Montana in October. I haven't experimented just how much because they are alway's tilted when I'm there.
. There are great calculators out there to determine how much tilt is optimum.
The surprise benefit is when tilted I can clean and wax easily.
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08-15-2016, 04:30 PM
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#91
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Area 51, New Mexico
Trailer: pondering.....
Posts: 728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craiginpetaluma
The surprise benefit is when tilted I can clean and wax easily.
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that seems like a very useful benefit when being able to tilt the panel, even if only temporary like a hinged panel versus a fixed panel.
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08-09-2017, 03:27 PM
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#92
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Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Trailer: 2017 ETI 19
Posts: 22
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Front mounted Solar panel
I know this is an old thread but I was curious to hear about the experience people have had with a second solar panel mounted on the front. Is there more risk from rock damage and/or bugs ruining the the panel? Does ETI mount any kind of diverter to keep the wind from trying to rip the panel off the roof?
I was originally thinking of using a portable for my second panel but I don't don't hang around camp during the day when I boondock and would not feel comfortable leaving a portable unattended
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08-09-2017, 04:08 PM
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#93
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,810
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I'm not sure what you mean by mounted on the front. My panel, which extends up higher than the roof and tilts and swivels, "lives" in this position. Its traveled many thousands of miles in that position without incident. It's "live" even in that position. My original intent was for that to be the storage position. But I found that it was continuing to provide usable output even when the tug was hooked up and partly shaded sometimes.
If I only had a portable panel I'd probably make a carrying bracket to hold it in the same relative position. Most of the time it would make usable output and, when full output is needed, it could be easily shifted to a sunny location.
Ron
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08-09-2017, 06:11 PM
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#94
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Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Trailer: 2017 ETI 19
Posts: 22
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Thanks for the info, that is a very nice install. I was really thinking of an additional ETI installed solar panel on the roof.
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08-09-2017, 07:07 PM
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#95
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: no fixed address, California
Trailer: 2017-21' Escape (sold) Casita 17' (sold)
Posts: 1,348
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we have the factory dual roof solar on our 2017 21'
and dual 6v batteries from factory.
we LOVE it.
why?
we can pretty much always run the fridge off 12v while towing for a long day.... or two.... or whatever.... so we dont even need to think about propane / is it on? is it off? / are we gassing up? / going thru a tunnel? etc.
and
even in January pacific north west (low sun) the dual 6 v are always charged up fast
and
they bolt them down very securely, so i see no way it would blow off. or get bugs.
we are super happy. yes it was an extra $850 IIRC, but what the heck. suits the way we boondock, 4 seasons.
it means we just dont ever need to worry about state-of-charge of the dual 6. They just are.
and...
we got the all plug inverter, and we use it, so again.... never a worry about the batteries.
oh and if part of the roof is shaded by a tree... when camping... the OTHER panel usually isn't, so still charging
nice!
john
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08-09-2017, 07:23 PM
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#96
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Oswego, New York
Trailer: 2017 Escape 21C, 2018 Ford F150
Posts: 5,373
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I also ordered an Escape 21 wth two solar panels. I just posted a page of the construction photos of my trailer. While none of the photos are a "roof view", if you look as the outside final photos, you can see the position of the front & rear panel.
I added a front panel to my Escape 17B, towed it to Alaska & a couple of trips across the US, and no chips (and, even though it was epoxied, it didn't blow off!)
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08-09-2017, 07:27 PM
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#97
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,268
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One of these days I'm going to try 12v operation while towing, but I only have the single 155 watt with dual sixers. May still work.
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
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08-09-2017, 07:54 PM
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#98
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Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Trailer: 2017 ETI 19
Posts: 22
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Thanks again. I think I will go for dual solar panels. I already have dual 6V batteries on the build sheet. I got thinking about the dual solar while I was reading about the thermal link issue on the 6 ft3 fridge. Having the option to tow using 12V seemed like a good idea. ETI seems to think that towing with the external fridge fan is the problem but my credo is "optionality", always have options.
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08-09-2017, 08:25 PM
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#99
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Fremont, California
Trailer: 2016 21/ '16 Tundra 4.6L Dbl. Cab
Posts: 1,562
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Twin Panels is a good idea, dinnyberry! If I remember correctly, you'll need to pass on the option for the Jack TV antenna. Not a bad trade-off. ETI will know for sure.
__________________
Steve and Debbie
2016 - 21'
“Get out the map and lay your finger anywhere down” -Indigo Girls
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08-09-2017, 08:33 PM
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#100
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Ponoka, Alberta
Trailer: 2016 19 classic "outta sight", jeep rubicon unlimited
Posts: 1,645
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Here is a picture from ours with the panel (only one) mounted on the front.
When zooming in, you can see it's tilted to the front.
Really like to having the solar panel on the front instead of the rear. Mostly, backing up in sites, your back of the trailer is parked in the trees. This way we get most advantage of the sun for our solar.
The panel is installed solid. No problem when driving. The tilt to the front helps "moving" the wind over top.
__________________
"never lose hope, never lose faith"
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