Low point drain

[tractors1]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

Understood Charlie... I've overnighted at Mt. Hood in the parking lot in a moho (before Mt. Hood Meadows existed).. back in the 1960s.

I think folks are asking about "storage," not using during freezing temps where leaving cabinet doors open and the furance on works. But I've known to be wrong...

Ah, my misunderstanding. oops.

[Klem]

The low point drain 'decision' as it relates to winterizing makes no sense to me.

You need to 'winterize' once (?) a year depending on where you are. And the low point drain will make it simpler and quicker.

But for the rest of the year ....

At any time a leak can come from a fitting, valve, pump, or whatever. With a low point drain you can quickly drain most of the water out of the lines.

So now imagine ... using compressed air to move 'most of the water' out of the ... whoops ... if you have compressed air the leak sprays more water into our fiberglass 'tubs'. Or you can just wait until all the water drips into the trailer?

Mel

[gbaglo]

If you are connected to city water and a leak appears somewhere, the first thing you would do is shut off the city water.
If you then opened a low point drain, you would, at best, drain maybe a gallon ( in the 17B with exterior shower option ).
If you were drawing from the fresh water tank, you would shut off the pump.

There isn't a heck of a lot of water in the lines.

[padlin]

My last trailer had 2 low point drains, both a hot and cold. The hot would drain most of the HW heater along with the lines. I was pretty surprised the Escape has none. I used them whenever the trailer was to sit for a while or needed sterilizing.

[Klem]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

If you are connected to city water and a leak appears somewhere, the first thing you would do is shut off the city water.
If you then opened a low point drain, you would, at best, drain maybe a gallon ( in the 17B with exterior shower option ).
If you were drawing from the fresh water tank, you would shut off the pump.

There isn't a heck of a lot of water in the lines.

In the middle of the night I heard drip,drip,drip in our brand new 19'. I turned the hot water and pump off and released pressure into the sink. The drip stopped and I went back to sleep. It was from the pressure relief valve on the hot water tank.

If it hadn't stopped I would have looked for the low point drain to quickly drain the system and hopefully stop the drip or at least minimize the water damage.

In this scenario what do you suggest as an alternative to the low point drain? Carry a compressor and blow out the lines in the middle of the night? Carry a saw and cut into the walls where I can't see the lines if i don't have a compressor?

I'll add a low point drain to my to-do list. It was short sighted to stop installing a low point drain. If anything cracks in the winter, or due to a failure, a low point drain will immediately reduce the chance of water damage to your trailer. Not to mention the long term musty odor from mold forming after you have leaked a ''not a heck of a lot of' water into an inaccessible area.

Mel

[thoer]

Will Reace still install them as an option?

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by thoer

Will Reace still install them as an option?

Hi: thoer... Our 5.0TA has hot and cold lines that run under the trailer from supply side to kitchen side. I'm wondering if the pex elbows could be replaced with tees and a low point drain added to the tee for both hot and cold.
I used my air pig to blow out the water lines while my wife held the toilet flush valve open. She was not amused with the impromptu shower result. I also ran the water pump for 20 sec. and then disconnected the hoses on either side of it. I only added the pink syrup to all the drains and waste tanks. I hope that's enough for the big freeze coming. Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[cpaharley2008]

I hope that's enough for the big freeze coming. is this from the weather or your wife for drenching her?

[thoer]

Alf I don't think you would really need it on the hot line, although it might come in handy. Replacing those elbow with a bypass type valve should work. One way on the valve the flow goes thru the pipe and the other way it drains. You'll need one of those crimp tools for PEX unless you could find valves with the push on compression fittings I think.

Like this maybe? PEX 3 way valve

or this: Bypass valve

If I were doing it I think I would put a short piece of pipe on the drain side that I could keep a plug in as a backup.

[Dave Walter]

If the water lines between your freshwater tank and outlets (sinks, toilet, shower head, etc) were installed on a gradient such that the lines all freely drain back into the freshwater tank, would the bottom outlet on your freshwater tank not have the same function as a low point drain? Or would the water pump impede this from occurring? Was this possibly Reace's reasoning in eliminating the separate low point drains from the Escape?

[thoer]

Dave - I think you are correct that the pump would stop the flow back out. Plus I think the city part of the line would not drain. My thinking on his eliminating it is that it isn't a reliable method by itself anymore due to the new toilet valve?

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by thoer

Dave - I think you are correct that the pump would stop the flow back out.

I agree. The pump has a check valve, so the freshwater tank drain (or any point between the tank and the pump) is not an effective low point drain for the rest of the system.

[float5]

If the lines freely drained back to fresh tank, there would not be water in the lines except when the tank is full but there IS water in the lines.

So I guess you would have to displace it when pumping the anti-freeze through. At least, I hope that would be the case and that the anti-freeze would not just mix with the water, leaving a lot of water in there.

[BRietkerk]

Originally Posted by ice-breaker

Was this possibly Reace's reasoning in eliminating the separate low point drains from the Escape?

I believe the low point drain was eliminated because it could not be depended on to totally drain all water from the system. The toilet valve still trapped enough water to freeze and do damage to it. We have the low point drain and after draining with all taps and toilet valve open I still get a slug of water out of the toilet valve when I pressurize the system with air. The current ETI winterizing procedure ensures that the toilet valve will survive the winter.

[float5]

There is nothing wrong with having a low-point drain but plenty wrong with not having it. The problem was the directions not saying to pump anti-freeze through the lines which will cover the toilet valve, but instead saying to just dump anti-freeze various places --- which does not cover the valve. No interest here in blowing out lines unnecessarily if pumping anti-freeze covers everything.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Floating Cloud

If the lines freely drained back to fresh tank, there would not be water in the lines except when the tank is full but there IS water in the lines.

So I guess you would have to displace it when pumping the anti-freeze through. At least, I hope that would be the case and that the anti-freeze would not just mix with the water, leaving a lot of water in there.

It seems reasonable to me to assume that you would drain the freshwater tank - and thus the line from it to the pump, before either blowing out the lines or adding antifreeze.

[float5]

It may seem reasonable that the line would drain when fresh tank is drained but we just did it and that is not the case. We had a great deal more water out of the low-point drain following emptying fresh.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Floating Cloud

It may seem reasonable that the line would drain when fresh tank is drained but we just did it and that is not the case. We had a great deal more water out of the low-point drain following emptying fresh.

The line from the tank to the pump will drain with the tank; the lines after the pump will still hold water, which will come out of the low-point drain. The separation of these two parts of the system is due to that check valve:

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

The pump has a check valve, so the freshwater tank drain (or any point between the tank and the pump) is not an effective low point drain for the rest of the system.

[float5]

In other words, the lines are still full of water without a low-point drain. Does not matter where the water is that is still there. We want a low-point drain for the rest of it and situations mentions above by others. Can't understand getting rid of it.

[gbaglo]

As has been said, it was eliminated because with the new toilet valve, the low-point drain wouldn't remove all the water. One had to use compressed air or RV anti-freeze, so there is no point installing something that doesn't do a complete job.