Low point drain

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Most national parks in the US do not allow gray water, nor any water dumping...

One possibility is carrying the gray water over to the pit toilets. One campground host I checked with thought that was a good idea. One 5 gallon bucket per day did the trick for us.

--
Alan

[Mike Lewis]

About a week ago I developed symptoms of what I thought was food poisoning: nausea, upset stomach, etc. Unlike with a previous bout of this, the symptoms persisted and I had an unsettled stomach through the Osoyoos rally, which is one reason I wasn't too sociable during the rally (the other being, well, I'm just not very sociable).

At first I thought it was food poisoning, but it has persisted long enough for me to think my fresh water tank is contaminated. I went through the decontamination process before leaving on my current trip, but it looks like I need to do something again. Is there a way of decontaminating a fresh water tank "on the fly" as I'm currently using it? Or will I have to drain and purge it again as I did before? That might be difficult at a campground.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

Is there a way of decontaminating a fresh water tank "on the fly" as I'm currently using it?

Check into Aquamira water treatment. It will cost about $14 US to treat a 30 gallon tank but the final product is quite drinkable with no odd tastes.

--
Alan

[float5]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

About a week ago I developed symptoms of what I thought was food poisoning: nausea, upset stomach, etc. Unlike with a previous bout of this, the symptoms persisted and I had an unsettled stomach through the Osoyoos rally, which is one reason I wasn't too sociable during the rally (the other being, well, I'm just not very sociable).

At first I thought it was food poisoning, but it has persisted long enough for me to think my fresh water tank is contaminated. I went through the decontamination process before leaving on my current trip, but it looks like I need to do something again. Is there a way of decontaminating a fresh water tank "on the fly" as I'm currently using it? Or will I have to drain and purge it again as I did before? That might be difficult at a campground.

It could be any food you have had just as well as any drink (besides what is in your trailer.) We get drinking water in gallons for the trailer which you could do to see if you feel any better. I assume your propane/co detector is working.

[escape artist]

Hi: Mike Lewis... My wife had something like your experiencing a few years ago. I didn't!!! We traced it to the milk container we used as she had milk on her cereal and in her coffee. I don't.
We always use the water from the tank thru a Brita, or buy it at Wall o Mart as needed.
Hope you're feeling better soon!!! Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[gharper]

I use bleach to decontaminate the water tank, let it sit for at least 30 seconds with the water tank full, move around in the trailer, run the pump to flush the lines to the sinks, dump, and flush every thing usually twice. You could do this at the sani dump. I follow Centre for Disease Control recommendations for amount to decontaminate a container (5 mLs in 1 quart or apprrox 1 litre):http://www.cdc.gov/healthywater/pdf/..._Flyer_508.pdf

[Jim Bennett]

I try to freshen my lines at the beginning of the year, when the water heater is empty. I only do this if I suspect contamination. If the water system has only had water from our house through it, I don't bother.

I put about 1/2 cup or so in a gallon of water, then add it to the near full holding tank. I then run taps to flush the lines, open the bypass valves to the water heater to fill it, and top off the tank. I leave this a few hours, then drain, including draining the water heater. I then repeat the flushing with clean water. I used to flush twice, but actually, once seems to be more than enough, as the minute traces of bleach left are really not noticeable at all.

[gharper]

I have been adding a little more than 1.5 cups of unscented bleach to decontaminate the 20 gallon fresh water tank in my 19 (about 380 mLs). Escape says it is 20 gallons but not sure if US or Imperial gallons, if Imperial I need to use 2 cups. Most RV water filters do not remove bacteria and viruses - they remove particulate and some chemicals/minerals. A water filter labelled with NSF 53 or 58 on them will remove crypto.

[HappyCampers]

Hi,

Most of the time I use vinegar to sanitize my water system. I put two gallons of 5% vinegar in the tank and fill it with water. I try not to run any through the hot water tank, as even this weak acid could become more potent when heated up. Run water through the system until you smell the vinegar at each tap. We did this when we picked up our new 5.0TA last month. I like to leave it in overnight. Drain and flush and fill up new and you are ready to go. Chlorine is very good as a disinfectant, but as you may know it is quite potent, and can be corrosive. Residual vinegar in your system will not make you sick, and it is also readily available.

[Jim Bennett]

I had read some test results recently, and vinegar will not kill all types of bacteria. Chlorine is used successfully world wide as a disinfectant, and when diluted properly, then rinsed well, leaves almost no residual traces.

I guess it is like going with what has been proven effective.

[tractors1]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

I had read some test results recently, and vinegar will not kill all types of bacteria. Chlorine is used successfully world wide as a disinfectant, and when diluted properly, then rinsed well, leaves almost no residual traces.

I guess it is like going with what has been proven effective.

Chlorine is also a "contact kill" disinfectant according to my chemical engineering wifey; so nothing is gained leaving it in overnight. We dump a cup into a gallon of water and run it through all the piping. We do drain the water lines after each camping trip, so there's nothing remaining in the tanks (including hot water heater.)

[cpaharley2008]

Mike,
I suggest you drink bottles water until home arrival. You could also hve altitude sickness, I had that last year enroute to Osoyoos, drink plenty of water.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

I had read some test results recently, and vinegar will not kill all types of bacteria. Chlorine is used successfully world wide as a disinfectant, and when diluted properly, then rinsed well, leaves almost no residual traces.

I guess it is like going with what has been proven effective.

Another little problem with vinegar is the presence of the magnesium anode in the hot water heater. Here is the chemical reaction: Mg + 2 CH3COOH ---> Mg(CH3COO)2 +H2. Not only are you destroying the anode, but you are making hydrogen gas. That's a big problem.

My preferred alternative, although pricy, is Aquamira. The active ingredient in Aquamira is Chlorine Dioxide.

Quoting from folks who sell water treatment systems to cities (obvious bias):
"How much chlorine dioxide should be dosed?
For the pre- oxidation and reduction of organic substances between 0,5 and 2 mg/L of chlorine dioxide is required at a contact time between 15 and 30 minutes. Water quality determines the required contact time. For post- disinfection, concentrations between 0,2 and 0,4 mg/L are applied. The residual byproduct concentration of chlorite is very low and there are no risks for human health."

Personally, I'll save the vinegar for home-made pickles.

--
Alan

[float5]

The instructions, of which I have seen several that concur on the amount of bleach to use in an RV, are aimed at disinfecting the fresh water tank as well as the lines. Consequently, the tank has to be filled. The amount of bleach commonly given is about one quarter cup per fifteen gallons, so we used a little more for our 19' and will use twice that for our 21'. The bleach is first put into a gallon container with gallon of water and mixed, then into the trailer followed by filling the tank. Then it goes into the lines and is left to sit overnight or at least a few hours before flushing, possibly needing to sit due to the dilution. Anyway, that is what we do. We may use one of those exterior water filters, in addition, which does not do as much.

Also, however, did see a trailer magazine article against using bleach. Whatever it was they recommended, I could not find it.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Mike,
I suggest you drink bottles water until home arrival. You could also hve altitude sickness, I had that last year enroute to Osoyoos, drink plenty of water.

Bottled water is a good idea. I doubt that I have altitude sickness-- I recently spent a couple of weeks at 6000+ feet, and had not been below 4000 feet for more than a month, prior to the drive up to Osoyoos. Heck, at one point I stomped up a half-mile trail to photograph a waterfall that was at 9700 feet in Colorado. I'm surprised that didn't kill me.

[Mike Lewis]

Originally Posted by Floating Cloud

I assume your propane/co detector is working.

My fire / CO detector is working; I replaced the battery recently and tested it. The propane detector has a green light on. If there is a test procedure I'll do it tomorrow. I've run the furnace quite a bit since I got it working again; I hope that's not the problem.

[float5]

Originally Posted by Mike Lewis

My fire / CO detector is working; I replaced the battery recently and tested it. The propane detector has a green light on. If there is a test procedure I'll do it tomorrow. I've run the furnace quite a bit since I got it working again; I hope that's not the problem.

The propane detector is working with the light on. Whether you could have a venting problem that is not a propane leak, I don't know. Hope you are getting a good amount of air from a couple of windows with Maxx fan also open even if cold, especially if cold, to move air out in case something is not venting enough or properly. That would not be limited to the furnace. Don't know if anyone here can tell you how to check all of the venting or if you can check it yourself.

[dfandrews]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

Another little problem with vinegar is the presence of the magnesium anode in the hot water heater. Here is the chemical reaction: Mg + 2 CH3COOH ---> Mg(CH3COO)2 +H2. Not only are you destroying the anode, but you are making hydrogen gas. That's a big problem.

Don't you just love active metals!

My preferred alternative, although pricy, is Aquamira. The active ingredient in Aquamira is Chlorine Dioxide.

Quoting from folks who sell water treatment systems to cities (obvious bias):
"How much chlorine dioxide should be dosed?
For the pre- oxidation and reduction of organic substances between 0,5 and 2 mg/L of chlorine dioxide is required at a contact time between 15 and 30 minutes. Water quality determines the required contact time. For post- disinfection, concentrations between 0,2 and 0,4 mg/L are applied. The residual byproduct concentration of chlorite is very low and there are no risks for human health."

Personally, I'll save the vinegar for home-made pickles.

--
Alan

Alan,
Aquamira; Hmm, interesting product. My experience with chlorine dioxide is that it always had to be generated on-site, and was not a consumer product by any means. (It was used to disinfect our local hospital-- yes, the whole building was basically tented!)
So, this looks like a preferred choice, as you say.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by dfandrews

Don't you just love active metals!

Yep. On our boat we called them "sacrificial anodes". Gave up their lives for the sake of the stainless steel and bronze.

Originally Posted by dfandrews

Aquamira; Hmm, interesting product. My experience with chlorine dioxide is that it always had to be generated on-site, and was not a consumer product by any means. ...
So, this looks like a preferred choice, as you say.

I have no idea if it is preferred for RVs. As a backpacker I use it frequently. Since the version I use is a 2-part liquid, I do generate the chlorine dioxide "on-site". 14 drops per liter.

When we took delivery of our '21 I had an almost new container of Aquamira in my pack but no chlorine bleach, so I "sacrificed" the whole $14 container and treated the water system.

I now have a quart of bleach - which I will use but will flush before filling the freshwater tank. Lots cheaper!

--
Alan

[elongest]

Anyone have a picture they can post of the low point drain set up on a pre-2014 E-21.
Thanks
Eddie