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Old 08-07-2015, 03:25 PM   #351
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Originally Posted by Patandlinda View Post
Shouldn't there be in your opinion a larger backing plate, it has been said a roof of 1/8 thickness, so with the wind stress pulling up on those panels not to widen holes or eventually pull through ? Pat
One variable is, beside flexing due to thinness, is proximity to adjacent structure that gives addition rigidity. In the Escape there is less flexing due both to the cross-section shape ( the lengthwise ridge) that reduces flexing as well as the interior cabinet supports, tabbed to the shell, that also reduce potential flexing. It's the flexing that can cause stress cracks. If the bolts are tight I don't believe that pulling through is likely.


Which is the long winded way of saying I'd be comfortable with fender washers in that situation. I often, in other situations just take a piece of aluminum, a little larger then a fender washer and make a backing block. A larger backing block is sort of like a belt and braces approach, one I often take.

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Old 08-07-2015, 03:36 PM   #352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron in BC View Post
One variable is, beside flexing due to thinness, is proximity to adjacent structure that gives addition rigidity. In the Escape there is less flexing due both to the cross-section shape ( the lengthwise ridge) that reduces flexing as well as the interior cabinet supports, tabbed to the shell, that also reduce potential flexing. It's the flexing that can cause stress cracks. If the bolts are tight I don't believe that pulling through is likely.


Which is the long winded way of saying I'd be comfortable with fender washers in that situation. I often, in other situations just take a piece of aluminum, a little larger then a fender washer and make a backing block. A larger backing block is sort of like a belt and braces approach, one I often take.

Ron
Thanks Ron for explanation . As you can see still going back and forth about this . If I was to install like idea of aluminum backing plates , a little larger then fender washer . Pat
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Old 08-07-2015, 05:12 PM   #353
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Can't go wrong with a backing plate and if the there are two bolts fairly close to each other then one backing plate can be used for both bolts and that make the installation just about bomb proof.

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Old 08-07-2015, 05:42 PM   #354
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Originally Posted by Ron in BC View Post
Can't go wrong with a backing plate and if the there are two bolts fairly close to each other then one backing plate can be used for both bolts and that make the installation just about bomb proof.

Ron
What would you seal with on top of holding bracket plates ? Also on bottom of brackets ? You said grade 8 bolts ? I want to just use stainless brackets that usually come with panels or you can get ? I was hoping to not use rails just the 4 brackets ? Pat
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Old 08-07-2015, 06:55 PM   #355
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I have a whole shelf of assorted sealants, adhesives and caulks but in this case I'd probably use a polyurathane one by Sika. Not because there aren't many others that will do the job but because I've used it a lot and it works well. Heck, I've even, Donna stop reading, used silicone. I believe that it gets a bit of a bad rap and that it does have its' uses.

I don't really like the smear sealant all over the exterior of the fastener. Looks awful to me but it does add another level of security. I sometimes use an EPDM washer under the head if I'm concerned with potential water leaks. But if there's a healthy layer of sealant in place leakage isn't usually an issue.

I just tossed out a Grade 8 bolt as an example. Stainless bolts have different strength ratings but a s/s 1/4" bolt would still likely have about 2300 lb. tensile strength. I routinely use s/s for everything except for some specialized applications.

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Old 08-07-2015, 07:41 PM   #356
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I have a whole shelf of assorted sealants, adhesives and caulks but in this case I'd probably use a polyurathane one by Sika. Not because there aren't many others that will do the job but because I've used it a lot and it works well. Heck, I've even, Donna stop reading, used silicone. I believe that it gets a bit of a bad rap and that it does have its' uses.

I don't really like the smear sealant all over the exterior of the fastener. Looks awful to me but it does add another level of security. I sometimes use an EPDM washer under the head if I'm concerned with potential water leaks. But if there's a healthy layer of sealant in place leakage isn't usually an issue.

I just tossed out a Grade 8 bolt as an example. Stainless bolts have different strength ratings but a s/s 1/4" bolt would still likely have about 2300 lb. tensile strength. I routinely use s/s for everything except for some specialized applications.

Ron
Ok Ron . Always love to use stainless for applications like this . Love the idea of EPDM underneath the bracket on roof . That will seal alone the hole once bolt is tightened up . Then sealant around edge of bracket and bolt heads . Have used Sika before but wouldn't it be better for sealant to be flexible in this case ? Getting this together , maybe by the time I purchase the panel in same size will be higher in Watts . Pat
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Old 09-04-2015, 05:15 PM   #357
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Here is a photo of the cable tie down system Escape provided for 17's with the 95 watt panel. They provide an interesting blind rival that is seated by hammering in a pin, however because of the length of the cables, in most of the locations the fiberglass shell was too thick to use the provided rivet - I had to use pop rivets. They are positioned so that the rivet is in a void area of the curved section of the roof & does not show on the inside.
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Old 09-04-2015, 05:27 PM   #358
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Is the purpose to decrease the chance of the original mount failing? And/or keep the loose panel from flying off? Looks to flimsy to do either. A pop rivet through fiberglass with no backing washer will come out quite easily?
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Old 09-15-2015, 08:48 PM   #359
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Well my kit arrived today, with 4 aluminum brackets, 4 self tapping metal screws to attach to the panel and 4 thru the hull nuts/bolts with caps. I asked what the % was and was told 3/500 came off. One was done as a retrofit and 2 were original installs. The picture sent shows a screw head cover inside on the ceiling, going to have to think about this.
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Old 09-15-2015, 09:01 PM   #360
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Well my kit arrived today, with 4 aluminum brackets, 4 self tapping metal screws to attach to the panel and 4 thru the hull nuts/bolts with caps. I asked what the % was and was told 3/500 came off. One was done as a retrofit and 2 were original installs. The picture sent shows a screw head cover inside on the ceiling, going to have to think about this.
ETI sent me a note that the issue was crosswinds and that no 21 had lost a panel. I've put on front airfoils to deflect the slipstream over the panel, but that wouldn't help a lot with crosswinds. I'll probably put the kit on, but not use their screws. I would bolt that sucker with locknuts on the panel and a larger washer over the bolt inside the cabinet; probably capped off with a plastic topper for both looks and insulation of the bolt head.
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