Canadian Border Phone Search

[rotateclockwise]

Watching the news tonight, they presented cases where normal US citizens are legally being asked to turn over their phone and password to Canadian border agents. They are scanning phones using software to detect social media posts, internet searches, and associations with others. If you resist, they can deny entry and who knows what else.

I had no idea this was occurring, but they stated the number of searches in February equaled the total number of all of last year.

Has anyone experienced this type of search?

[gbaglo]

Nothing new there. US and Canada border services have been able to demand passwords and to look through devices. If you don't cooperate they can deny entry to Canada or to US.
Just same as looking in your glove box or your purse.

[Brian B-P]

There are reality TV shows about border crossings, including both ways across the Canada-U.S. border. Examining the content of computers and communication devices (such as phones) appears to be normal for either direction across any border when the border agent has a reason to suspect that the traveler's plans may not be as they claimed; it seems that this is most common for people claiming to visiting as tourists for short time, but suspected of planning to stay longer or to work (without permission) in the destination country.

Anyone traveling with a recreational vehicle is potentially set up to stay in the destination country for a long time - we're basically carrying our homes with us - and would not likely have a committed return date (unlike an air traveler with a return ticket). That makes us potential targets for more in-depth examination than an average person.

Anyone disturbed by this examination - or any other form of examination - can choose to withdraw their request to enter the country. I don't see getting a password as much different from getting a key to a locked compartment in the RV. If a border agent needs to spend time browsing my e-mail and automotive information, I hope they don't get too bored.

[rotateclockwise]

While I haven't been to Canada in 20 years, I certainly didn't know this was occurring. I'm willing to bet there are others who aren't aware of this type of search. I'm not worried, but just sharing. I agree that they can knock their socks off searching.

[steve dunham]

When I head to Manitoba in June , I plan on leaving my phone at home in Wisconsin . They already know what's on my phone and I find no reason to spend 3 or 4 hours at the border while they search for absolutely nothing . My phone doesn't work in Canada anyway and I don't own a lap top so it's not a big loss. .
I will bring my fishing pole and tackle box .

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

When I head to Manitoba in June , I plan on leaving my phone at home in Wisconsin . They already know what's on my phone and I find no reason to spend 3 or 4 hours at the border while they search for absolutely nothing .

I think that for the vast majority of folks who have not been active militants or have a criminal past that the chances of being delayed 3 or 4 hours while your phone is searched are slim to none.

Ron

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by Ron in BC

I think that for the vast majority of folks who have not been active militants or have a criminal past that the chances of being delayed 3 or 4 hours while your phone is searched are slim to none.

Ron

I was looking for an excuse to leave my phone at home and just go fishing .The government has now provided me with a plausible reason. I was forced to carry a phone and / or a pager for over 30 years by my employer. Since I am retired I no longer feel the need to be on an electronic leash. Others may feel the need to be constantly connected but I feel no such need. No one calls me anyway so the phone is just one more thing for me to lose or drop in the lake.

Best Wishes
Steve D

[KarenH]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

Others may feel the need to be constantly connected but I feel no such need. No one calls me anyway...

Good one! Me neither.

But while I can see the Canadians denying entry to US citizens who refuse to comply and the US Border Patrol denying entry to Canadians (or others) who refuse to comply, can the US deny entry to US citizens who refuse to comply? Wouldn't they need a warrant? While I have no criminal record--yet--I find this worrisome. Maybe this is too political so I shouldn't even post my concern here.

[gbaglo]

I expect they'd just make you wait while they got a warrant. Probably a cozy room, but no view.

[Iowa Dave]

Any detention at a border crossing as long as you don't have a hidden dui or other contraband will eventually work out ok. If you have something to worry about, you have something to worry about. That's how I have gone through life, secret service background checks, phone taps, wanding and being selected out for too big of a belt buckle, it just makes a good story later.
Easy does it.
Dave

[Greg A]

No warrants necessary for border crossing and phones according to the reports. They can also clone your entire phone in seconds and take their time with their copy.

[LarryandLiz]

As a Canadian I don't like the idea of giving electronic access, even though about a year and a half ago, I gave them a picture of my eyeball when I signed up for the Nexus program. But for a variety of reasons I don't fancy a cross border trip right now

[skyfree]

Good intentions aside, just because it's in the hands of the border patrol doesn't mean it's going to stay there. Information is stolen all the time. There are no laws protecting how this information is stored since it is a gray area, so it could be vulnerable to theft for decades.

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by skyfree

There are no laws protecting how this information is stored

Where did you get this information?

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by KarenH

But while I can see the Canadians denying entry to US citizens who refuse to comply and the US Border Patrol denying entry to Canadians (or others) who refuse to comply, can the US deny entry to US citizens who refuse to comply? Wouldn't they need a warrant? While I have no criminal record--yet--I find this worrisome.

My understanding - which is absolutely not to be trusted in any way - is that you can always get back into your own country... although what you do at the border (such as bringing in contraband) can certainly have legal repercussions. In that direction a criminal record wouldn't matter - they're not deciding whether or not you're an acceptable visitor - but of course if you have an outstanding warrant you should keep in mind that you're presenting yourself to a law enforcement agency.

I have no idea if a warrant would be required to get into your devices, but I doubt arguing about it would make your life better!

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I expect they'd just make you wait while they got a warrant. Probably a cozy room, but no view.

[StarvingHyena]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

I was looking for an excuse to leave my phone at home and just go fishing .The government has now provided me with a plausible reason. I was forced to carry a phone and / or a pager for over 30 years by my employer. Since I am retired I no longer feel the need to be on an electronic leash. Others may feel the need to be constantly connected but I feel no such need. No one calls me anyway so the phone is just one more thing for me to lose or drop in the lake.

Best Wishes
Steve D

Steve ... publish your phone number and I'll call you! :-)

Tom

[JohnB]

Interesting that these searches are happening on the Canadian side and making the news. We don't get those news reports up here. But we do get the news reports about Canadian citizens having their phones etc. searched while trying to cross into the USA. Apparently it is particularly difficult if you are Muslim trying to cross.

There was a story on the CBC National News a couple weeks ago about a Muslim woman, Canadian Citizen, trying to cross for a visit in the eastern US. After looking at her phone and seeing photos of mosques and other Muslim relatives on the phone, she was denied entry.

The mayor of the city she was wishing to go visit heard about the story and reached out to the woman to apologize on behalf of his country and invited her down to have an expense paid visit to his city which would be hosted by the mayor and his wife. A noble gesture, trying to atone for the recent crackdown instigated by the President. She would still have to pass the border inspection for this to happen.

These stories have probably been out there for years but only now are they making the news headlines for some reason??

[gocamp]

it was in the news. President Trump's announcement that people entering the USA will be required to give border officers their social media passwords means that a wealth of sensitive data on our devices and in the cloud is now liable to search and retention for our national security when we cross into the USA. I have a big smile gladly handing anything over to help out with national security standards

"At the U.S. border. Agents may ask travelers to unlock their devices, provide their device passwords, or disclose their social media information."

https://www.eff.org/wp/digital-privacy-us-border-2017

[bigalaska2012]

Plane view law will be the probable cause in most cases

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[bigalaska2012]

Originally Posted by rotateclockwise

Watching the news tonight, they presented cases where normal US citizens are legally being asked to turn over their phone and password to Canadian border agents. They are scanning phones using software to detect social media posts, internet searches, and associations with others. If you resist, they can deny entry and who knows what else.

I had no idea this was occurring, but they stated the number of searches in February equaled the total number of all of last year.

Has anyone experienced this type of search?

Plane view law is what makes sense, if they find contraband the search will intensify, I suppose if they are bored and they are in a bad mood

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