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Old 10-26-2016, 08:02 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
Here's my theory. Highway patrol is unlikely to pull you over to see if you have chains if there is no snow in the forecast. If there is snow; wait it out. Police will be busy with accident scenes involving vehicles with all-season tires and won't be looking for you unless you are obstructing traffic.
Even though I have four-wheel-drive and snow tires, I stay home when it snows because there are too many ill-equipped cars and incompetent drivers on the road and the insurance company likes to split the blame rather than investigate.
All good theories. I'm with you on either staying home or traveling elsewhere when there's snow in the passes. But, on the odd chance you HAVE to negotiate such a thing, having a set of chains in the back will come in handy.
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Old 10-26-2016, 09:32 PM   #22
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I would vote to staying put if it snows. If you are not an experienced driver in snow and ice I wouldn't choose to learn winter driving skills with a trailer in tow!
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Old 10-26-2016, 09:59 PM   #23
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I would vote to staying put if it snows. If you are not an experienced driver in snow and ice I wouldn't choose to learn winter driving skills with a trailer in tow!
This is my vote too. Why risk it, even with chains. Escape will hold the trailer. My brother, who's 19 will be ready very soon, is even contemplating leaving it there, as he will not be using it 'til spring anyway.

I grew up driving in snow. Got my driver's license in mid December, and the only time I have used chains has been on big trucks. I have towed trailers hordes on snow and ice, and it is not too bad, but I do take extra precaution when doing so. Cornering in town is more of an issue than towing straight down the highway, as if overly aggressive, the trailer can swing to the side.
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Old 10-26-2016, 10:13 PM   #24
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I would vote to staying put if it snows. If you are not an experienced driver in snow and ice I wouldn't choose to learn winter driving skills with a trailer in tow!
Good advice

I actually have tons and tons of experience driving on terrible snow and ice and slush and black ice.



And yes indeed - it is a skill

But yes indeed - we will have many buffer days built into our trip.

Just in case of bad weather.

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Old 10-27-2016, 01:03 AM   #25
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... M+S are not snow tires. You need the mountain/snowflake symbol on the tire. You can find all the info here:
About Winter Tires - Province of British Columbia
Right - good reference source... and as it explains, the mountain and snowflake symbol indicates real winter tires, but B.C. considers M+S tires acceptable where "winter" tires are required... although they recommend real "mountain/snowflake" tires.

If you have winter tires, you don't legally need to have chains on the roads where winter tires are required, and if you need chains functionally, you shouldn't be towing (and probably shouldn't even be driving).

I don't know about south of the 49th parallel, but in B.C. the roads between Escape and the border crossings do not require snow tires or chains, and most people in the Lower Mainland (Vancouver and the lower Fraser valley) don't own either winter tires or chains.

I've only used chains on my lawn tractor when clearing snow with it... and my snowthrower doesn't use chains. Truckers use chains, only because they don't have snow tires. I realize that there are many thousands of people who use chains on cars and light trucks, but that's among many millions of vehicles, and I've never seen chains used on a car in my life, because the vast majority of people - even those who live here where winter is more than half the year or in the mountains of Alberta and B.C. - don't even own chains. The only possible purpose I can think of for chains on a car is to allow a vehicle with 3-season tires to be used in occasional real winter conditions.
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Old 10-27-2016, 01:11 AM   #26
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I actually had chains for my VW Beetle. When "White Hell" hit Vancouver many years ago I put them on. Drove around a Mini that was high centred by going into the ditch and back up on the road.
When you work for a newspaper you have to head into the storm to shoot pix for the next day's paper or people won't know that it snowed, don't you know?
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Old 10-27-2016, 09:02 AM   #27
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I have chains for both our 2wd and our 4wd.
I've used them on both. Both also have the M&S symbol on the tires.

I live on the east coast of Vancouver Island. We get snow a few weeks of the year. Snow falls here as very wet heavy stuff, that then freezes into ice at about 3 in the afternoon. Chains make it possible to drive on that ice.

We also have mountain roads here. We often drive the nearest road. The elevation change is about 5,000'. We have chained up many times.

AND we have never towed our trailer in those conditions.
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Old 10-27-2016, 09:04 AM   #28
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Old 10-27-2016, 09:27 AM   #29
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chains

That is one nice looking set of chains. They might not go thump, thump while driving. I grew up in western CO and we spent 10 years in Utah down wind from the big lake, lots of deep snow, even had chains on the snow thrower. I would follow Donna's advice, be prepared to delay, after all you will have your own house with you and consider heading for the coast if snow is forecast and enjoy a great drive. Once in CA on hi way 1 you will get tired of 15 mph corners but the views are the best and no snow.
Jack Now in AZ to stay and I don't own chains now.
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Old 10-27-2016, 10:05 AM   #30
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Chained up

Depending upon the situation I would as soon lay up and wait for conditions to improve when possible. The good thing about being retired and having the Escape is that this is usually possible. Second choice may be to determine an alternate route, which might be farther and take more time but it beats getting hurt or bending sheet metal. I own a couple of sets of chains, one of them brand new, 30 years ago. I do not know exactly where they are. I have a set for my tractor also, haven't needed them in ten years.
We used to plane the ponds for ice speed skating events in the winter when I was in the parks dept. We used cable " chains" on all four wheels of the 4 WD 3/4 ton pickups. If it was too warm, and there was water on the ice, we would chain two trucks together and jerk the rear truck to get them moving. On 10 inches of pond ice you could see, hear and feel the ice sag and driving the front truck was like pulling a water skier with a boat. Yes, we put them through the ice once in a while but the water was only about 4 feet deep. But every parent believed their child was a future Olympian, so the job had to be done.
My son's next door neighbor was a snowbird. He hit black ice in Kansas, totaled his truck and small 5th wheel. Killed his wife, beat him up, and messed up his life forever. Think twice, it ain't that important.
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Old 10-27-2016, 10:22 AM   #31
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I completely agree with Dave. I have lots of experience driving in snow & Ice. Like Dave, I plowed a lake for skating (with a Jeep & no chains) during winters while in college. I spent most of my life in Oswego, NY where we average 150" - 200" of snow each winter. While I haven't used chains in years, I did switch to 4 real snow tires for the winter (I now have a better idea - head to Arizona!)

I still won't tow on ice or snow. I watch the weather & if I end up needing to, wait for clear roads. My one experience with towing on ice was just outside Olympic National Park in April. Came around a turn with my 2 week old trailer on a rain wet road & found 1" - 2" of hail on the road (and a logging truck behind me). I managed to keep it all on the road, but it was not a pleasant experience!
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Old 10-27-2016, 11:14 AM   #32
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I have a lot of experience towing a snowmobile trailer on snow and ice and it's nice to have chains on a trailer that has electric brakes on it. Without them, the trailer tire grip is easily overcome. Not sure about other states, but in California and Oregon if you are towing a trailer the tow vehicle must have chains on if the chains required sign is up EVEN IF YOU HAVE TRACTION TIRES ON. The trailer must have chains on if it has brakes.

We have chains for the Touareg even though we have Blizzak snow tires on it for this reason. I will buy a set of cheap Walmart chains for the trailer when we pick it up from BC in February. I'm not particularly concerned about encountering snow on the trip. Towing a trailer on snow isn't much different than just driving on snow without towing. Sure, if you can wait it out and are happy doing that then that is the best option, but we don't have that kind of spare time and will usually just tough it out unless it's a blizzard with zero visibility.
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Old 10-27-2016, 11:36 AM   #33
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I always say it's not about your driving driving skills its the lack of skills that others have .. I have yet to cross i-80 from Ca to Nv where some fool hasn't caused an accident and blocked lanes and jammed up traffic for hours while the accident is cleared.
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Old 10-27-2016, 03:51 PM   #34
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....If you have winter tires, you don't legally need to have chains on the roads where winter tires are required, and if you need chains functionally, you shouldn't be towing (and probably shouldn't even be driving
In California there are three requirements of chain controls in mountain areas depending on severity with #3 requiring "Chains or traction devices are required on all vehicles, no exceptions." Some folks with four wheel drive think they are exempt for chains period, but even at #2 they need snow tires. Caltrans Winter Driving Tips Chain Controls
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Old 11-07-2016, 12:15 PM   #35
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.....not unusual for the Siskiyoues. [pass to close in January]

The road crews do an excellent job and the longest I can remember in (recent) memory I-5 south was closed was 3 days. But that was like in... 2012, maybe? Usually it's only closed for a few hours, but chains would be required for all vehicles.....
Just to clarify Donna D....

when you say " chains would be required for all vehicles" - do you mean I'd need to have chains IN the vehicle, just in case?

and I assume that is only when they have the sign out that says something like "all vehicles must carry chains with them" (or similar)

and...

interesting info here... i think i just answered my own question..... maybe....

https://www.tripcheck.com/Pages/chain-laws.asp




thanks.
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Old 11-07-2016, 12:27 PM   #36
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In Oregon, when the ODOT sign says "Chains Required," it means ON the vehicle.. not in the vehicle. Because if you get stuck without chains and require a tow, the fine you'd receive will make you cry.

If ODOT wants/needs to keep a pass open that means everyone keeps moving. No getting stuck and no stopping to put on chains (in the middle of the road because you can't move).

ODOT does a very good job, but frankly they're more concerned about keeping commercial vehicles moving than they are passenger vehicles towing travel trailers. Fortunately isn't not an issue frequently and usually not for long. Just be prepared and have an alternative plan.
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Old 11-07-2016, 12:38 PM   #37
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In Oregon, when the ODOT sign says "Chains Required," it means ON the vehicle.. not in the vehicle. Because if you get stuck without chains and require a tow, the fine you'd receive will make you cry.

If ODOT wants/needs to keep a pass open that means everyone keeps moving. No getting stuck and no stopping to put on chains (in the middle of the road because you can't move).

ODOT does a very good job, but frankly they're more concerned about keeping commercial vehicles moving than they are passenger vehicles towing travel trailers. Fortunately isn't not an issue frequently and usually not for long. Just be prepared and have an alternative plan.
Aha - thanks - makes perfect sense. Thanks Donna D for clarifying. Much appreciated.

yeah... the watch, and if need be wait .... will be how we proceed.
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Old 11-07-2016, 09:29 PM   #38
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Our trailer got moved up to January 25, so we will be facing the same issues. Most likely we'll go pick it up then or soon after, and if the weather looks at all iffy for the return, we'll just travel down the coast to LA or San Diego and go around the snow belt. Wet doesn't concern me (except I probably don't take California Hwy 1 during rainy season), but no way am I taking a trailer anywhere that might need to light up the "chains required" signs - way too many idiots out there. Anyway, since we're both retired we can just wait out the weather if need be. Reason number 217 why retirement is good.
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Old 11-08-2016, 07:46 AM   #39
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I remember back in 1968 crossing the Sierra Mountains in California and there was the "Chains required" roadblock stop with California State Police, being from Maryland we always carried chains in our vehicle and we were let through the road block to continue heading east. At that road block was an enterprising young man selling chains for some ungodly sum I'm sure to those motorists who wished to continue and did not have chains.
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Old 12-21-2016, 09:20 PM   #40
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In Oregon, when the ODOT sign says "Chains Required," it means ON the vehicle.. not in the vehicle. Because if you get stuck without chains and require a tow, the fine you'd receive will make you cry
I'm picking up my trailer on Jan 9 and the weather forecast doesn't look good. The tire chain requirement has me spooked so I ordered a set for my truck. They would be kept in the truck for the "signs telling you to carry chains" that might be up on the trip going to Chilliwack. I don't plan to use them but if a trooper asks for them - I have them. On the way back with the trailer, I would just wait it out or divert to another route.

I really didn't want to buy them but you never know. I guess they could come in handy for mud - we have plenty of that down in Texas.
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