Perspective Please

[gmchamplin]

I need a little perspective on my most recent interaction with ETI. I hope someone can help me.

We signed off our build sheet for a 5.0TA at the end of April. It included a full height cabinet to the right of the door with four shelves in it.

Last week I received an email informing me of a new policy that all shelves must be separated by at least 10 inches, because if they are closer together than that, they are too hard to install. Four shelves would not fit with this new policy.

I asked if they could just install the bottom shelf and let me install the other three.

The reply was: Installing the 1 shelf 10” from the bottom of the cabinet, will not be a problem however, the shelves are custom built as they go, therefore we would not be able to supply the additional 3 shelves. Due to the fact that all our trailers are custom, there might be slight changes in measurements, and if we supply one that is too large or too small it would cause issues for you.

I then asked if they could install three shelves, make a fourth shelf identical to the top one they installed, and let me take responsibility for installing it.

The reply was: We will supply some additional standard items such as additional cabinet doors, hardware etc, however we do not supply any items that are considered custom. Unfortunately, shelves fall into this category.

Three things seem very strange to me:
1. The Build Sheet is a contract that I cannot change without a penalty, but ETI can.
2, They cannot predict the size of shelf that will fit in the cabinet.
3. They will not build a shelf even if I take responsibility for making it fit.

I am sure that from a certain perspective this makes sense. Can anyone help me find it?

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by gmchamplin

I am sure that from a certain perspective this makes sense. Can anyone help me find it?

I guess it would be cold comfort to know that there have been other similar situations. When we walked around the demo 19 I specifically noted and stated that I was happy to see that the water filler was the type that had the locking door. When we picked up our trailer I was disappointed to see that it didn't have the door. I was told the reason was that they're not available anymore. Looks like the RV places didn't get the message because I found some easy enough.

I find your situation disappointing given the reason stated. It's not even as if the part is no longer available. My view is that you have a contract specifying 4 shelves. Too bad for them if it's more difficult and that it'll take a few minutes more to install them. If they don't want to do that anymore in the future then don't allow it in the contract.

Quite frankly, I'm surprised that they've taken this stance. Certainly not a good start to a relationship or good customer relations.

Ron

[padlin]

I do agree it's bad form to finalize the deal, then change the rules.

Personally, I'd either make and install them all myself, or get the 3, you'll probably find that 3 works out fine anyway. How's the saying go, don't sweat the small stuff?

[steve dunham]

I understand that the shelves are cut to fit a particular trailer.
I also understand the issue with the shelves being to small
What I don't understand is the issue with the shelves being too large.
If ETI furnished the shelves and they were too large , the customer could cut them to fit plus the shelf finish would match the cabinets.
Seem a rather arbitrary rule to me but then what do I know.

[advenas]

I made a visit to ETI before I entered an order for my 17B which I took delivery of in March of this year. I had lots of questions such as putting in a custom sink, changing the stove to a flush, etc. And there were a lot of "no" answers (as well as "yes"). And the reason for some of the "no" answers was because they are trying to standardize some of their processes. It was probably much easier to accommodate the many requests for changes when they were a smaller company. However, the demand for their product has grown and so has ETI...in a good way I might add. I got my trailer and I love it. Your request doesn't feel odd to me...but the answer might fall into the category of "standardization" if I read it right.

[cpaharley2008]

In the grand scheme of things, if that is the only issue you have with a close to $40K purchase, I'd be happy. Some things you can do yourself after delivery.

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

In the grand scheme of things, if that is the only issue you have with a close to $40K purchase, I'd be happy. Some things you can do yourself after delivery.

That could include cutting a shelf supplied uninstalled to fit. That's the aspect I really don't understand in this situation.

Ron

[cpaharley2008]

I'm sure they would provide a piece of uncut shelf wood for a price that one could cut later? Anyone check on that option? I had Escape provide me with some scrap paneling, which they did at no charge.

[Cypherian]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

I'm sure they would provide a piece of uncut shelf wood for a price that one could cut later? Anyone check on that option? I had Escape provide me with some scrap paneling, which they did at no charge.

"The reply was: We will supply some additional standard items such as additional cabinet doors, hardware etc, however we do not supply any items that are considered custom. Unfortunately, shelves fall into this category."

Cypher

[Cypherian]

Originally Posted by gmchamplin

I need a little perspective on my most recent interaction with ETI. I hope someone can help me.

We signed off our build sheet for a 5.0TA at the end of April. It included a full height cabinet to the right of the door with four shelves in it.

Last week I received an email informing me of a new policy that all shelves must be separated by at least 10 inches, because if they are closer together than that, they are too hard to install. Four shelves would not fit with this new policy.

I asked if they could just install the bottom shelf and let me install the other three.

The reply was: Installing the 1 shelf 10” from the bottom of the cabinet, will not be a problem however, the shelves are custom built as they go, therefore we would not be able to supply the additional 3 shelves. Due to the fact that all our trailers are custom, there might be slight changes in measurements, and if we supply one that is too large or too small it would cause issues for you.

I then asked if they could install three shelves, make a fourth shelf identical to the top one they installed, and let me take responsibility for installing it.

The reply was: We will supply some additional standard items such as additional cabinet doors, hardware etc, however we do not supply any items that are considered custom. Unfortunately, shelves fall into this category.

Three things seem very strange to me:
1. The Build Sheet is a contract that I cannot change without a penalty, but ETI can.
2, They cannot predict the size of shelf that will fit in the cabinet.
3. They will not build a shelf even if I take responsibility for making it fit.

I am sure that from a certain perspective this makes sense. Can anyone help me find it?

I did not buy my Escape new, with that said the issue as it appears to me is failure to meet a contract specification. I understand ETI's need to standardize some things to make manufacturing more streamlined. However, if you wish to stop doing or allowing things stop it , but you must if you have already accepted money and signed the contract follow through with the agreed upon items.

I can understand the not being able to predict the shelf size as the shells and other things vary to a certain extent. They do know the shelves can't be beyond a certain dimension based on the initial shelving frame dimensions. They could make them to the largest size thereby allowing the customer to cut down and install them on their own should be willing to so. As for the dimension height of 10 inches that would be dictated by the tools used to install them air nailer, screw guns etc .

Personally I would request a refund of the charges and request they just build the shelf frame and trim it . They use mainly oak and it would not be hard to match the stain they use or ignore the stain and paint the shelves you install a solid color of your choosing to match something in the trailer.

ETI knows they can change what they will and won't do at their leisure since, they are one of the only companies that will do custom touches regardless of the type of trailer. In the overall picture they make a very nice trailer for a very nice price .. Could some of the hardware and other items quality level be brought up yes but that would also increase the cost of the trailer so it is a damned if you do and damned if you don't dance.

Cypher

[Marry]

Hi Gary. This is unfortunate it happened, since you signed off your build sheet.
ETI takes the build sheets out of their file to go over it a few weeks prior to construction.
In the meantime policies changed. You get a phone call: "not according to policies" from one of ETI's workforce, only doing what was them told to.
In your case: I would pick up the phone, and talk directly with Tammy or Reace. They should have a solution which makes you and them happy.
Good luck with everything!! You will love your trailer! And hopefully the outcome of talking with "the bosses" themselves!

[Jim Bennett]

I would politely press the issue. It is tougher maybe, but could be done.

Is the issue with the fact these are built in shelves, and not loose shelf on cleats or angles? I know when I dismantled some of the shelves in my 5.0TA to do my custom cabinets, you could see they first fastened in a framework of 3/4x3/4 strips, with one across the middle, then skinned both sides with the panelling, finishing with a front trim. What you could do is ask for some pieces to build this in yourself.

I know your build sheet is in already, but we just have the countertop there, and it is by far the most used piece of real estate in the trailer as we marshal lots of stuff to go outside there, plus it is our charging station for electronics. I highly recommend the counter over closed storage there, but we all have our own needs.

[Rossue]

Agree with the counterspace on top of the cabinet. Cannot imagine not having that space adjacent to the bed in our 21. I know some do a drawer stack there too.

[thoer]

For us too, that countertop space is invaluable in our 21'.

[Chapitre]

Love the counter in our 5TA - would have it if doing it all over again.

[nathanj04011]

We got the full wardrobe with no counter and love it. Would do the same again. (Well, someone had to say it![emoji16])


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[gmchamplin]

Thank you all for your perspective, and wisdom.

I especially appreciated:

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

Is the issue with the fact these are built in shelves, and not loose shelf on cleats or angles? I know when I dismantled some of the shelves in my 5.0TA to do my custom cabinets, you could see they first fastened in a framework of 3/4x3/4 strips, with one across the middle, then skinned both sides with the paneling, finishing with a front trim.

and:

Originally Posted by padlin

How's the saying go, don't sweat the small stuff?

We decided to keep the full height cabinet with three shelves, and not worry about it.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by gmchamplin

... and not worry about it.

Sounds like an excellent idea!

[NW Cat Owner]

Originally Posted by nathanj04011

We got the full wardrobe with no counter and love it. Would do the same again. (Well, someone had to say it!

As well as the one we have in our 21. I first saw in a photo on a 5.0 (not yours Nathan) and really liked the idea. Everyone has different needs and for us the full size cabinet works out far better than a countertop.

I can well imagine the frustration/anger/disbelief/whatever of the OP. Been there when ours was getting built as well as when I picked it up and something that I thought was going to get done didn't.

I think you'll be quite happy with a 10" gap between the shelves. I'm not sure what ours are as they didn't give us that sort of restriction.