BlackJack is going on a diet......

[cpaharley2008]

Just received a call from a new 21' Escape owner in Montana, he works at one of the weigh stations there and on our trip home from Osoyoos, we stopped for to show him our trailer tour and also got weighed. BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight.
I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue.
So it appears I have close to 500 pounds of "Stuff" plus 125# in the tongue box. I'm thinking I do not need 3 coffee machines nor cast iron cookware in the unit all the time, I can add this stuff back if I know I'll be using it, but otherwise I'm going to "slim down" and try to shave off a couple of hundred pounds. Will help on gas also.
Unless it has been used in past year, I'm taking it out.

[MyronL]

Cast iron cookware? Too drastic.

[cpaharley2008]

That plus 4 chairs and 2 tables....

[dbailey]

Simplifying is good, but do you really think it will make much difference to your fuel consumption?

[Loren & Cathy]

I kind of was plugging in 4300 # for a gross trailer weight and this seems to be in the ball park and from what I have read. Will just have to see how it weighs out in the end. Are your weights with empty tanks? Loren

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Just received a call from a new 21' Escape owner in Montana, he works at one of the weigh stations there and on our trip home from Osoyoos, we stopped for to show him our trailer tour and also got weighed. BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight.
I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue.
So it appears I have close to 500 pounds of "Stuff" plus 125# in the tongue box. I'm thinking I do not need 3 coffee machines nor cast iron cookware in the unit all the time, I can add this stuff back if I know I'll be using it, but otherwise I'm going to "slim down" and try to shave off a couple of hundred pounds. Will help on gas also.
Unless it has been used in past year, I'm taking it out.

Hi: cpaharley2008... Don't forget the "Slim fast". Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[Catchlight]

cpaharley2008 wrote: "BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight. I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue."

I haven't had a chance to weigh our two-month old Escape 21, but from what the scales told Jim and the other owner there's a good chance its total weight is greater than we thought.

We had it packed lightly on our recent 4-week trip, but our towing experience has us pretty sure we'll upgrade our V6 SUV to a V8 pickup before we tow again. It will be nice to have more power on the hills, and not worry about the additional weight of every item we might like to take along.

Here's the V6 vs. V8 thread:
http://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f1...tion-4763.html

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight.
I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue.
So it appears I have close to 500 pounds of "Stuff" plus 125# in the tongue box.

Can I assume that this meant that the "from the factory" weight was 3300 lb total, with 375 lb of that on the tongue, for a 2925 lb axle weight? This is 250 lb over the published dry weight spec (presumably due to options), and would put Blackjack's cargo at 500 lb total, including any water and including the 125 lb which shows up on the tongue. This assumes that Blackjack's options are the same as the other unit.

I think 500 pounds of cargo (including water) is pretty reasonable. Last time we used our trailer, we had closer to 600 pounds of water plus cargo.

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

I'm thinking I do not need 3 coffee machines nor cast iron cookware in the unit all the time...

I have always found the use of cast iron cookware in a lightweight fiberglass trailer amusing, but if that is part of what makes the camping experience enjoyable, then it belongs in the trailer.

I agree with the "haven't used it, don't need to carry it" logic. I wish I were better at implementing that system

[gbaglo]

I've now got a box under the bed and I put "useless" stuff in it. That way, if my wife misses it, mentions it or deems it not to be "useless", it is still available, but out of the way.
At the end of the season, I can safely empty the box.

[cpaharley2008]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

Can I assume that this meant that the "from the factory" weight was 3300 lb total, with 375 lb of that on the tongue, for a 2925 lb axle weight? This is 250 lb over the published dry weight spec (presumably due to options), and would put Blackjack's cargo at 500 lb total, including any water and including the 125 lb which shows up on the tongue. This assumes that Blackjack's options are the same as the other unit.

I think 500 pounds of cargo (including water) is pretty reasonable. Last time we used our trailer, we had closer to 600 pounds of water plus cargo.


I have always found the use of cast iron cookware in a lightweight fiberglass trailer amusing, but if that is part of what makes the camping experience enjoyable, then it belongs in the trailer.

I agree with the "haven't used it, don't need to carry it" logic. I wish I were better at implementing that system

No, Brian, the weights shown are separate thus you add them to get total weight, thus
mine was 4300# with 2/3 fresh water and 1/3 waste tanks and the new one was 3675# from the factory with options

[float5]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Just received a call from a new 21' Escape owner in Montana, he works at one of the weigh stations there and on our trip home from Osoyoos, we stopped for to show him our trailer tour and also got weighed. BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight.
I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue.
So it appears I have close to 500 pounds of "Stuff" plus 125# in the tongue box. I'm thinking I do not need 3 coffee machines nor cast iron cookware in the unit all the time, I can add this stuff back if I know I'll be using it, but otherwise I'm going to "slim down" and try to shave off a couple of hundred pounds. Will help on gas also.
Unless it has been used in past year, I'm taking it out.

Not sure that is bad to have 500 worth plus box. I have the idea that 19's are just over 3000 with options in many cases and people seem to have often added 700-800 lbs to that. Can't be sure of that 3000 number as it would be good to have more owners providing numbers.

I expect some 21's are loaded past you. Still, you might not want 3? Coffee makers. If in fact 19's are loaded to 3000 with options only and 21's are loaded to 3300, that is less than the difference I was expecting. Again though, everyone differs, of course. Have to look carefully at the options included.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

No, Brian, the weights shown are separate thus you add them to get total weight, thus mine was 4300# with 2/3 fresh water and 1/3 waste tanks...

Thanks, Jim.
So I guess this was a typo:

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

BlackJack was 3300# on the axles plus 500# tongue weight.

and you must have meant that Blackjack was 3800 (not 3300) pounds on the axles, plus 500 pounds of tongue weight (wet and loaded). There's no way to add 3300 and 500 to get 4300, even in tax accounting.

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

... the new one was 3675# from the factory with options

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

I asked him today what his weight was on his unit, from the factory is 3300# and 375# on the tongue.

Okay, now we have a unit (the new one, not Blackjack) which is 625 pounds over the spec empty and dry weight. That's a lot of options!

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

So it appears I have close to 500 pounds of "Stuff" plus 125# in the tongue box.

Sure that makes 625 pounds (Blackjack's wet/loaded total of 4300 pounds less the other unit's dry/empty 3675 pounds) of water and other stuff added to Blackjack. Still not unreasonable to me, especially since about one-third of that is water. The 125 pound tongue/hitch weight difference doesn't mean that the box on the front contains 125 pounds of stuff... it could be much more or as little as zero. If you started with 3300 lb (axle) / 375 lb (hitch) and added all 625 pounds in one spot a couple feet ahead of the axle centre, you would get the same 3800 lb (axle) / 500 lb (hitch) distribution. The change in total and tongue/hitch weight tells you how much stuff and the average position, but not how it is distributed.

[Brian B-P]

Three coffee makers might make sense, if they are different types, used for different purposes, and of moderate size. I have a AeroPress, a Melitta filter holder, and an Italian espresso maker (Bialetti style, but small and random off-brand) that probably don't weigh 3 pounds in total. On the other hand, a massive powered espresso machine, an electric drip machine, and another big appliance would be a massive pile of stuff to carry

[padlin]

Originally Posted by Floating Cloud

Not sure that is bad to have 500 worth plus box. I have the idea that 19's are just over 3000 with options in many cases and people seem to have often added 700-800 lbs to that. Can't be sure of that 3000 number as it would be good to have more owners providing numbers.

Jon has a bunch of 19's on his list.
http://lakeshoreimages.com/spreadsheets/Weight.xls

[float5]

Those are Frederick's from fiberglassrv and I have used them many times.

[TAfraser]

Jim, you had me confused also. My 21, with options was around 3700 lbs, empty. When fully loaded it weighed in at 4250# last summer. A friend just picked up their 21 and stayed with us for a few days. Their empty unit, as measured by Escape, was 3800# including their options. So Blackjack appears to be in the ball park.
Tom

[cpaharley2008]

Yes, the 3800# was the correct plus the #500= 4300#, my eyes are slowly failing me from over use!!!! Yes, 3 different types of coffee makers, electric, stove top and campfire hardy, 3 different filters, etc.....yada,,, yada.....

[Jim Bennett]

Every year we do similar to what baglo does, but without the separate box. It is usually in the spring when we check the trailers outfitting. If something hasn't been used for a year, it almost certainly comes out, and even lesser used items we question as to whether we have another alternative with us already. There is a shelf in the garage with items that may come for a single trip, if deemed necessary including. a big griddle for the stove, pie-irons, bug tent, hammock, deep fryer for turkey, some games and toys, extra chairs (we only carry two), etc. This not only keeps our weight down, it makes things easier to find and store. We do carry a few things in our tow vehicle, but everything else fits nicely in the trailer, and that is without the front storage box. We even have space left over we could use, if needed.

Maybe not everybody's style, but it works great for us, and we still manage to have hordes of fun.