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Old 09-04-2016, 11:38 AM   #1
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Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Portsmouth, Virginia
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Escape 19 or 21?

Hi folks, we have narrowed down our search to an Escape 19 but after researching this site I noticed there are at least a few people who have upgraded from the 19 to the 21. One thing that would keep us from upgrading to the 21 would be that the queen size bed in the 19 is a high priority for us and as far as I can see, the bed in the 21' is smaller. Can you get a queen bed in the 21? For those who upgraded from the 19 to the 21, could I ask why you made the move?

For the foreseeable future we would be towing with a 2008 4x4 4Runner with the V8 and standard towing package which specifies a 7000# limit, so I am not sure if my TV would be insufficient for a 21. From reading posts on this forum I am under the impression that my TV would handle a 19 with no problem but on that long trip back, what are some thoughts on needing sway or weight distributing hitch equipment? I've towed a 3500# boat before for considerable distance and had no issues.

We are a couple in our 50's, of average build and height and would be using the camper for weekend or week-long trips with one dog. Our maiden voyage would be from the east cost out to BC with the 4Runner to return with the camper so I would like to leave with a margin of safety when we do.

Being the planner that I am, I have also wondered if it's possible to rent a 1/2 ton extended cab pickup locally for the approximate 6k mile excursion, just to have something newer for the long trip.

I have other questions as well but thought I better keep it simple on this first inquiry.

I really have enjoyed reading the forum so far, so thanks for all the wonderful input from all of you.

John in Portsmouth, VA
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Old 09-04-2016, 11:50 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironhorsenva View Post
Hi folks, we have narrowed down our search to an Escape 19 but after researching this site I noticed there are at least a few people who have upgraded from the 19 to the 21. One thing that would keep us from upgrading to the 21 would be that the queen size bed in the 19 is a high priority for us and as far as I can see, the bed in the 21' is smaller. Can you get a queen bed in the 21?
No, there's no queen in the 21. BUT, it's pretty wide, and to be honest, I don't think those extra couple of inches in width would make much of a difference. Go with the floorplan you like, and that meets your needs. Some much prefer the 21 because there's no "crawl over" when exiting the bed. You can just scoot down to the foot of it and get out/in. We on the other hand prefer the 19 because we like the bed "tucked away" instead of being there as you come in the door. Your choice. Of course, the 21 is larger, has a larger dinette, and more storage and counter space as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironhorsenva View Post
For the foreseeable future we would be towing with a 2008 4x4 4Runner with the V8 and standard towing package which specifies a 7000# limit, so I am not sure if my TV would be insufficient for a 21. From reading posts on this forum I am under the impression that my TV would handle a 19 with no problem but on that long trip back, what are some thoughts on needing sway or weight distributing hitch equipment? I've towed a 3500# boat before for considerable distance and had no issues.
If you have 7000 lbs of towing capacity, the 21 would be well within that. But, you'll want to know your Gross Combined weight rating, and you'll want to pay attention to the payload capacity of your tow.
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Old 09-04-2016, 12:01 PM   #3
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I think the 21 bed is 54x80, or what's sometimes called a full wide by queen long. We flopped down on Dave & Kathies 21 when we were considering 19/21 decisions and found it worked fine for us, and I'm 6-1, 195 lbs.

The crawlover issue becomes more of an issue with getting older - something to consider.

Our road weight is 4220, but I believe the base 21 is a heavier now. Our Taco does fine with it (6400 lb rated)
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Old 09-04-2016, 01:11 PM   #4
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the 21' having the bathroom in the front means there is more "aisle" width (4" I think) that makes moving about feel easier in a 21'

plus i think that means the bathroom in a 21' is a bit bigger.

plus the lack of crawl over in a 21' is a must for us. makes for better and easier sleep.

plus we dont mind the bed being near the door. some might

plus we like the dinette at the rear. further away from campsite road. more likely looking at the view.

plus the 21' is not much more $

the 21' weight increased less than the 19' did for the 2017 models, i believe.

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Old 09-04-2016, 01:23 PM   #5
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21

For us the21 being only $1500 or so more you get a window over kitchen cabinet and 4 in. more aisle room bigger counters and more storage the weight is only 400 lb or so and 1 and 1/2ft more . For me i would have gotten the 5 TA but my wife does not like trucks
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Old 09-04-2016, 02:14 PM   #6
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I went from a 19 to a 21 and now back to a 19. Several reasons being that when the 21's when first introduced they were offered at the same price as a 19 and with Escape's holding their value I was able to sell my 19 for what it cost me. Other than sales taxes, registration and delivery it was almost no cost to me !!!(it is called government math).

Then when the newer style trailers were offered with price increases I sold my 21 for what a new fully optioned 19 costs (then again I still have to pay sales taxes) but I'm driving out for pick up. I was initially thinking of the 5,0 TA but the hitch issue and truck bed plus weight kept me away.

I like the bed surrounded with awning windows and better insulation and the front dinette surrounded with awning style windows. Bath is smaller, but I'm only in it 15 minutes a day.
Plus I can now see around the trailer with my mirrors and pulling maybe 4-500 lbs less weight.
For 2 people it is fine, if you have children you may want the bigger model.
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Old 09-04-2016, 02:39 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Ironhorsenva View Post
One thing that would keep us from upgrading to the 21 would be that the queen size bed in the 19 is a high priority for us and as far as I can see, the bed in the 21' is smaller. Can you get a queen bed in the 21?
The width of the bed in the 21' fills all of the available space between the outside street-side wall and the interior wall along the side of the bathroom, so there is no way to fit in a wider bed.
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Old 09-04-2016, 02:48 PM   #8
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I'm in Molded Fiberglass trailers because I believe in smaller, similar to the tiny homes movement that is happening now. When we got our first Escape 17b we saw we could have small and very comfortable. Kinda like the three lil pigs, the 17 was too small for us, the 21 was too big for us, and the 19 is just right.... Love having the full Queen bed in the back, crawl over is a non issue for us, and when it comes time to wash/wax I don't want any more trailer to maintain at my advancing age. Everyone has different needs/wants but those are ours. Good luck with ur decision...
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Old 09-04-2016, 02:50 PM   #9
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The difference in width is 6", about the same as the length of a US dollar bill. If you each normally sleep right up to the edge of your queen, you'd each miss 3" by getting the double in the 21'. Also no crawl over in the middle of the night.


All this is easy for me to say, I sleep on a twin in a queen loft!
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Old 09-04-2016, 02:52 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironhorsenva View Post
For the foreseeable future we would be towing with a 2008 4x4 4Runner with the V8 and standard towing package which specifies a 7000# limit, so I am not sure if my TV would be insufficient for a 21.
That's literally a ton of towing capacity extra, although the real answer is not quite that simple...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rbryan4 View Post
If you have 7000 lbs of towing capacity, the 21 would be well within that. But, you'll want to know your Gross Combined weight rating, and you'll want to pay attention to the payload capacity of your tow.
Yes. Fortunately, the 7,000 pound towing capacity means that the Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR; allowed total weight of 4Runner and trailer, both with contents) must be at least 7,000 pounds more than the curb weight (empty but ready-to-drive) of the 4Runner. That means that if the trailer is never more than 5,000 pounds, there is still at least a ton (2,000 pounds) left to GCWR... so a ton of passenger and cargo. A 4Runner can't really carry a ton, because the payload capacity is not that high.

Payload capacity is the difference between the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR; maximum allowed weight of 4Runner with everything it is carrying) and the curb weight. I agree that this is the rating to watch, and the limitation for many vehicles considered for a 21'. Remember that the payload includes all people, cargo in the trailer, and a few hundred pounds of trailer tongue weight carried on the hitch.
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