Observations from first trip in 17B - Page 2 - Escape Trailer Owners Community
Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×

Go Back   Escape Trailer Owners Community > Escape Me | General Topics > General Escape
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 05-20-2015, 02:00 PM   #21
Senior Member
 
santacruzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Santa Cruz, California
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19
Posts: 755
At one time I owned 2 FJ40's, am down to only one now, a '74. I was really hot to get one of the new FJ's when they were announced, but after the test drive and experiencing the limited visibility, I lost interest. I'm sure people can get used to it, but with the wide open visibility of the older models, I guess I was spoiled. Of course, I could NEVER tow a travel trailer with the FJ40.
__________________
2019 Tundra CrewMax Limited TRD 4WD
2014 Escape 19
santacruzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 03:11 PM   #22
Site Team
 
rbryan4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Canyon Lake, Texas
Trailer: 2015 19 "Past Tents", 2021 F150 Lariat 2.7L EB
Posts: 10,222
Quote:
Originally Posted by ice-breaker View Post
I assume that your FJ does not have a back-up camera? The factory installed back-up camera in my 2011 FJ allows me to back in to the correct spot on my own with only a "stop and check moment" to confirm the final placement.
I'll second the usefulness of a good backup camera. When we were in Idaho on our way back to Texas, a very "helpful" fellow camper insisted on giving me hand directions while I backed in to hook up. I think he got the idea that he wasn't needed when I was able to backup and stop dead center, with the ball ever so slightly in front of the receiver so that when I cranked down it slipped right on. Love the zoom feature!
__________________
"You can't buy happiness, but you can buy an RV. And that is pretty close."
rbryan4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 03:56 PM   #23
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Brantingham Lake, New York
Trailer: 2001 coachmen
Posts: 274
Sounds like your maiden voyage was fun!
I had to chuckle on the awning! Seems like during orientation, one can be present in body but not fully in mind. Too excited with your mind thinking ahead and all the information isn't retained.

That being said....while retracting the awning for the first time....I apparently didn't pay attention to the "guide it back slowly" part! That sucker retracted with a quickness...and slammed creating the loudest snap...we both ducked! Opps!

Thanks for your insights...every bit of information is truly appreciated!
reetired is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 06:31 PM   #24
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: 2016 19 / Toyota 4Runner 2019
Posts: 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumstick63 View Post
Just curious... what leveler did you buy at O'Connor RV?


Thanks,
Mark
Mark
Here is a picture of the leveler. Lost the receipt but I think it was $30CDN. Almost nothing in $US.
Attached Thumbnails
IMG_20150520_172433.jpg  
__________________
Hugh
hughharden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 06:41 PM   #25
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: 2016 19 / Toyota 4Runner 2019
Posts: 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by santacruzer View Post
At one time I owned 2 FJ40's, am down to only one now, a '74. I was really hot to get one of the new FJ's when they were announced, but after the test drive and experiencing the limited visibility, I lost interest. I'm sure people can get used to it, but with the wide open visibility of the older models, I guess I was spoiled. Of course, I could NEVER tow a travel trailer with the FJ40.
You will love this photo. Taken on a trip to Oman while I lived in the Emirates. And yes it was running.
Attached Thumbnails
Picture 129.jpg  
__________________
Hugh
hughharden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 07:04 PM   #26
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: 2016 19 / Toyota 4Runner 2019
Posts: 343
Quote:
Originally Posted by ice-breaker View Post
Congratulations on your new Escape.
I'm curious what kind of mileage you get towing the 19 with the FJ. Mine totally sucked the fuel towing the 17B, granted it was all in the mountains. I got 250 to 300 km/ tank compared to usual 440/ 450.
__________________
Hugh
hughharden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 09:56 PM   #27
Senior Member
 
Dave Walter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 2013 19' & 2013 15B
Posts: 2,634
Quote:
Originally Posted by hughharden View Post
I'm curious what kind of mileage you get towing the 19 with the FJ. Mine totally sucked the fuel towing the 17B, granted it was all in the mountains. I got 250 to 300 km/ tank compared to usual 440/ 450.
I get about 22-25 impg not towing and about 14-16 impg towing.
__________________
2013 19' \ 2013 15B, 2020 Toyota 4Runner TRD Offroad

"It is better to remain silent at the risk of being thought a fool, than to talk and remove all doubt of it." - 1907, Maurice Switzer
Dave Walter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2015, 11:11 PM   #28
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
Quote:
Originally Posted by hughharden View Post
I'm curious what kind of mileage you get towing the 19 with the FJ. Mine totally sucked the fuel towing the 17B, granted it was all in the mountains. I got 250 to 300 km/ tank compared to usual 440/ 450.
That seems reasonable to me, even on flat land. If the 17B was 1500 kg, and the FJ about 2000 kg, that's 75% more weight, substantially more frontal area (for drag), and two more tires... and about 60% more fuel consumed.

The only vehicles which don't see a substantial fuel consumption increase when adding a trailer nearly as large as the tug are those that are not operating efficiently when unloaded, such as big pickups that go from lousy fuel economy (unloaded) to not much lousier (loaded).
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 01:18 AM   #29
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: Escape 17B, April 2014
Posts: 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post

The only vehicles which don't see a substantial fuel consumption increase when adding a trailer nearly as large as the tug are those that are not operating efficiently when unloaded, such as big pickups that go from lousy fuel economy (unloaded) to not much lousier (loaded).
How would you define substantial?
Our 17 B & our Sprinter van are almost identical in volume, and the 9 to 10 l/100km unloaded only increases to 10-12 l/100km when towing. We are pretty happy with the cost per km of hauling our trailer.
KLRchickie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 08:18 AM   #30
Senior Member
 
Dave Walter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 2013 19' & 2013 15B
Posts: 2,634
Quote:
Originally Posted by KLRchickie View Post
How would you define substantial?
Our 17 B & our Sprinter van are almost identical in volume, and the 9 to 10 l/100km unloaded only increases to 10-12 l/100km when towing. We are pretty happy with the cost per km of hauling our trailer.
Sprinters are an awesome vehicle and I have been keeping an eye out for one the past couple years.

Given the size of the Sprinter, towing a 17B would probably not change the frontal area, and there would be very little change in wind resistance to impact your mileage. Also, Sprinters have diesel engines and are a favorite of many who use them for commercial and personal use. Your experience with only a small increase in fuel consumption while towing is entirely consistent with what I would expect from your trailer-tug combination.
__________________
2013 19' \ 2013 15B, 2020 Toyota 4Runner TRD Offroad

"It is better to remain silent at the risk of being thought a fool, than to talk and remove all doubt of it." - 1907, Maurice Switzer
Dave Walter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 08:43 AM   #31
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: Escape 17B, April 2014
Posts: 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by ice-breaker View Post
Sprinters are an awesome vehicle and I have been keeping an eye out for one the past couple years.

Given the size of the Sprinter, towing a 17B would probably not change the frontal area, and there would be very little change in wind resistance to impact your mileage. Also, Sprinters have diesel engines and are a favorite of many who use them for commercial and personal use. Your experience with only a small increase in fuel consumption while towing is entirely consistent with what I would expect from your trailer-tug combination.
Exactly. Which is why I found the broad generalization I quoted irritating.
KLRchickie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 10:46 AM   #32
Senior Member
 
santacruzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Santa Cruz, California
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19
Posts: 755
Quote:
Originally Posted by hughharden View Post
You will love this photo. Taken on a trip to Oman while I lived in the Emirates. And yes it was running.
What a sad picture for such a stalwart vehicle!
__________________
2019 Tundra CrewMax Limited TRD 4WD
2014 Escape 19
santacruzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 06:44 PM   #33
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
Quote:
Originally Posted by KLRchickie View Post
How would you define substantial?
Our 17 B & our Sprinter van are almost identical in volume, and the 9 to 10 l/100km unloaded only increases to 10-12 l/100km when towing. We are pretty happy with the cost per km of hauling our trailer.
That's a 20% increase in fuel consumption: I'd call that substantial, but the incremental fuel cost for the trailer is still very good (I'd be happy, too - it's better than my tug ), and even the unloaded consumption is great. I think the shape of the van aerodynamically suits towing a trailer well, and the engine is at a good point in its operating range when working to tow the trailer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ice-breaker View Post
Sprinters are an awesome vehicle and I have been keeping an eye out for one the past couple years.

Given the size of the Sprinter, towing a 17B would probably not change the frontal area, and there would be very little change in wind resistance to impact your mileage. Also, Sprinters have diesel engines and are a favorite of many who use them for commercial and personal use. Your experience with only a small increase in fuel consumption while towing is entirely consistent with what I would expect from your trailer-tug combination.
I agree with all of this, although for my use the current Sprinter is too large (much bigger than the first generation); fortunately, additional modern van choices are becoming available (such as the Ford Transit - not the Transit Connect).

These vans have engine choices (even the Sprinter was available with a gasoline engine for a while, perhaps only in the U.S.) so they are not all diesel, but the aerodynamics would apply regardless of the engine. The current Sprinter has two diesel engine sizes - I suspect that the larger one would better suit towing; the smaller one might do better unloaded but suffer more from adding the trailer, especially if asked to tow at the speed of most highway traffic. In the Ram ProMaster, the gas engine is apparently very popular - all the motorhomes based on it that I have seen are gas. The Transit offers three engine choices, including an EcoBoost V6 the same as available in an F-150; an F-150 versus Transit comparison would be interesting.

If looking for a used Sprinter, watch for rust... it seems to be a problem with this model, even here in dry and low-salt Alberta.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KLRchickie View Post
Exactly. Which is why I found the broad generalization I quoted irritating.
I try to avoid broad generalizations, but this is about physical reality, rather than stereotypes. Is it less irritating when you realize that it is not a criticism of your tow vehicle? My comment actually wasn't a criticism of anyone's choice, just an observation about reasonable expectations. I should have used some more specific term than "significant" - sorry about that!


One thing that complicates the comparison for many people is that they are comparing apples and oranges: their highway towing speed is lower than their highway non-towing speed, for instance. That - plus the big-pickup effect I mentioned to set this off - explains the "I get the same mileage towing or not" comments that I occasionally see; those comments seem to set some unrealistic expectations.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 06:56 PM   #34
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
Quote:
Originally Posted by KLRchickie View Post
Our 17 B & our Sprinter van are almost identical in volume...
The Escape is about half the weight of the Sprinter, so the trailer isn't as big a factor in the weight aspect as many combinations (similar weight tugs with heavier trailers). So, when I referred to "adding a trailer nearly as large as the tug " it should have been "adding a trailer nearly as heavy as and larger in volume than the tug"... which is an Escape 19' added to a Toyota FJ Cruiser.

I assume that's highway fuel consumption - who tows a travel trailer around town all the time? I think you would likely see more difference in urban conditions (where the mass matters in stop-and-go operation) than in highway conditions (where it's mostly about air drag), especially with the van/trailer combo... but that's only an educated guess.
Brian B-P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2015, 07:38 PM   #35
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Trailer: Escape 17B, April 2014
Posts: 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
Is it less irritating when you realize that it is not a criticism of your tow vehicle?
Nope.

I didn't take it as such - my irritation was truly with the broad generalization (only and never are words I dislike using....). Paraphrasing a bit, the statement "only vehicles with $ucky mileage to begin with don't take a big na$ty mileage hit" just bit me the wrong way last night.

Usually I am better at keeping my keyboard quiet and not responding to such things... The Sprinter gets such good, non-sucky mileage that I chose to point it out --- though it certainly is an exception, and there are other factors like aerodynamics and weight, which seemed too glossed over in the original "nearly as large" remark. We don't look at the fuel economy change in terms of percentage, we look at it in terms of overall cost added to the trip by hauling the trailer, thus we consider it "insignificant" & easily recouped by the savings of having our kitchen and bedroom along.

The current biggest size of Sprinter is huge! Too long for our driveway... (neat in the sense they could likely haul all our motorcycles at once, but just too big.) Ours is the baby Sprinter from 2005, smaller than the smallest one you can get currently. We are anxious to see what some of these "new in Canada" full size cargo vans get for fuel economy, for when the time comes to replace our current van (hopefully not soon...).

I won't go any further down the Sprinter rabbit hole than to say - the rust was a Mercedes issue, not a driving environment issue.
KLRchickie is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Escape Trailer Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:35 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2023 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.