Tow vehicle decision

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by escape artist

Biggest diff. is watching the trailer ride in the mirror. Much smother, less bouncy and it seams to push back easier into campsites, driveways etc. The dual axle set up seems better suited to the large turning radius of the Frontier.

I have to wonder how much of this is the extra trailer length (from pin to axle), unrelated to the number of axles or type of suspension... but none of this has much to do with the original tow vehicle question.

[Loren & Cathy]

When it comes to a tow vehicle, I like a lot of unused capacity in reserve. A year ago we were quite sure that the trailer was going to be a 17 ft. Casita so I ordered a GMC 1500 4 wheel drive, 5.3 V-8 with the max tow package rated for 11200 pounds. Hitch capacity is 800 pounds. Now we have discovered Escape and it is going to be either a 19 or 21 ft. We will choose after we see them. We might even like the 17. Anyway if it is a 21, I would not care to pull with anything smaller. We are planning to do some serious boondocking and may have 3 or 4 hundred pounds of gear in the box including extra water. With a little extra capacity, a lot of other options are open. And yes, the owners manual tells you to break in the vehicle before you tow. New trailer in 2015, Alaska in 2016. Loren

[Loren & Cathy]

Just read where GM is going to use the J2807 standard for towing capacity so this lowers it to 10800 pounds. Give yourself a little extra room as all manufacturers are notorious for stretching things. Loren

[gharper]

I would go with a full size pickup to tow a 21 particularly if this is the reason for the purchase. If it's a daily driver in the city perhaps a Frontier. Our Highlander pulls the 19 fine over the Coquihalla and Rockies, however, I would like to have more power and feel a firmer connection to the road in some rough northern BC/Alberta highways. We drop to 3rd on the Coquihalla steep parts and anymore weight I could see using 2nd (that's with empty tanks and keeping weight down).

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Loren & Cathy

Just read where GM is going to use the J2807 standard for towing capacity so this lowers it to 10800 pounds. Give yourself a little extra room as all manufacturers are notorious for stretching things. Loren

Thanks for the heads-up that the new ratings are out.
2015 GMC Sierra 1500 Maintains 12,000-lb. Max Trailering
Revised ratings based on new, industrywide SAE J2807 calculations

Given the small change from the old ratings, it's surprising that GM whined for so long about adopting J2807 as they said they would.

Anyway, the rating is about double the weight of any Escape by the old standard or the new.

[Catchlight]

We're sticking with our Plan A, which is to pick up our 21' at ETI in Chilliwack in mid-September, and tow it over various mountain passes to Waterton Lakes NP in the Rockies with our 2011 4Runner SUV, which has a 5000 pound towing capacity. We'll know after that trip if we need a TV with a higher tow rating.

The 4Runner's 4 Liter V6 has more horsepower (270 @5600rpm) and slightly more torque (278@4400rpm) than Toyota's Tacoma pickup, which is rated to tow 6400 pounds, so power should be adequate. Other plusses include the 4Runner's body on frame build, transmission cooler, and HD alternator. With its shorter wheelbase, though, stability could be a limiting factor.

Reace says the 21' will weigh 4300 pounds loaded, about 500 pounds more than the 19'. There's just the two of us, our only toys are two folding bikes, and we plan to take minimal "stuff" and tow with the tanks dry. We've opted for the Andersen hitch.

Our 4Runner is a great daily driver and handles winter conditions and logging roads well. We have no other reason to own a pickup truck, so we're hoping the 4Runner does the job with safety and stability.

The most appealing option is Toyota's Sequoia SUV, which has a similar frame and engine to the full-sized Tundra truck, and will tow 8000 pounds. But it's big, thirsty, and expensive to buy, so here's hoping our current vehicle is up to the task.

We will post about our Rockies trip on this forum in late September.

[alanmalk]

We're sticking with our plan "B". Plan "A" was 5.0TA and Tundra combination, which was reluctantly abandoned for a number of reasons.

Plan "B" is Escape 21 plus Tacoma. This was chosen because: a pull-behind trailer allows us to keep a topper on the truck and store our many toys. The smaller truck will be not only a TV but also a daily-driver and a tame off-road traveler for those times we adventure beyond the road limits of any trailer. Basically, we need 3 types of vehicles but can only afford 1, so a compromise was needed.

The Tacoma as noted has a very similar drive train to the newer 4-Runners (oh, how I miss my 4-Runner) but with a bigger capacity for both personal junk and towing and longer wheelbase. And having a 30-40% more powerful engine than my now-lost '95 4-Runner, I'm in torque heaven. 4000 pounds on my tail should bring me back to earth. The Tacoma also has the full tow package, stiffer TRD package and manual transmission, all of which I am counting on to make the towing tolerable.

--
Alan

[cpaharley2008]

Not to muddy the water but there is mention of a small diesel Colorado coming out 2015 Chevy Colorado, GMC Canyon To Offer I4 Duramax Diesel | GM Authority

[rbryan4]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Not to muddy the water but there is mention of a small diesel Colorado coming out 2015 Chevy Colorado, GMC Canyon To Offer I4 Duramax Diesel | GM Authority

Yeah, there has been a lot of chatter about the 4 cyl diesel. But, won't be out until 2016.

http://blog.bushwacker.com/7039/news...lorado-diesel/

[padlin]

Alan, why a manual?

[MyronL]

My new daily driver/tow vehicle, 4wd 5.3L V-8 (uses from 8 to 4 valves automatically) averaged 21.5 mpg (city/highway) not towing recently, (thanks Tonneau cover?). Tow capacity 5200-6200 pounds depending on what I read.

Haven't made really big trip towing yet, but are in love again. Probably won't wait until late Sept trip north rim of the Grand Canyon.

'14 Silverado double cab short bed. The maroon balloon. Nice flaps, eh? Also has insanely amazing dashboard graphics info.

[cpaharley2008]

they should help protect your trailer...

[MyronL]

Exactly why I special ordered them, Jim. Hey--and nice drip caps you got there.

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by padlin

Alan, why a manual?

Personal belief that I can decided in advance what the proper gear should be, while an automatic can only react to conditions after it encounters them. Plus we live in Colorado and there's no flat driving between home and camping (fishing, skiing, etc.). Plus I've been driving manuals for longer than I will admit in public and just plain like shifting (except in rush hour).

If nothing else, a manual seems to save my brakes from overuse. I would take the old 4-Runner into a dealer/brake repair shop and they always (15 years!) tell me - "nope, nothing needed". As Click&Clack might say - "That's a missed opportunity to make a boat payment..."

--
Alan

[smilycook]

It will be interesting to hear about towing experiences from Alan and Catchlight after a couple of months. For a lot of our camping we have to bring water with us so that tends to weight us down going into the high country. Cresting some of the higher passes we can defiantly feel the power loss. I would say we generally carry an extra 800 to 1000lbs in the trailer and 4runner once you take into account 2 adults/2 kids/2 dogs/ 4 bikes/ and all the items that go along with it.

A supercharger might be in Alan's future otherwise I see a 21 being hard to pull in the high mountains of Colorado.

Lost HP New HP Elevation
8.1 261.9 1000
16.2 253.8 2000
24.3 245.7 3000
32.4 237.6 4000
40.5 229.5 5000
48.6 221.4 6000
56.7 213.3 7000
64.8 205.2 8000
72.9 197.1 9000
81 189 10000

[cpaharley2008]

Originally Posted by rbryan4

Yeah, there has been a lot of chatter about the 4 cyl diesel. But, won't be out until 2016.

Chevrolet Colorado Diesel - Not Until 2016

Actually the 2015 GMC Canyon w/diesel is expected this October, 2014, 3 more months.
https://www.gmc.com/canyon-small-pic...ml#PERFORMANCE

[drpaddle]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Actually the 2015 GMC Canyon w/diesel is expected this October, 2014, 3 more months.
https://www.gmc.com/canyon-small-pic...ml#PERFORMANCE

I read it differently:

"The 2.8L Duramax® Turbo-Diesel joins the engine lineup in 2015 to deliver even bigger power to this smaller pickup."

[Brian B-P]

I agree with drpaddle: 2015 model year Colorado/Canyon (no diesel) this fall; with diesel (perhaps an early 2016 model year) arriving in 2015.

[rbryan4]

Yeah, the hype can be hard to decipher. But, GM insiders are saying in multiple interviews that the I-4 diesel (which has already been proven internationally) won't be an option until the 2016 model year -- October or so of 2015. They are apparently still deciding whether or not to offer a manual transmission with it. 368 ft lbs of torque and around 26 mpg? That sounds very appealing.

[dave macrae]

I seem to remember that I read somewhere that the truck will
Arrive this fall as a 2015 and the diesels will be a early release in early 2016 like the 3/4 and 1 tons were this year . They started arriving in early feb I believe .
I must admit I am very interested to see these when they arrive , the idea of perhaps obtaining somewhere around 20 ish mph while towing would be lovely