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Old 09-03-2015, 12:41 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox hunt View Post
Ok I get confused about all this high low pressure stuff. My campfire in a can came with a hose I attach it to my 10 pound tank and it works great. I wanted to use my weber with the 10pound tank instead of the little disposable tanks so I bought a hose from weber made for my little grill to use to attach it to the tank but I cannot get it to work.
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
You could also try swapping hoses. The campfire hose should work with the Weber and vice versa. I have no idea what brand my hoses are, or even where and when I bought them.
The brand of hose doesn't matter, but it needs the right ends.

The campfire in a can hose probably has a regulator on the end of it (probably a round aluminum lump), so it needs to get high-pressure propane, which just means the way it comes out of a tank or cylinder (of any size). The regulator is built into the Weber, which is why it gets propane direct from a tank or cylinder, too - normally a disposable cylinder screwed right onto the grill. Both of these appliances need the same propane pressure.

The only difference between these is the style of connector. One connector is like the opening on a bulk (e.g. 10-pound or 20-pound) tank; the other is like the end of a disposable cylinder. The extra hose from Weber (assuming it is the adapter hose) just has a different type of connector on each end.
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Old 09-03-2015, 01:07 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
If you open the tank valve too quickly, it can cause the the safety shut off in the tank to deploy, so no gas escapes.
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Originally Posted by LeonW View Post
... eventually I came across a post from a good ol boy who explained that there is a device in the tank that senses a sudden loss of pressure in the hose, assumes that there is a leak and shuts off the propane.
That's the excess flow valve. It is in the fitting on the end of the hose which attaches to the tank, not in the tank's valve assembly. It trips when the flow rate of propane is too high, sometimes due to propane rushing in to fill the hose to the appliance when the tank valve is opened.

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Originally Posted by LeonW View Post
Apparently there are different kinds of propane hoses, which can be distinguished by the color of the attachment at the tank end.
Yes, the QCC connectors come in three colours:
  • black: 50 SCFM or 100,000 BTU/hr
  • green: 100 SCFM or 200,000 BTU/hr
  • red: 200 SCFM or 400,000 BTU/hr
Even the regular "black" size should be enough for any single appliance, but I had problems at low temperatures in an RV with dual furnaces - the "green" helped somewhat.
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Old 09-03-2015, 01:14 AM   #43
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I donno. My understanding is that the OPD valve will shut off the tank if opened too quickly. I've got a couple hoses and I haven't examined them closely, but they appear quite simple.
Anyway, here is a site that appears to have good propane info.

Understanding Propane Bottle Valves - Troubleshooting LP Gas Cylinder Connections
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Old 09-03-2015, 02:08 PM   #44
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Fox Hunt. Did you solve the problem with your Weber and hose?

These the the ends on my hose.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Weber hose end.jpg (276.2 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg Weber hose end 2.jpg (330.8 KB, 6 views)
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Old 09-03-2015, 03:03 PM   #45
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Will look at it this weekend. I've been really busy at work. thanks for the help
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Old 09-03-2015, 06:11 PM   #46
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Napoleon regulator.jpgJust splurged and bought a Napoleon Travel Pro two-burner portable Q.
A different arrangement for the regulator. It's on the hose. I don't know, but perhaps that hose could be removed and quick connect hose attached. The control knobs are on the front, not combined with the regulator.
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File Type: jpg Napoleon hose connect.jpg (127.5 KB, 6 views)
File Type: jpg Napoleon Q controls.jpg (139.5 KB, 6 views)
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Old 09-03-2015, 11:36 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
These the the ends on my hose.
Nice illustration of what I was describing:
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Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
The regulator is built into the Weber, which is why it gets propane direct from a tank or cylinder, too - normally a disposable cylinder screwed right onto the grill...

... connector ... is like the end of a disposable cylinder. The extra hose from Weber (assuming it is the adapter hose) just has a different type of connector on each end.
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Old 09-03-2015, 11:40 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
Attachment 12848Just splurged and bought a Napoleon Travel Pro two-burner portable Q.
A different arrangement for the regulator. It's on the hose. I don't know, but perhaps that hose could be removed and quick connect hose attached. The control knobs are on the front, not combined with the regulator.
A good example of the type of setup used by a Campfire In A Can and commonly used for similar portable firepits:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B-P View Post
The campfire in a can hose probably has a regulator on the end of it (probably a round aluminum lump), so it needs to get high-pressure propane, which just means the way it comes out of a tank or cylinder (of any size)...
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Old 09-03-2015, 11:48 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
I donno. My understanding is that the OPD valve will shut off the tank if opened too quickly. I've got a couple hoses and I haven't examined them closely, but they appear quite simple.
Anyway, here is a site that appears to have good propane info.

Understanding Propane Bottle Valves - Troubleshooting LP Gas Cylinder Connections
The "excess flow" feature (which severely limits flow when an excessive flow rate is detected) is not in the tank valve assembly used on small (e.g. 20-pound) cylinders, although for most purposes the location doesn't matter. Since propane only flows when the hose is attached, there's no way to know just from experience which part (tank valve or hose-mounted hardware) is shutting off if the tank service valve is opened too quickly.

The current valve assembly on a tank is not a simple thing - it includes:
  1. hand-operated service valve (how you open and close the tank)
  2. Overfill Prevention Device - float valve that blocks filling when the level gets too high)
  3. bleeder valve - fixed 80% liquid level gauge (open this and propane comes out; when it starts spitting liquid stop filling)
  4. spring-loaded valve which blocks flow until a connector is fully inserted (this is the feature described on the page linked above)
... but it doesn't appear to include excess flow limiting.

Yes, the excess flow valve mechanism is quite simple (just a ball and spring in a chamber), so you don't even see it externally. Look for hoses or connectors and the term "excess flow" is associated with the QCC (new style) "nut" or POL (old style) "spud", not the tank valve. Look into the end of the QCC or POL connector and instead of just a plain hole into the hose, you can see that there's hardware in there - that's the excess flow valve (and maybe a thermal cutoff as well).

The three colours/flowrates I listed earlier are for the "nut" (connector on the end of the hose), not the tank's valve. If you change to a higher flow rating of the excess flow valve, you do this by changing to a different QCC "nut"... perhaps the only time it matters that you know where this function is performed.
  • black: 50 SCFM or 100,000 BTU/hr (Marshall ME517)
  • green: 100 SCFM or 200,000 BTU/hr (Marshall ME518)
  • red: 200 SCFM or 400,000 BTU/hr (Marshall ME519)
The Propane 101 site is informative, but it was built by propane distributors to explain their products to consumers - it doesn't say much about the rest of the propane supply system on an RV, and specifically does not mention the excess flow valve in vapour systems. It is mostly about large tanks, and barely mentions portable cylinders (such as the 20-pounders on an Escape). It's too bad that due to this focus it doesn't explain the excess flow valve of used with an RV.
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Old 09-16-2015, 12:51 PM   #50
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At Academy Sports or similar store you can buy a 6' propane hose with tank connection on one end and small grill connection on the other. I they have extensions you can connect together to set up your grill on the other side of the trailer.
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