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Old 12-06-2013, 01:34 PM   #21
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The Atwood 8012 is probably the most efficient and quiet rv propane furnace available today. With less than 2 amp draw (the lowest available) and operating at 50%, you will only use 8 a/h a nite, with a solar panel and a battery you will not run out of juice. Compared to Suburban and other Atwood models, it is the best IMHO. With a digital thermostat, you will be able to eliminate hot and could cycles caused by conventional thermostats. It is, again IMHO, an ideal set up. I have had 6 other propane furnaces in past 5 years and this is what I'm basing my opinion on.
The Wave requires fresh air and exhaust, something that is incongruous with trying to keep warm. Your Atwood does not need either of these. Other than condensation your unit can be kept unopened to the outside cold.
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Old 12-06-2013, 04:16 PM   #22
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I have been looking at the Propex HeatSource furnaces that are extremely popular with VW Westfallia Van campers. They have a 1.4Amp draw, are purportedly even quieter than the Atwood 8012, and are (I think) physically smaller. Given what I know about them at this point (having only read about them on the internet, no actual experience) and if I was in the market for a new furnace, I would probably get one of these. Anybody else know anything about them?

Propex HS2000 Heater - Blown Air space heater, thermostat - Gas power
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Old 12-06-2013, 04:17 PM   #23
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Let me summarize this:
Cyclopath started this thread in hopes of finding a solution to stay warm without being woken by his Atwood heater. He owns 2013 Escape which probably means he has an Atwood 8012 installed. Some members have tried to discourage him from using his stove which I hope we all know is dangerous to use as heat for numerous reasons. While others including myself have suggested other options for quiet heat so that he can sleep. Jim I think you also had electric heat available on your last trailer and plan to have it on Blackjack. That's a good option if he has shore power available. It's likely because he is in Phoenix, Arizona where it is 120 in the shade during summer.
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Old 12-06-2013, 04:30 PM   #24
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Yes, here it is, very quiet. Amazon.com: Broan Model 170 Wall Heater, 500/1000 Watt 120 VAC, White Painted Grille: Home Improvement
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Old 12-06-2013, 07:49 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AimlessWanderLust View Post
I have been looking at the Propex HeatSource furnaces that are extremely popular with VW Westfallia Van campers. They have a 1.4Amp draw, are purportedly even quieter than the Atwood 8012, and are (I think) physically smaller.

Propex HS2000 Heater - Blown Air space heater, thermostat - Gas power
Specs for the HS2000 are in the brochure.
Atwood Mobile - Furnaces offers the installation manual for the 7912/8012 if you would like to compare.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AimlessWanderLust View Post
Given what I know about them at this point (having only read about them on the internet, no actual experience) and if I was in the market for a new furnace, I would probably get one of these. Anybody else know anything about them?
I am only familiar with the Propex product from forum discussions and the Propex website. The Propex certainly looks promising.

The Propex HS2000 is physically a small fraction of the Atwood's volume, and substantially more efficient, but has only 71% of the Atwood's heat output. If that's enough, and if the noise is at least proportionately lower, it might be a good choice for many.

The Propex HS2800 has about the same (slightly higher) heat output than the Atwood, in a box which is larger than the HS2000 but still much smaller than the Atwood, and still much more efficient. It may be a better match for colder climates or larger Escape models.

My guess is that any Propex will be expensive compared to an Atwood (or Suburban), and that it may be difficult to import due to regulatory compliance. For that reason, I would not be surprised if Escape were unable to install a Propex as custom original equipment.
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Old 12-06-2013, 07:55 PM   #26
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The first time our heater went on because it was so cold, I too was awakened. However I was so grateful for the heat, I could have hugged my heater and was happy to be awake to enjoy the warmth. C'mon folks ... This is camping!
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Old 12-06-2013, 08:02 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
With a digital thermostat, you will be able to eliminate hot and could cycles caused by conventional thermostats.
How? Any thermostat simply turns the furnace on and off. The triggering temperature to go on must be lower than the temperature to turn off (the difference is called the deadband), or the furnace would rapidly cycle on and off. The larger the difference between these two points, the greater the variation in interior temperature, but also the fewer sleep-disrupting starts and stops. Digital or mechanical, any thermostat has a deadband and it can be as large or small as desired (deadband is user-adjustable in some mechanical thermostats).

The ideal setup is a continuously variable heat output - as described earlier for an electric heater - so the furnace runs continuously, but as quietly as possible and without any disruptive starts and stops. This is expensive to do in a fuel-burning appliance (it needs a variable gas valve and variable-speed fans), so it is uncommon in home furnaces and likely non-existent in RV furnaces; no thermostat can make a single-speed furnace into a variable one. I have two Atwood furnaces in a larger trailer which are each two-level, which is a crude approximation to the desired variable output.
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Old 12-06-2013, 08:02 PM   #28
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I have an oldy but goody Scamp and the oldy but goody Suburban furance works well, very well. The first time I was camping and the furnace came on in the middle of the night, I shot out of bed because I thought at 747 was going to land on the roof! I find that a sustained noise doesn't bother me, but the roar, quiet, roar, quiet is most uncomfortable. A white-noise machine may be in order to maintain a constant noise. Works for me!
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Old 12-06-2013, 08:13 PM   #29
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I'm not suggesting that this is a practical retrofit, but one approach to quiet non-electric heat is a circulating hot water system: a "boiler" heats the water, the water circulates though tubing in the floor, and no blowing of interior air is required. This typically replaces the water heater as well.

Aqua-Hot is the common brand. These are usually diesel-fueled (rather than propane) and come only in large sizes, typically found in large diesel-engined motorhomes. Aqua-Hot/s "small" (and propane-fueled) unit is the 400LP... but it is 7 times the heat output of an Atwood 8012! Some people have custom-built smaller systems, but this is not a trivial undertaking.
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Old 12-06-2013, 08:32 PM   #30
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Looks like the Propex HS2800 is $895 Westy Ventures / Propex heaters compared to about $450 US for the 12k Atwood according to Google.

In my stick built, by installing a digital thermostat I eliminated the wide temp swings we had with our original analog, the furnace instead came on more often for shorter periods as one would expect but certianly keeps it much more comfortable.
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