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Old 12-06-2017, 09:11 AM   #21
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I thought ETI moved the water heater in the new 21's to the rear? My 2014 had it under the bed also.
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:27 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Artlady View Post
So, is the consensus that it can be altered with some good carpentry? Or do the water heater and pipes obviate a switch out?
Various design/component aspects of the standard water and sewage system certainly complicate remodeling in that area, but someone with ample imagination and skills (and checkbook balance) could probably get it done.
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The lil'. snoozy is a cutie for sure. They just make them in one size though correct?
Currently just one size (19') and one basic floor plan, as far as I know. I believe they used to have options for twin beds and for an encased entertainment center vs. a larger galley with bigger side window on the passenger side. So one might run across those in a used Snoozy. The FiberglassRV.com website includes a Lil' Snoozy section where more interior photos have likely been posted by owners.
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:27 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by elongest View Post
The Squidget is a home built trailer that has a folding bed system that would work in an E-21 and cover the black tank area. You would have to rearrange your pressure water lines and box in your water heater. The designer did a really nice job with his homebuilt trailer. Check out his website and watch the video. At about 7 minutes into the video he shows the bed operation.
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The Squidget Tiny Travel Trailer Plans
Thanks for sharing this. What a sweet man! There are so many clever people out there. He certainly made a spacious but tiny trailer, utilizing his space very well. And yes, that bed would work great!
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:35 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I thought ETI moved the water heater in the new 21's to the rear? My 2014 had it under the bed also.
Nope. As shown in the photos, the water heater in our 2017 21' is at the foot of the bed, against the driver side wall for customary outside access.
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:36 AM   #25
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OK. Thank you guys so much! I appreciate the photos you posted, the links, and the suggestions. We tried...

Someone PM'd me with a link to a spacious wheelchair and handicapped -accessible trailer that's very roomy inside. Wonderfully appointed and usable.
But it's one of those non-fiberglass trailers... and I don't know the first thing about those types as well as which brands are good. Truth be told, I didn't even want to go there.

I also saw a converted toy hauler online that had an electric bed lift system that was incredible!
The bed lifted up on electric pullies, flush to the ceiling, giving available floor space during the day.
Again, I just marvel at the abilities of such clever people. The engineers and entrepreneurs that come up with these adaptations and creations are to be admired.
Thank you all!
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:38 AM   #26
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Nope. As shown in the photos, the water heater in our 2017 21' is at the foot of the bed, against the driver side wall for customary outside access.
I had difficulty seeing just how far it stuck out from the wall. I wonder if a low built-in cabinet could be placed here, over those pipes, even to act as a support for a fold out type bed?
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Old 12-06-2017, 10:25 AM   #27
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I disassembled all the bed framing on our 2014 21 and rebuilt it to support a slanted bed platform (head is 4 inches higher than the foot.) The framing was just a collection of shorter 1x2 sticks fastened together rather than solid cut lengths of wood that span the width of the bed.

I think there would be space for a fold-out bed/sofa design, but it would probably need to be a tri-fold design like a fold-up futon to fit underneath the front shelf or avoid the window. Huge loss of storage space, through.
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Old 12-06-2017, 12:46 PM   #28
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Good catch... and isn't the water heater in that location under the bed even with the normal dinette? The U-shaped adds space under the dinette seats, so it shouldn't cause the water heater to move from the back to the front. Also, the water heater should be close to the bathroom, so under the bed makes more sense regardless of dinette.
Oh probably. I said that as the comment from someone was running through my head that it was thought to be there cuz I had the u-shape.
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Old 12-06-2017, 12:49 PM   #29
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I also saw a converted toy hauler online that had an electric bed lift system that was incredible!
The bed lifted up on electric pullies, flush to the ceiling, giving available floor space during the day.
A lot of the toy haulers out there seem to have that lift. Least the ones I've read about in Trailer Life.
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Old 12-06-2017, 01:28 PM   #30
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I had difficulty seeing just how far it stuck out from the wall. I wonder if a low built-in cabinet could be placed here, over those pipes, even to act as a support for a fold out type bed?
Quick measurements - the water heater in our 2017 21' sticks out under the foot of the bed about 20 inches from the driver side wall, 22 inches when you account for all the factory tubing and fittings (elbows, t's, etc.). The other two dimensions are about 14" x 14" including the Styrofoam insulation. Hope that helps....
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Old 12-06-2017, 02:08 PM   #31
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That must be the change, no "U" dinette and the water heater is in the rear, under drivers side dinette, otherwise it is up front under the bed if you opt for the "U" rear dinette.
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Old 12-06-2017, 02:22 PM   #32
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That must be the change, no "U" dinette and the water heater is in the rear, under drivers side dinette, otherwise it is up front under the bed if you opt for the "U" rear dinette.
If we're still talking about the new generation 21' here, our 2017 21' has the standard dinette, and the water heater is up under the foot of the bed. I'm not sure it would even make sense to put the water heater under the driver's side dinette seat since all the hot water use is at or near the front and on the passenger side (shower and galley sink).
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Old 12-06-2017, 02:48 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
I thought ETI moved the water heater in the new 21's to the rear? My 2014 had it under the bed also.
The ETI website photo of the second-generation 21' shows the water heater under the bed.


So I think we've beaten that one down: the water heater will be at the foot of the bed against the wall.
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Old 12-06-2017, 02:56 PM   #34
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I think there would be space for a fold-out bed/sofa design, but it would probably need to be a tri-fold design like a fold-up futon to fit underneath the front shelf or avoid the window.
I was thinking of that (bed folds forward to become a seat) - it was the van conversion style that I mentioned - but as mentioned in the discussion of the Squidget bed the water heater location is a challenge for any design which does not run the seat base along the side wall.
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Old 12-06-2017, 02:59 PM   #35
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In addition to the toy haulers, bed lifts (of various mechanical designs) are used over the front seats of some Class A motorhomes, and over the dinette (just behind the cab) of at least one Class C. The usual challenge with them is that they need a supporting wall at each end; it's hard to see how that would work effectively and achieve the target result of keeping the rear inboard corner of the bed area clear when the bed is not in use.
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Old 12-06-2017, 03:13 PM   #36
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The lil'. snoozy is a cutie for sure. They just make them in one size though correct?
Yes - all Lil' Snoozy shells are the same; the only differences are interior fittings.

Unfortunately for this purpose, that size is not very big. The overall width is huge because the wheels are entirely outside of the body; the interior width is the same as an Escape 17' (or 13', or 15', or original 5.0). The tongue is relatively long (possibly another effect of starting from a background of building boat trailers), so the interior length is closer to that of an Escape 17' than an Escape 19'.

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Originally Posted by War Eagle View Post
Currently just one size (19') and one basic floor plan, as far as I know. I believe they used to have options for twin beds and for an encased entertainment center vs. a larger galley with bigger side window on the passenger side. So one might run across those in a used Snoozy.
The "hard" parts of the Lil' Snoozy (travel trailer version, rather than cargo) such as the bathroom are fixed, with variations generally in the bed area. If the passage from the door to the front is wide enough, that might be okay.

If substantial changes to this trailer are needed, it would probably make sense to start with a Lil' Hauley (cargo version), rather than the complete travel trailer (Lil' Snoozy).
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Old 12-06-2017, 03:21 PM   #37
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So, is the consensus that it can be altered with some good carpentry? Or do the water heater and pipes obviate a switch out?
It would certainly be easiest to leave the water heater where it is, and that should be possible with a sofa running along the wall. The water pipes (hot and cold fresh water, not the waste line) shouldn't be a problem. The hot one of these is the line which Reace replaced after realizing that the original material chosen was not suitable - the point is that he could replace these lines at owner's home in less than an hour, because this sort of plumbing is not difficult to re-route.

I'm pretty sure that even I could handle the carpentry.
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