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11-18-2019, 11:50 AM
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#121
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: North Van., British Columbia
Trailer: 2014 Escape 19, sold; 2019 Escape 21, Sept. 2019
Posts: 8,743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbaglo
I think that there were 24 rivets and six bolts holding the awning on. One of the fridge vents has about 24 rivets. A dozen large holes for water heater, water fill, outdoor shower.
If it ever stops raining, I'll do a count.
Meantime, it's dry inside.
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Yup, so's mine. I can look down on my roof from my sundeck. The count was a few higher than I thought. I count 74 bolts or screws plus 5 cut outs. Didn't count the awning attachment etc., just screws or bolts in the roof that are sealed with Proflex.
So if you want to drill a hole or two in the roof and 74 attachment screws aren't leaking, probably if you make it 76 there still wouldn't be any leaks.
Ron
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11-18-2019, 02:40 PM
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#122
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 1979 Boler B1700
Posts: 14,935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbaglo
I think that there were 24 rivets and six bolts holding the awning on. One of the fridge vents has about 24 rivets. A dozen large holes for water heater, water fill, outdoor shower.
If it ever stops raining, I'll do a count.
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While you're at it, also count the screws holding the belly band on, and the propane line holes.
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02-16-2020, 07:01 PM
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#123
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: North of Edmonton, Alberta
Trailer: 2018 -21-picked up in May 2019 / 2018 F 150 5.0
Posts: 254
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am solar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossue
They may run the cable down the fridge vent, yet they will be drilling holes for the panel mount feet. In the past they used VHB tape as does AM Solar in Oregon, yet after reports of a handful of panels flying off Escape decided a bolt through the roof would eliminate any risk for them. AM Solar still uses VHB tape and claims to have never had a panel fly off. When ETI sent me a retrofit kit with the bolts around 2015 I decided to instead copy AM Solar's installation method and it is still up there 5 years and 60K miles later.
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Rossue, I am thinking of installing a second panel on our 21 using the AM solar method. Did you use the tall feet? I assume they will be high enough to make it over the higher middle section of the roof? Also AM says you can put 2 feet at all 4 corners, did you do that?
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02-17-2020, 10:55 AM
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#124
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Pismo Beach, California
Trailer: 2015 Escape 5.0TA
Posts: 192
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Second solar panel
I have one panel mounted and the second is a portable panel that uses a Zamp port. The advantage of the second panel being portable is that you can put it in the sun when the trailer is in the shade. Also the panel gives you the most electricity when it is pointed directly at the sun. Ross had a similar setup. The Zamp port is easy to install and I have mine connected directly to the charger that was already in the Escape (it can handle the two panels I have, the mounted and portable). Best of luck.
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03-06-2020, 03:36 PM
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#125
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Kelowna, British Columbia
Trailer: 2018 Escape 19
Posts: 2,716
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I am just wondering if anybody can say how much they think they loose by having the panels horizontal and not pointed at the sun?
If I was using portable solar, it would probably not be put out until well after sun up and if we went exploring anywhere in the afternoon, I would probably put it away so it did not grow legs and walk. Then, maybe not set it up when we got back...as...I would just have to put it away again.
I am thinking the extra I would get out of pointing the portable at the sun would in a days total be less due to my laziness and locking it up durning possible peak hours.
And how is that tape still doing?
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03-06-2020, 03:44 PM
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#126
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Trailer: 2015 E'21 - 'Velocity'. Tow: Toyota Tacoma V6, 4X4, manual.
Posts: 1,684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eggscape
I am just wondering if anybody can say how much they think they loose by having the panels horizontal and not pointed at the sun?
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I tested a 150 watt panel in mid-January here in Denver, Colorado, at roughly noon, using a fixed 1ohm load.
75 watts with the panel aimed directly at the sun.
23 watts with the panel horizontal.
Worth aiming a portable panel 2 or 3 times during the day if your batteries are low - in my humble opinion.
--
Alan
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03-06-2020, 03:59 PM
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#127
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan
Trailer: 2018 21'
Posts: 152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eggscape
I am just wondering if anybody can say how much they think they loose by having the panels horizontal and not pointed at the sun?
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Theoretically you only keep cos (angle from ideal) rays from the sun. So if your panels should be at 45 degrees and are horizontal, you lose ~30% of the sun. Obviously at 90 degrees off, you are getting 0% direct sunlight (or losing 100%). I'm ignoring how light bounces off the glass differently at different angles and some other factors.
I hope that helps.
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03-06-2020, 04:18 PM
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#128
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Kelowna, British Columbia
Trailer: 2018 Escape 19
Posts: 2,716
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Thanks guys...I know this one is going to give me a headache.
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03-06-2020, 05:08 PM
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#129
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Central, Pennsylvania
Trailer: Escape#5 2022 E19
Posts: 26,268
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I always believe in the KISS principle, lets me sleep at night. The stock solar has always worked, can it work better, probably, but I will never know....
__________________
Jim
Sometime life gets in the way of living.......
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03-06-2020, 05:29 PM
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#130
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: North Vancouver, British Columbia
Trailer: 2009 Escape 17B 2020 Toyota Highlander XLE
Posts: 17,136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008
I always believe in the KISS principle, lets me sleep at night. The stock solar has always worked, can it work better, probably, but I will never know....
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Once your battery is fully charged, efficiency no longer matters.
__________________
What happens to the hole when the cheese is gone?
- Bertolt Brecht
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03-06-2020, 05:55 PM
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#131
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Benton County, Iowa
Trailer: 2013 Escape 21 Classic Number 6, pulled by 2018 Toyota Highlander
Posts: 8,235
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Adjusting panels
I camped in Colorado with some folks who had portable panels. They were group camped in a parking lot and they were the only campers in the lot. From sun up to sun down somebody was there to keep an eye on things. This worked out well as the day went by the panels were moved around and adjusted for the angle of the sun. It’s not always possible to be camped this way but handy when it is. Here’s a couple pics.
Iowa Dave
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03-06-2020, 06:55 PM
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#132
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Oswego, New York
Trailer: 2017 Escape 21C, 2018 Ford F150
Posts: 5,363
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I modified the panel mounts on the two panels on my 21 so that they could be tilted to the correct angle for late December in Phoenix, AZ (I usually winter in Quartzsite, AZ). I get a four fold difference in amperage with the tilt during the last couple of weeks of December & the first couple of January. I find I don't need to tilt them after late February, although I suspect there would be some improvement until May.
I use enough amp hours to make it worth it, at least during the mid winter. For most, I suspect it isn't all that necessary.
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03-06-2020, 07:00 PM
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#133
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Burlington, Vermont
Trailer: 2014 17b/ 2012 Chevy Colorado
Posts: 736
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Our horizontal 160 watt setup is bomber. Don't miss an angled panel at all.
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03-06-2020, 07:39 PM
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#134
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Kelowna, British Columbia
Trailer: 2018 Escape 19
Posts: 2,716
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Yes Jon I remember that.
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03-06-2020, 10:38 PM
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#135
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Lanesboro, MN, between Whalan and Fountain, Minnesota
Trailer: 2016 Bigfoot 25RQ - (2018 Escape 5.0 sold)
Posts: 2,154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericw
Theoretically you only keep cos (angle from ideal) rays from the sun. So if your panels should be at 45 degrees and are horizontal, you lose ~30% of the sun. Obviously at 90 degrees off, you are getting 0% direct sunlight (or losing 100%). I'm ignoring how light bounces off the glass differently at different angles and some other factors.
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We were in Death Valley January 24-39. Our 5.0 was perfectly north/south with the panels on the north end. Unfortunately on the 5.0 the roof is angled and the panel was actually facing north. For six days we gained about 6 ah a day from the panel but used around 22 for a net loss of 16 ah a day. When we left we were down 96 ah. Too close when you only have about 115 ah to get to 50%.
When the panels on a 5.0 are angled and facing to the north there is nearly no gain despite a 100% clear sky with not a cloud in the sky. I did know that finally we would be parked perfectly north.
Enjoy,
Perry
__________________
Those who know everything use pens. Intelligent people use pencils.
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05-06-2020, 11:51 AM
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#136
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: PNW, British Columbia
Trailer: 2013 - 19
Posts: 87
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Hi Jim
Ive just bought a 19’ and have ordered 3 80W Lensun panels (thanks for the info here). There is already a EPEVER 30A MPPT controller that i will use. My question is this. Would you wire these in parallel or series. Looking at schematics it seems that wiring in series may require fewer breakers? Ill be using the go power roof top entry as you did. Longest wire run from panel to Controller is no more than 20’ at 10g
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05-06-2020, 01:04 PM
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#137
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Baytown, Texas
Trailer: 2017 21' Escape - upgraded version
Posts: 2,697
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pembyescape
Hi Jim
Ive just bought a 19’ and have ordered 3 80W Lensun panels (thanks for the info here). There is already a EPEVER 30A MPPT controller that i will use. My question is this. Would you wire these in parallel or series. Looking at schematics it seems that wiring in series may require fewer breakers? Ill be using the go power roof top entry as you did. Longest wire run from panel to Controller is no more than 20’ at 10g
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Wiring the roof panels in series is best if all the panels are the same amps but different voltages.
Wiring the roof panels in parallel is best if all the panels have matching voltages but different current ratings.
The question should be - are you going to use a portable at times. Since your portable would probably not match your roof panel amps but would have the same voltage output, wiring the roof panels in parallel would be the way to go.
__________________
Normal people believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Engineers believe in fixing it so that it never breaks.
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05-06-2020, 01:18 PM
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#138
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Santa Rosa, California
Trailer: 2014 Escape 15B sold, 2019 Escape 19
Posts: 367
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I wired my four rooftop panels in parallel, here’s why.
Series connected panels will have less wire losses because your maximum current is around 4.5 amp compared to 13.5 amp in a parallel setup. On the other hand during partly shading conditions, if one of those series connected panels is shaded your power output will be close to zero, while parallel panels will still give two thirds power in this situation. So you have to think about where are you willing to compromise, to me it’s more important to get every bit of power when conditions are not ideal, on the other hand in a full direct sun I’m willing to lose few percent.
Another consideration is panel or wiring failure, not very likely but also not unheard of. If one panel goes offline for some reason, your other parallel connected panels will continue to deliver.
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05-06-2020, 03:02 PM
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#139
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: PNW, British Columbia
Trailer: 2013 - 19
Posts: 87
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One vote Series one vote Parallel.
Currently fishing wire from overhead cabinets and relocating MPPT.
We are often in the sun but at the same time we do find shady locations. I’d like to avoid the portable panels as we’ve been there done that. But...
I still have time to continue the flip flop - supplies are just being shipped. Stay healthy all!
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05-06-2020, 03:37 PM
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#140
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Baytown, Texas
Trailer: 2017 21' Escape - upgraded version
Posts: 2,697
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pembyescape
One vote Series one vote Parallel.
Currently fishing wire from overhead cabinets and relocating MPPT.
We are often in the sun but at the same time we do find shady locations. I’d like to avoid the portable panels as we’ve been there done that. But...
I still have time to continue the flip flop - supplies are just being shipped. Stay healthy all!
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Not sure who voted for series? I wrote "wiring the roof panels in parallel would be the way to go."
Wiring the panels in series has multiple problems that I would try to avoid by wiring the panels in parallel.
ps. My panels are wired in parallel.
__________________
Normal people believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Engineers believe in fixing it so that it never breaks.
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