Upgrading your battery system....

[Jim Bennett]

That Noco looks good. I think I will put the CTEK 4.7 in my daughters trailer (which will have a single 12V), and pick one of these up.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

But my battery is already hooked to solar as well as the on board WCFO converter, is it possible all three may compete or conflict with each other?

Not as long as you use them one at a time!

[padlin]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

But my battery is already hooked to solar as well as the on board WCFO converter, is it possible all three may compete or conflict with each other?

I believe the CTEK would be either a stand alone, or you could hard wiring it in, replacing the WFCO as your on board charger. You would not have both the CTEK and the WFCO powered up and connected to your batteries at the same time.

If you pull your batteries for the winter, you could use the CTEK to periodically top them off, it looks like it's really meant to be a portable stand alone.

If I were to be looking to replace the WFCO, I'd use something with more output then 4.3Ah to charge a 220 amp battery bank.

FWIW:
On my trailer (non-GoPower), when the WFCO charger is outputting the solar does not, must see the voltage and figure it doesn't need to charge the batteries. No idea what would happen with a 3rd charger online.

[techfan]

Just ran across this since we have an 80W portable Zamp solar system. Looks interesting, a wireless Bluetooth device to monitor your batteries.

Batterycheck - Wireless RV & Marine Battery Management.

[cpaharley2008]

Originally Posted by techfan

Just ran across this since we have an 80W portable Zamp solar system. Looks interesting, a wireless Bluetooth device to monitor your batteries.

Batterycheck - Wireless RV & Marine Battery Management.

I just ordered one of those, it appears to function like the Trimetric battery monitor via your smart phone. The company also will offer a 10% discount to forum members. I'll post the install pictures and detail upon receipt of the unit next week.

[cpaharley2008]

Here are some more details on product

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-jb7OF-mo

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by techfan

Just ran across this since we have an 80W portable Zamp solar system. Looks interesting, a wireless Bluetooth device to monitor your batteries.

Batterycheck - Wireless RV & Marine Battery Management.

Interesting. It is the monitor plus the current measurement shunt in one package, depending on the mobile device (smartphone or tablet) for display/controls, linked by Bluetooth; this is similar to many devices for monitoring vehicles through the OBD port.

This appears to be the manufacturer's web site: BM PRO - BatteryCheck

The capacity should work for most people, but if you're running a 1500 watt inverter fully loaded, you'll need more current than it can handle.

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

I just ordered one of those, it appears to function like the Trimetric battery monitor via your smart phone. The company also will offer a 10% discount to forum members. I'll post the install pictures and detail upon receipt of the unit next week.

I look forward to hearing how it goes.

[techfan]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

Here are some more details on product

Looks like it won't work with my two 6 volts wired in series. Only works with multiple batteries in parallel.

[cpaharley2008]

I was told it will work because you end up with a single 12v. you install it on the negative side that has the connection to the solar, not the negative that connects to the positive that combines the two. I have a person at Zampsolar you can talk with. I specifically mentioned I was switching from a single 12v to dual sixers hooked in series and he said, no problem.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by techfan

Looks like it won't work with my two 6 volts wired in series. Only works with multiple batteries in parallel.

No...

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

I was told it will work because you end up with a single 12v.

Right. It doesn't matter whether the six lead-acid cells are in one box or split into two: it's still a 12V battery.

The specs say the battery bank can have up to 800 amp-hours of capacity, and the Escape dual 6V setup is less than one-third of that size.

[techfan]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

No...

Right. It doesn't matter whether the six lead-acid cells are in one box or split into two: it's still a 12V battery.

The specs say the battery bank can have up to 800 amp-hours of capacity, and the Escape dual 6V setup is less than one-third of that size.

Great. Thanks guys.

[fudge_brownie]

It appears the Zamp is a new product or at least new to the North American market, November of this year was its introduction. I could not find any reviews of the product. Having installed a Trimetric battery monitor, the installation of the Zamp appears much easier. The Zamp would be best used in those situations were wiring the Trimetric would be difficult, particularly if the desired location was far from the location of the battery or the installation was being done after delivery. Based on the video the Zamp is temperature compensated, a nice feature.

Two concerns are: the device is shown being installed on top of the battery, this is an extremely harsh environment with the off gassing during the charge process. The monitor seems well constructed and perhaps well sealed but one cannot be sure from the images. Second issue would be the price. At $340 US and the need to have a smart phone this is twice the cost of a wired Trimetric system.

[cpaharley2008]

If you call Zamp and ask for Bill, he will sell it for $299 less $35 for forum members, or $264 shipping included. I also think it has to be on the battery for the temperature reading to be accurate and the items appears to be well constructed, I'll follow up once mine arrives.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by fudge_brownie

It appears the Zamp is a new product or at least new to the North American market, November of this year was its introduction.

The product distributed by Zamp, but is made by Setec under their BM PRO brand. Setec is Australian, and according to a news report they shipped their first product to the U.S. this summer, presumably to Zamp.

Originally Posted by fudge_brownie

I could not find any reviews of the product.

Setec's review page is blank. Elsewhere there is at least one review available, but I don't know that it is unbiased. While Setec is not new, it looks like this specific product might be.

Originally Posted by fudge_brownie

IHaving installed a Trimetric battery monitor, the installation of the Zamp appears much easier. The Zamp would be best used in those situations were wiring the Trimetric would be difficult, particularly if the desired location was far from the location of the battery or the installation was being done after delivery. Based on the video the Zamp is temperature compensated, a nice feature.

I agree - that all makes sense to me.

Originally Posted by fudge_brownie

... the device is shown being installed on top of the battery, this is an extremely harsh environment with the off gassing during the charge process. The monitor seems well constructed and perhaps well sealed but one cannot be sure from the images.

I agree that this could be a concern. On the other hand, the location is chosen

• to simplify wiring, and
• to provide temperature measurement by physical contact with a battery post (the negative) as Jim mentioned.

I don't see any reason why it could not be remotely mounted on a pair of studs, other than the effect on temperature compensation.

[jamman]

Note that it installs INLINE with the battery negative - using an internal 80 amp shunt. Moving it away from the battery makes for longer supply cables. And an 80 amp shunt is 960 watts at 12 volts - so max of about an 800 watt inverter allowing for some conversion inefficiency and a bit of other use.

I would install a Bogart Trimetric before this one.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by jamman

Note that it installs INLINE with the battery negative - using an internal 80 amp shunt.

Yes, any monitor with this functionality requires a current measurement device; this design puts the whole thing in that location. There are pros and cons to that, but the installation inline with the negative cable is the same as (for instance) a Bogart Trimetric's shunt.

Originally Posted by jamman

Moving it away from the battery makes for longer supply cables.

Any battery installation has a negative cable. If I wanted this off of the battery, I would just put it on the other end of that cable (as long as that location is a suitable environment) or partway along that cable. The cable would only be longer if needed to place the BatteryCheck in a suitably protected location.

Originally Posted by jamman

And an 80 amp shunt is 960 watts at 12 volts - so max of about an 800 watt inverter allowing for some conversion inefficiency and a bit of other use.

I agree - this is not well sized for users of significant inverters. I picked the example of a 1500 W inverter earlier because that's the larger size offered by ETI, but I agree that the inverter size limit is more like 800 watts. Many (most?) people don't run such an inverter, so that's not an issue for them.

Now I'm curious, so I'll ask the manufacturer about a higher-capacity version.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

Now I'm curious, so I'll ask the manufacturer about a higher-capacity version.

The followup:

I asked the manufacturer of the BatteryCheck:

Is there an alternate model - existing or planned - of the BatteryCheck which would have a higher current capacity? The current limits (which I understand to be 80 amps continuous or 100 amps peak) are too low to support the use of an inverter of more than about 800 watts rated output.

A clear and helpful reply arrived today, including:

Thanks for your email.

At this stage there are no immediate plans for a BatteryCheck above 100 Amps however it is something we are always considering.

It appears to me that this product line is currently limited, but the manufacturer is technically capable, and is responsive to customers.

[Brian B-P]

More about the BatteryCheck...

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

... the location is chosen

• to simplify wiring, and
• to provide temperature measurement by physical contact with a battery post (the negative) as Jim mentioned.

I don't see any reason why it could not be remotely mounted on a pair of studs, other than the effect on temperature compensation.

I was mistaken about the temperature measurement. I realized that I might be, so I sent this question by e-mail:

The data sheet says

"A separate lead provides connection to the positive terminal of the battery to power the unit, measure the battery voltage and to assess the temperature and overall health of the battery".

Is the temperature sensor in the terminal of this positive lead, or in the body of the device at the negative terminal? I would like to consider a remote mounting on wall of the battery box, near the battery but not directly mounted on it, but I would still want an accurate temperature. I assume this would work if the temperature sensor is in end of the positive lead.

Temperature measurement is not done in the body of the device bolted to the negative terminal. Instead, as the manufacturer's rep has explained by e-mail:

The temperature sensor is embedded into the positive lead, we recommend the positive lead be directly connected to the physical battery.

So if - for any reason - someone wants to mount it other than directly on the battery, but still within the positive lead's reach of the positive terminal, it will work just as well.

[thoer]

I contacted NOCO and asked:

I have an RV that utilizes 2 Interstate 230Ah deep cycle 6v batteries in series to deliver 12v service. Is your Genius G7200 an appropriate charger for that configuration? Thanks!

They replied:

When you charge two batteries in series you want to go with a two bank charger. One bank for each battery. If you use the G7200 The batteries will not charge equally to 100%. You can charge them both in series with the G7200 its just not ideal.

I replied back that I didn't see an appropriate 2 bank model that they make, so now I am awaiting a response on that question.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by thoer

They replied:

When you charge two batteries in series you want to go with a two bank charger. One bank for each battery. If you use the G7200 The batteries will not charge equally to 100%. You can charge them both in series with the G7200 its just not ideal.

I replied back that I didn't see an appropriate 2 bank model that they make, so now I am awaiting a response on that question.

The NOCO response is surprising to me.

I agree that they appear to have no suitable products to handle the two batteries separately - none of their multi-bank "onboard" models have a 6-volt mode, and none of their multi-purpose have both 6-volt and enough current for these large batteries. The table on their Products page shows no models as 6V and suitable for charging (not just maintaining) RV batteries. It is not normal to charge series batteries separately, anyway.

It almost looks like the response is for a pair of parallel batteries - if you substituted "parallel" for "series", it would make more sense (and even then no multi-bank model would have enough output).