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Old 05-19-2016, 05:24 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
Yes I could live with the rear vent, though I rather it didn't exist.
Jim I take it you are ordering a U shape dinette as well, otherwise it will likely be on the passenger side.
I am still torn on the dinette layout. I want the best of both worlds. I want to have the batteries and electronic stuff along the back, but also want more floor space than the U-shape affords. I am going to do more pondering and thinking at the rally, while checking out both layouts.
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:09 PM   #102
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I am still torn on the dinette layout. I want the best of both worlds. I want to have the batteries and electronic stuff along the back, but also want more floor space than the U-shape affords. I am going to do more pondering and thinking at the rally, while checking out both layouts.
Jim you can have your cake and eat it too.

Order standard dinette, throw campground galas with lots of room to boogie till sunrise. Then when you need the comforts of a U shape, take out your board and custom sized cushions Escape will sell you and create the U shape dinette. The floor will never get smaller. This could be an Escape option for those on the fence.
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:28 PM   #103
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We have the U-shaped dinette and the vent is hidden behind the spare. I was cleaning the trailer and saw it for the first time yesterday. Loren

The U-shaped dinette was one of the items that we were back and forth on and was the main delay in getting in our build sheet. It does give the back of the trailer a finished look but does take up space. However it does convert into another nice roomy bed. I also will be installing the Springfield pedestal this summer. Loren
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:31 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
AGMs are in airplanes since they often bank and roll. Can you imaging a flooded battery in an airplane ?
Yes, they were all flooded for the first few decades of aircraft production, until the 1950's. Ni-Cd were used before AGM arrived in the 1980's, but vented flooded lead-acid batteries remained common and are still used.

Aircraft bank and roll, but they do so in coordinated turns, so there is no side force - the electrolyte in a flooded battery doesn't slosh around much. In fact, aircraft have no effective way to produce side force, so other than in aerobatic displays and loss-of-control incidents, lateral acceleration causing sloshing is really a car problem, not an aircraft problem. Forward acceleration and braking are similar: most aircraft do these quite gradually compared to what cars can do (a fighter catapulting off a carrier is an obvious exception ).

But it's true: aircraft were an early application for AGM batteries, perhaps more for the lack of venting in normal operation, or reduced risk due to splashing in abnormal conditions, or for high starting current in a small package, rather than anything to do with turning.
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:36 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
Jim you can have your cake and eat it too.

Order standard dinette, throw campground galas with lots of room to boogie till sunrise. Then when you need the comforts of a U shape, take out your board and custom sized cushions Escape will sell you and create the U shape dinette. The floor will never get smaller. This could be an Escape option for those on the fence.
I like where you are going with this, though not seeing too many sunrises after a night of partying any more.

I am still set on having more floor space than the standard U-shaped dinette affords. One idea I have is to put the batteries under the dinette, allowing the rear cabinet wall of the U-shape to move back further, with just enough room to house the inverter and other electronics. This narrower 'seat' is not much of an issue, as even with the standard U-shape it is too narrow to sit on. I could still add a filler board and cushion if desired. The biggest problem I see with this, is that I will lose some good exterior access with the batteries there. I guess I need to see just how much storage I will have in the front bin.
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:46 PM   #106
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Jim, the standard rear seating on the U shape is not much to sit on ? I thought it was as wide as the side seating on the 21 ft. The office at Escape told me the classic 21 had side benches with these dimensions 26” wide x 47 ½” long x 18” high. Any idea what the rear bench width is ?
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Old 05-19-2016, 06:49 PM   #107
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I had an interesting conversation with an EMT with reference to using the jaws of life on hybrids.
There are now model-by-model reference manuals for emergency handling and towing of vehicles, and the batteries and high-voltage wiring are significant parts of this information in hybrids. Presumably lithium batteries are more of a concern than the nickel-cadmium type.

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It's scary knowing your $5,000 battery bank can be lost with one mistake. Second reason to not consider Lithium now, other than cost, managing them.
I agree - the battery management system is critical, and I think it should be considered an integral part of the battery system, not an add-on. To work properly, it needs to manage the cells individually.

A few early Tesla Roadster owners killed their battery packs (by not following the instructions for maintaining a charge) - an expensive mistake (tens of thousands of dollars).
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Old 05-19-2016, 07:01 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Santiago View Post
Jim, the standard rear seating on the U shape is not much to sit on ? I thought it was as wide as the side seating on the 21 ft. The office at Escape told me the classic 21 had side benches with these dimensions 26” wide x 47 ½” long x 18” high. Any idea what the rear bench width is ?
This was in an email from a little ways back, from Reace.

Quote:
Just to give you an idea of what you will have for space…the rear dinette is approx. 48” long. The side benches will be 24” deep, the rear is 18” deep. That will leave you approx. 30” on the side benches. Hope that helps.
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Old 05-19-2016, 07:03 PM   #109
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I believe the vent can be anywhere you specify. On my 2014 21' with the "U" is was on the side because that was standard placement of the batteries, under the curb side dinette. Perhaps asking for them to be placed in the rear could result in the vent behind the spare. In addition this opening could be used for other other purposes, external solar or 12v outlet afterwards.

In addition I asked for all other components be placed on either side as to keep the rear open for mats or other long items
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Old 05-19-2016, 07:17 PM   #110
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Santiago
I've been using AGM batteries for 16 years and you will realize the added cost by getting 3X's more life (at least). I typically get at least 5 years out of mine. You can also shop online as they are sealed and do not have to be shipped hazardous. Hope this helps.
5 years is good?
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