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Old 07-21-2015, 10:20 PM   #11
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Hi Steve,
Thanks! I need to digest what you said...

One thing I do know is that the damage is observed only after the pigtail is replaced. Because we camped 2 nights without hookup after we found out the pigtail is destroyed. The battery was charging (solar) and we had used 12V appliances at night.

I had (could be wrongfully) assumed that if every 12V appliances work with 110v A/C, the converter and the circuitry after the converter should be intact.

And if the cut-off switch could affect the GoPower panel when we plugged into 110v A/C, the connection between the cut-off switch and the converter should be intact as well (This, is assuming the GoPower is on the battery side of the cut-off switch...)

I guess it is good chance for us to learn about these things anyway. Last time I used a multimeter was about 30 years ago!
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Old 07-21-2015, 10:38 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Ron in BC View Post
My main rule for trouble shooting is: Never assume anything. Check things down the line methodically.

There's a difference between what the maximum battery output is at the panel and at the battery. For example, my inverter is 3000 watts and runs directly from the batteries, not the panel.

Ron
Actually, I think it's ok to assume. Key is to remember the assumed parameters and ready to reverse the assumption. "Theorize" is what I would call it.

Even when I am holding the multimeter I need to decide which section to test first, and usually start with "most likely to fail" part which is assumption backed by statistic.

BTW my physics knowledge is really rusty. The 600W number does seem low. I may dig into that topic some other time. Or never.


ETA: wait! the 3000W inverter rating is measured in 120v which mean the current drawn would be around 25A which is well below the 50A fuse. I guess if I draw directly from the battery with 12V appliance it would be 600W max. OK I had confused myself enough on this subject.
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Old 07-21-2015, 11:00 PM   #13
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By process of elimination and some assumption, we are guessing that the GoPower is connected between the inline breaker and the disconnect switch, and assuming we have a bad inline breaker (which connect straight to the battery)...
So this 50-amp breaker is in a 12V DC circuit.

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I have been wanting to know what is the max battery output is. Now see that both the fuse and the inline breaker are 50A, it amount to about 600W than?
Yes, if the power is going through that fuse or that breaker, you can only get about 600 watts through. As Ron mentioned, the power to the inverter is presumably taking a different path.

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ETA: wait! the 3000W inverter rating is measured in 120v which mean the current drawn would be around 25A which is well below the 50A fuse. I guess if I draw directly from the battery with 12V appliance it would be 600W max. OK I had confused myself enough on this subject.
Yes, 3000 watts at 120 volts would be 25 amps... of 120V (AC) current. But the power into the inverter is at 12V (DC), so about 250 amps would be needed. The input is only one-tenth the current of the output, because it is at ten times the voltage.
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Old 07-22-2015, 12:14 AM   #14
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Actually, I think it's ok to assume. Key is to remember the assumed parameters and ready to reverse the assumption. "Theorize" is what I would call it.
Well my problem has been that I've had the experience of making assumptions and ignoring checking items because they were "probably OK" only to find later that they were the problem. So I treat trouble shooting circuits the same way I would if I had a schematic, start at the power source etc. and trace the circuit.

At first blush it would be easy to think that the installer inadvertently shorted the wires and caused a converter failure. Yet your converter seems to be working fine I'll be interested to see what the problem is.

I guess if it was me, I'd try undoing the 7 pin connections in the junction box and see if that does anything. In other words, remove the installers work from the equation.
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Old 07-22-2015, 12:29 AM   #15
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I guess if it was me, I'd try undoing the 7 pin connections in the junction box and see if that does anything. In other words, remove the installers work from the equation.
Ron
That is a very good point. Right now we are actually assuming the damage has been done and not on-going. We will have to consider that possibility when nothing else fit.

The junction box is inside the trailer under the front dinette seat -- one of the reason we only replaced the connector and not the entire cable. It could be a bit naive but I don't want anyone else to break the seal around the cable and risk a bad patch-up job (read: a hole under the trailer!)

I looked at the 7-way pigtail standard PICTURES briefly and only 1 of them (the charge line) would be potentially connected to the battery. From the description it should mean the tow vehicle charging the trailer batteries and not the other way around. Won't know what happened to it....This is something we also have to look at if nothing else fit.
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Old 07-22-2015, 06:10 AM   #16
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We used to have a saying about assuming.
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Old 07-22-2015, 11:52 AM   #17
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Found the problem!

We found the problem! I haven't seen many blown fuse in my life but this is the prettiest blown fuse I've ever seen. It's not until we put it on the mutlimeter we confirmed it is dead. It is the fuse on the battery. The first thing we checked and first to moved past. I thought these things are designed to be eyeball-ed. Apparently not so.

We are not out of the wood yet. We are checking the pigtail to make sure we don't have it occur again. We ran the multimeter through all the points on the 7-way and found pin 1,2, and 3 are connected (multimeter detected continuity as my hubby said). I inclined to think that they should not have contact or otherwise defeating the purpose of being separate points. We will have to take it apart and have a look later.
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Old 07-22-2015, 11:58 AM   #18
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We found the problem! I haven't seen many blown fuse in my life but this is the prettiest blown fuse I've ever seen. It's not until we put it on the mutlimeter we confirmed it is dead. It is the fuse on the battery. The first thing we checked and first to moved past. I thought these things are designed to be eyeball-ed. Apparently not so.
A great example of the fact that you can't tell if an ATC fuse is blown simply by looking at it. Good to hear you found the problem.
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Old 07-22-2015, 12:10 PM   #19
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A great example of the fact that you can't tell if an ATC fuse is blown simply by looking at it. Good to hear you found the problem.
Thanks. From now on if someone ask me to "check the fuse" I am pulling the multimeter. Good thing we found the unit!
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Old 07-22-2015, 12:11 PM   #20
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. I thought these things are designed to be eyeball-ed. Apparently not so.
Strange coincidence, you're the second forum member this week to find that out.

Oh well, look at this as a learning experience and if you have another electrical situation far from home you'll already be more familiar with your electrical setup.

Ron
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