Corroded Window Screws

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Klem

I'm puzzle why when 'we' find any defects there are a small group of folks that seem to discredit it.

I went back through the whole thread, and I didn't find anyone questioning that there is a problem with premature corrosion with the window screws on some trailers. The wandering discussion of trends in quality are not about the specific problem being reported here, it's just a natural sidetrack.

[escape artist]

Hi: All...Just wondering...is there a case of dissimilar metals here causing the corrosion/rusting or just poor screws? Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[dfandrews]

Originally Posted by escape artist

Hi: All...Just wondering...is there a case of dissimilar metals here causing the corrosion/rusting or just poor screws? Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

Since I don't have my Escape yet, but did bring the issue up with Reace because I found past reference to the corrosion problem, I'd like some details and clarifications. Please bear with me.

I gather that the screws are steel, inserted from the inside, to attach windows with aluminum frames. Correct?

Are the screws plated, or painted, or could the coating be powder-coat? (usually a polyester product)

Are there installations with stainless steel screws?

Does anyone know the size of the screws? (# x length)
Thanks.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I can't lose the nightmare of the day my dad traded in a Mercedes 190D on a Valiant. I sat in the driver seat and couldn't avoid looking at the paint runs on the passenger door window frame.
Never forgave him.

Well, on the plus side, the old Slant 6 engines in the Valiants were reliable. But speaking of rust, the Valiant body rusted away so fast it hardly mattered how long the engine lasted.

[Rossue]

Originally Posted by dfandrews

Since I don't have my Escape yet, but did bring the issue up with Reace because I found past reference to the corrosion problem, I'd like some details and clarifications. Please bear with me.

I gather that the screws are steel, inserted from the inside, to attach windows with aluminum frames. Correct?

Are the screws plated, or painted, or could the coating be powder-coat? (usually a polyester product)

Are there installations with stainless steel screws?

Does anyone know the size of the screws? (# x length)
Thanks.

The screw label on my bag of stainless says #8 X 5/8". After torquing of the heads I called Albanyfasteners.com and was told that the stainless going into aluminum frame was not a good idea unless you used a washer that was stainless on one side and some non-metallic finish on the other. Otherwise the dissimilar metals will cause corrosion. The OEM screws are anodized steel I believe; they are not powder coated.

In one PM I exchanged with a forum member he alluded to having a small plastic washer under his screws in one of the earliest 21's built. I don't have them and don't remember if the 2010 17B did.

[OneOleMan]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

They're better now: a recent GM car (to avoid comparisons between companies) is better built, better finished, more reliable, and longer-lasting than my parents' GM cars of 1971 and 1979.

I dunno 'bout that, my dad's 1955 Buick survived 3 teenage boys and was still going strong with about 100K miles on the clock when I went into the service.

[Dave Walter]

I agree that cars are more durable now than ever. When I was a kid, a car with 100k miles was considered exceptional and was likely to die at any moment. Today, most cars are still going strong at 100k miles (160k kilometres). All of the vehicles I have had in the past few years have been driven at least into the 160k to 220k miles range (250k to 350k km) before giving up the ghost. Many are driving their vehicles even further.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by ice-breaker

I agree that cars are more durable now than ever. When I was a kid, a car with 100k miles was considered exceptional and was likely to die at any moment. Today, most cars are still going strong at 100k miles (160k kilometres). All of the vehicles I have had in the past few years have been driven at least into the 160k to 220k miles range (250k to 350k km) before giving up the ghost. Many are driving their vehicles even further.

A friend who bought my 1990 Corolla would have make it to 300K miles easily mechanically, but Wisconsin road salt did in the frame at about 290K miles.

[dfandrews]

Originally Posted by Rossue

The screw label on my bag of stainless says #8 X 5/8". After torquing of the heads I called Albanyfasteners.com and was told that the stainless going into aluminum frame was not a good idea unless you used a washer that was stainless on one side and some non-metallic finish on the other. Otherwise the dissimilar metals will cause corrosion. The OEM screws are anodized steel I believe; they are not powder coated.

In one PM I exchanged with a forum member he alluded to having a small plastic washer under his screws in one of the earliest 21's built. I don't have them and don't remember if the 2010 17B did.

Ross,
Thanks for the info. I've been researching this, and have found that a plethora of variables govern, in most of the discussions I've read. Among them, disturbance of surface coatings, moisture, salts present in the atmosphere. More later.

(P.S. interesting background observation: my sunroom, 6063 aluminum extrusions w/T6 hardening, held together with #6 SS self-threading screws that appear to be powder-coated, and where the coating comes off of ½ the threads, shows no signs of corrosion through 4 years, 10 miles from the So.Calif Pacific coast w/ sea breezes and moisture most afternoons.)

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by escape artist

Hi: All...Just wondering...is there a case of dissimilar metals here causing the corrosion/rusting or just poor screws? Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

Just did a careful check of the screws in my trailer, made 3/14, and there aren't any signs of corrosion. So it looks like there was a window of time there when a bad batch of screws was used.

I've had marine windows with s/s screws, like 50 per window, on the exterior, not the interior. They were sometimes washed daily in salt water. The screws themselves were unaffected but after 10 years or so corrosion developed around them on the aluminum. Likely because the anodizing on the aluminum was destroyed by the screw hole and countersinking and the effect of dissimilar metals took effect.

I'm still a little surprised that screws in the interior would rust as much as they did given that most screws seem to be plated these days. But in this case, maybe not properly.

Ron

[cpaharley2008]

Maybe we need to inspect or tour other units at Osoyoos to make a logical conclusion if it is the screw or type of install or some other variable involved. I'll volunteer mine to start.

[padlin]

Took a quick look at mine this am and saw what looks like surface rust on the screws for the kitchen window. Dropped ETI a note about new screws. Got a reply " the rusty screws in question on the forum were from a bad batch and should only include trailers built within the last 3-4 months". Guess I take a closer look in tomorrow as mine in from June.

Oops!

[Klem]

I sent an email requesting new screws. Reace asked for some pictures to look over.

And this is my justification:
I would like to replace them for 2 reasons: people sitting at the dinette and bed can get rust stains on their clothing and the condensation drips will result in the rust staining the window frame … and vinyl eventually

I plan to 'tip them' with bar soap and they should tap back in easily.

[J Mac]

There're several grades of stainless steel. I doubt window mounting screws are made with the same surgical grade stainless as operating room instruments.
Still, one shouldn't have to pay much for a box of 100 stainless steel # 8 screws. I don't see this as a big deal. Think of it as maintainence or an easy mod!

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by OneOleMan

I dunno 'bout that, my dad's 1955 Buick survived 3 teenage boys and was still going strong with about 100K miles on the clock when I went into the service.

The 1970's were probably a quality low point, with earlier products perhaps tougher (although poor performers by current standards)... but our family's 1958 Pontiac essentially dissolved when we moved to a place were road salt was used; every car I've owned has out-lasted that Pontiac. There are so many aspects to quality...

[iamunique127]

Originally Posted by padlin

Got a reply " the rusty screws in question on the forum were from a bad batch and should only include trailers built within the last 3-4 months".

Mine was made within that time period. That makes me a bit nervous but I'll have to wait and see if any rust developes.

Originally Posted by Klem

I sent an email requesting new screws.

I don't blame you. Those are some ugly looking screws for a relatively new trailer. When was it made?

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by padlin

Got a reply " the rusty screws in question on the forum were from a bad batch and should only include trailers built within the last 3-4 months". Guess I take a closer look in tomorrow as mine in from June.

I've got dirt on my trailer that's older than that. Since I had a July 3rd pickup date, I'll just keep an eye on the screws as well. I've taken a couple of the windows out of my Scamp a half-dozen times. Replacing screws shouldn't be a major problem. If you decide to go with SS, be sure to put a plastic/teflon washer under the screw head, otherwise you may end up with galling and that would be worse than some rusty screws.

[Dave Walter]

Originally Posted by Klem

I sent an email requesting new screws. Reace asked for some pictures to look over.

And this is my justification:
I would like to replace them for 2 reasons: people sitting at the dinette and bed can get rust stains on their clothing and the condensation drips will result in the rust staining the window frame … and vinyl eventually

I plan to 'tip them' with bar soap and they should tap back in easily.

Rather than go to the effort of replacing the screws, I think that I would take a small brush and a can of black Rustoleum paint, and put a dab over each of the screws. Should look fine afterwards.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by ice-breaker

Rather than go to the effort of replacing the screws, I think that I would take a small brush and a can of black Rustoleum paint, and put a dab over each of the screws. Should look fine afterwards.

You beat me to the suggestion I was just about to make. That is what I would try anyway.

[J Mac]

Everbilt #10 x 3/4 in. Stainless-Steel Pan-Head Phillips Drive Sheet Metal Screw (25-Piece)-800202 - The Home Depot

12 dollars ought to set you up with 100 pcs.