Lift kit for Escape 21

[Bill_75]

Hi Bob,

Thanks for taking the time and effort to measure this for me(us). It is appreciated, really.

And, Jim thanks for the insight/warning in the stabilizers. Hadn't thought about that.

I think I'm going to approximate 16' from the hitch to the midpoint between the tires, and have a run at it with my 21'4" board. I got a D in geometry, so would trust my hypotenuse.

Appreciate it.

Thank you.

[Bobbito]

This morning I drove our Escape 21 to ETI for them to install the Dexter lift kit, and also replace a sometimes leaky black tank dump valve.

Reace mentioned he received a call from another Escaper asking about the towing stability with the lift kit and asked if I would post about our towing experience pre and post lift kit.

When I picked up the trailer at the end of the day Dennis said the job took a little longer than anticipated, because they had to remove and later replace some foam to get at a few bolts.

As I towed it home to Surrey, I am pleased to report that I couldn’t tell the difference in towing characteristics between the trip there and the trip back. It towed very well before and after the lift kit installation. For the record, the roadway of the freeway (divided highway) is similar to and from Chilliwack, with both smooth and somewhat wavy/bumpy areas. The wind conditions were similar morning and afternoon.

On arriving home I took a picture of the trailer and made a few clearance measurements before moving it to the gravel driveway beside our house. I realized that the clearances I reported earlier and taken while parked on the gravel driveway were a bit off. The street measurements following the lift kit installation are:

Front jacks: 13”
Hitch: 11.5”
Low points in foam insulation: 13” except one point that was 12”

-the clearance measurements pre lift kit should have been 2 5/8 inches less that these. I think that the measurements on our gravel driveway were influenced by a peak in the driveway, where the hitch was on one side of the peak and the trailer wheels on the other side. My apologies for missing this.

-If you don’t have the spray on foam insulation, you have 1 – 2 more inches of clearance in many places.

I will need to use a couple of leveling squares under the hitch foot to raise the trailer hitch off the ball in future, and probably one or two under the jacks, depending on the slope. On the plus side, the step isn’t a problem. Pre the lift kit the step was actually on the low side for us.

I am glad we now have the added clearance. It now matches the clearance in our previous stick built trailer. It will give me peace of mind as we negotiate the rougher logging and forest service roads to some of our favorite lakes.

Bob K

[rbryan4]

Nice write up Bob.

[gbaglo]

Good work.
Now how about revealing those fishing holes?

[Bobbito]

Alas, I learned to keep the best destinations secret. Some are already so crowded we are never sure we can get a campsite. Merritt, Sun Peaks and 100 Mile House are the general locales.
I am furiously tying flies that worked last year, mostly Chironomid and microleech patterns, plus staples like Mayfly, Caddis, dragon and damsel fly nymphs.

May can't come soon enough! Could be that one of these days our Escapes will be parked on the same lake.

Bob K


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[thumper-tx]

Bobbito,
Thanks for the post with your impressions on the towing of the lifted 21. I am the guy who called and talked to Reese about the lift while you were there having yours done. He told me he was going to ask you to post your experiences with the lifted 21 so we could all learn something. I got the impression that there are not many lifted 21's out there yet.

Our finished 21 is sitting on the Escape lot now I am going to have the lift added to ours before we get up there to pick it up, based on your observations. I really would like to have that extra ground clearance for forest service roads and off grid camping. Heck, I kind of need it on my driveway which can get pretty bad after a big rain.
Viron B

[freespirit]

Originally Posted by Bobbito

On arriving home I took a picture of the trailer and made a few clearance measurements before moving it to the gravel driveway beside our house. I realized that the clearances I reported earlier and taken while parked on the gravel driveway were a bit off. The street measurements following the lift kit installation are:

Front jacks: 13”
Hitch: 11.5”
Low points in foam insulation: 13” except one point that was 12”

-the clearance measurements pre lift kit should have been 2 5/8 inches less that these. I think that the measurements on our gravel driveway were influenced by a peak in the driveway, where the hitch was on one side of the peak and the trailer wheels on the other side. My apologies for missing this.

-If you don’t have the spray on foam insulation, you have 1 – 2 more inches of clearance in many places.

I will need to use a couple of leveling squares under the hitch foot to raise the trailer hitch off the ball in future, and probably one or two under the jacks, depending on the slope. On the plus side, the step isn’t a problem. Pre the lift kit the step was actually on the low side for us.

I am glad we now have the added clearance. It now matches the clearance in our previous stick built trailer. It will give me peace of mind as we negotiate the rougher logging and forest service roads to some of our favorite lakes.

Bob K

What is your hitch ball height on the escape 21 after lift kit install?
Eti said escape 19 was 21.5 inches with lift kit.

[Bobbito]

With the trailer unhitched, I couldn't do the actual measurement. However, I measured the distance from the low point of the Anderson hitch (11.5") to the top of the ball receiver and it was about 9.5 inches. So, based on that the top of the ball would be just under 21 inches.

I am glad I had the kit installed. To my mind, the added 2 5/8 inches clearance is significant. Where the foam covered under trailer parts used to protrude below the level of the axle, now most of them are at or above the axle level.

For people not venturing onto rough 4 x 4 roads, I don't think the conversion makes sense, but for those that do I think this is the way to go. Prior to this lift kit I'm pretty sure I would have bottomed out on some of the roads we used to take our Nash trailer to. Now we have the same clearance on our Escape!!!

I'm also pleased with the look of the trailer. I worried it might seem too high or that the step might be too big for my wife. I WILL need to use a few more of the stacking levelling blocks on the stabilizers and front jack, but it is certainly worth the minor inconvenience to me.

Bob K

[freespirit]

thanks for the info Bob...I am considering getting the lift kit also for an Escape 19, especially since it is less expensive to install at build time and apparently can be removed later if need be.

[skyfree]

Has anyone on here actually scraped an unlifted Escape? It's interesting to me that the Un-lifted ground clearance is close to 10". That is almost exactly what a Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon has stock. So in 99% of cases you will hang up on something with the tow vehicle before the trailer hits anything even with no lift. I haven't seen pics, but I assume this is a body lift only so the axle is still the lowest point in either configuration?

The above only applies to traversing obstacles (rocks, stumps, etc) on flat ground. The breakover angle is always the biggest problem with trailers because of the long lever in front of and behind the axle. A 2.5" lift will help that somewhat, but it's not the same as lifting a vehicle that has 4 wheels on the corners with much less extension ahead of the front axle and behind the rear. You only have to lift the tongue about 3-4" to remove that 2.5" extra in the back using ballpark geometry. I guess that's pretty significant in the real world.

I only bring this up because I'm struggling with the same issue for my build. My Touareg has oversize BFG A/T tires with about 9" of ground clearance, which seems a good match to the Escape trailers (assuming the 19' has the same clearance). My old 22' trailer had less ground clearance with those metal things on the back that prevent the back of the trailer from dragging on the ground. When I sold it they were still unscratched and pristine despite having gone off-road a bit in the desert.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by skyfree

Has anyone on here actually scraped an unlifted Escape? It's interesting to me that the Un-lifted ground clearance is close to 10". That is almost exactly what a Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon has stock. So in 99% of cases you will hang up on something with the tow vehicle before the trailer hits anything even with no lift. I haven't seen pics, but I assume this is a body lift only so the axle is still the lowest point in either configuration?

I agree. Ground clearance is rarely an issue with travel trailers of any brand, and when it it, the part hanging up is usually waste plumbing, not the axle. The lift kit is not quite a body lift (in offroad vehicle terms) because it is not between the frame and body; it is like the kits which lift independent front suspension by inserting spacing frames between the suspension crossmember and the frame, or a bit like spacer blocks over the axle in a spring-over-axle leaf-spring setup.

Originally Posted by skyfree

The above only applies to traversing obstacles (rocks, stumps, etc) on flat ground. The breakover angle is always the biggest problem with trailers because of the long lever in front of and behind the axle.

Again, I agree (except that it is departure and breakover angles), and that's what we have been discussing.

Originally Posted by skyfree

A 2.5" lift will help that somewhat, but it's not the same as lifting a vehicle that has 4 wheels on the corners with much less extension ahead of the front axle and behind the rear. You only have to lift the tongue about 3-4" to remove that 2.5" extra in the back using ballpark geometry. I guess that's pretty significant in the real world.

Right, but if you need more clearance a bit of improvement is better than no improvement, isn't it?

Originally Posted by skyfree

I only bring this up because I'm struggling with the same issue for my build. My Touareg has oversize BFG A/T tires with about 9" of ground clearance, which seems a good match to the Escape trailers (assuming the 19' has the same clearance). My old 22' trailer had less ground clearance with those metal things on the back that prevent the back of the trailer from dragging on the ground. When I sold it they were still unscratched and pristine despite having gone off-road a bit in the desert.

Many trailers have the floor right over top of the tires, so the frame is quite high. Escapes are set lower (which I like for ease of entry and other reasons). The stepped-up rear frame section helps, but the Escape is still relatively low. What was the height to those skids on the old trailer, compared to the height to the bottom of the bumper on an Escape 19'?

[Losangeles]

Originally Posted by skyfree

Has anyone on here actually scraped an unlifted Escape? It's interesting to me that the Un-lifted ground clearance is close to 10". That is almost exactly what a Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon has stock. So in 99% of cases you will hang up on something with the tow vehicle before the trailer hits anything even with no lift. I haven't seen pics, but I assume this is a body lift only so the axle is still the lowest point in either configuration?

The above only applies to traversing obstacles (rocks, stumps, etc) on flat ground. The breakover angle is always the biggest problem with trailers because of the long lever in front of and behind the axle. A 2.5" lift will help that somewhat, but it's not the same as lifting a vehicle that has 4 wheels on the corners with much less extension ahead of the front axle and behind the rear. You only have to lift the tongue about 3-4" to remove that 2.5" extra in the back using ballpark geometry. I guess that's pretty significant in the real world.

I only bring this up because I'm struggling with the same issue for my build. My Touareg has oversize BFG A/T tires with about 9" of ground clearance, which seems a good match to the Escape trailers (assuming the 19' has the same clearance). My old 22' trailer had less ground clearance with those metal things on the back that prevent the back of the trailer from dragging on the ground. When I sold it they were still unscratched and pristine despite having gone off-road a bit in the desert.

great post. great info. thanks for sharing.

interested to see what people say.....

[Bobbito]

I want to reiterate that the up to 2 inches of spray foam insulation was the main reason for my concern about clearance, though the front jacks were also a bit low in my estimate. I may have been less likely to go with the lift kit if I didn't have the added foam. I think people need to consider how likely they are to take their Escape down roads with big dips and pot holes. We fall into that category.

I understand that the ends of the trailer are still able to tip closer to the ground due to either how the trailer is levelled or how the hitch bobs up and down on a rough road. I do feel a bit better even though the added clearance is only 2 5/8".

I too would love to hear if any rough road riders have damaged the underside of their Escape, and whether they had the foam insulation.

Bob K

[Rossue]

Our first Escape was a 17B that was lowered by the first owner to fit in his garage. We boondocked a bit with it and never had an issue with it bottoming out.

[Losangeles]

Originally Posted by Bobbito

I want to reiterate that the up to 2 inches of spray foam insulation was the main reason for my concern about clearance, though the front jacks were also a bit low in my estimate. ...... I think people need to consider how likely they are to take their Escape down roads with big dips and pot holes. We fall into that category.

...... I too would love to hear if any rough road riders have damaged the underside of their Escape, and whether they had the foam insulation.

Bob K

Just to play the devil's advocate, FWIIW

I have towed our Casita down some pretty rutted and crazy muddy wet dirt roads....

but by carefully straddling huge rutts and potholes, I never scraped a thing.

I know that sometimes there are side clearance issues.... but in my experience the worst of the dangers can be cleverly avoided by straddling / angling / weaving around dangers.

[freespirit]

okay a few random thoughts why might get lift for Escape 19 and let you the rv trailer experts educate me....I checked out a Casita a bit and if I remember they told me it was about 21 inches hitch ball height with the high lift option, which they also told me was one of the most popular options. The lift seemed very good for the full size truck TV hitch ball height. While the Casita frame is somewhat similar to the Escape with a similar axle mount to frame with plumbing and tanks underneath also similar, it seemed prudent to get something similar on the Escape 19. ETI told me with lift kit ball height was 21.5 inches, so that seems pretty close to the Casita. Casita has no foam and I didn't plan on it immediately for the Escape either for various reasons, granted the Casita trailer is a bit shorter but tires and everything else are similar. Anticipate being somewhat off pavement so the lift option seems prudent. Am I missing something?

[Bobbito]

If you don't have the spray foam you should have sufficient clearance for moderately rough roads. And of coarse you will always need to be aware of where your low points are on the trailer as you negotiate the dips and ruts in the road.


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[Bill_75]

Originally Posted by Bill_75

Hi Bob,

Thanks for taking the time and effort to measure this for me(us). It is appreciated, really.

And, Jim thanks for the insight/warning in the stabilizers. Hadn't thought about that.

I think I'm going to approximate 16' from the hitch to the midpoint between the tires, and have a run at it with my 21'4" board. I got a D in geometry, so wouldn't trust my hypotenuse.

Appreciate it.

Thank you.

Hi Guys,

Just a quick update, and forewarning on the clearance of the trailer.

If you get the WDH, then the L-Bracket becomes your low point on the trailer.

The L-Brackets can be removed, but be forewarned.

It was a scramble here in the dark when we got home from Chilliwack last month.

Thanks.

[Porsche Pilot]

We have the lift kit on our 21 with the foam undercoat. It is a great combination, the foam gives the underside more protection on gravel roads and the extra 2.5 inches makes a big difference. The new style jacks have much more travel than the older scissor style so that isn't really an issue.

[thiggins]

It's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

:-)