Propane levels

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by santacruzer

I don't recall the cost per gallon, it varies from station to station.

Around Cdn$0.70/L here currently, which would be very roughly US$2.40/USgallon... but

• fuel prices vary widely between regions due to taxes
• propane prices vary due to transportation cost (high compared to gasoline)
• propane prices are highly volatile due to supply and demand issues
• prices between stations may vary more than gasoline since the market is less competitive.

The fixed cost for a small propane cylinder fill (which is how it's done here) is normally higher than the bulk price because it is a small convenience transaction.

[thoer]

The exchange tanks seem to be where people get deceived if they don't read the info. My understanding is that none or almost none of the exchange companies in the states actually put 20lbs in the tanks anymore. (Blue Rhino now only puts 15Lbs in, down even more from the 17 they used to.)

They usually state it somewhere, but I doubt most people read the "fine print"

[santacruzer]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

No, we are paying for what we get, regardless of the size of the container. A common propane tank is called a 20-pound tank because it holds 20 pounds of propane when filled to the proper level. We get 20 pounds, and we pay for 20 pounds. I think that's 4.6 US gallons, so santacruzer gets a receipt showing that his 20 pounds is 4.6 gallons, although the tank is bigger than that (about 5.8 US gallons), because that's what they correctly put in.

Sorta correct, but not quite...I get a receipt for X # of gallons that filled my bottle to the 80% mark, which means I have 20 pounds of propane in the bottle now.

And that's pretty much what you said!

[santacruzer]

Residential propane around here goes from $2.12 - $3.78/gallon, depending on who owns the tanks, supplier, location on the routes, amount delivered, and who knows what else. Small bottle fills at gas stations are $2.99 and up per gallon. Right now prices seem to be floowing gas prices and dropping.

[gclatz]

Originally Posted by thoer

The exchange tanks seem to be where people get deceived if they don't read the info. My understanding is that none or almost none of the exchange companies in the states actually put 20lbs in the tanks anymore. (Blue Rhino now only puts 15Lbs in, down even more from the 17 they used to.)

They usually state it somewhere, but I doubt most people read the "fine print"

Savages, there is no shame in this world, charging You more for less

[Jim Bennett]

Where I get my propane, if I fill my tank, and they put in 16.4 pounds, that is what I pay for. This is great, because if a tank is low, I can just top it off.

I thought with places that just do exchange, you do get a full 20 pound tank, or at least are supposed to. Could be different across the continent though.

I have only once, and that was 20+ years ago, somewhere in the NW US, had my tanks filled by volume. That really seemed crude to me.

[thoer]

Jim, it could well be that Canada has tighter restrictions on that, but here in the states, I don't know of any major exchange companies that put in 20 lbs. Here is the excuse Blue Rhino uses on their website, (basically: everybody else was ripping customers off even more so we get to also!)

"Inflationary pressures, including the volatile costs of steel, diesel fuel, and propane, have had a significant impact on the cylinder exchange industry. In 2008, to help control these rising costs, Blue Rhino followed the example of other consumer products companies with a product content change. We reduced the amount of propane in our tanks from 17 pounds to 15 pounds"

[gclatz]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

Where I get my propane, if I fill my tank, and they put in 16.4 pounds, that is what I pay for. This is great, because if a tank is low, I can just top it off.

I thought with places that just do exchange, you do get a full 20 pound tank, or at least are supposed to. Could be different across the continent though.

I have only once, and that was 20+ years ago, somewhere in the NW US, had my tanks filled by volume. That really seemed crude to me.

Here in BC if Your tank is empty You go straight to the cashier to pay for 20 pounds.

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by gclatz

Here in BC if Your tank is empty You go straight to the cashier to pay for 20 pounds.

If you are talking about the Husky/Mowhawk on 3rd in North Van ( where I fill ), the operator puts the tank on the scale and can tell you that it is empty. You can go pay, since you know how much is required to fill it, or you can stand there and watch him fill the tank and pay after he's done.
I have paid for 19 lbs at that station.

[gbaglo]

I use a luggage scale to weigh my propane tanks.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by thoer

The exchange tanks seem to be where people get deceived if they don't read the info. My understanding is that none or almost none of the exchange companies in the states actually put 20lbs in the tanks anymore. (Blue Rhino now only puts 15Lbs in, down even more from the 17 they used to.)

They usually state it somewhere, but I doubt most people read the "fine print"

It's the same here, and I agree: there's nothing wrong with the propane tank standards, it's just that these exchange services (Blue Rhino and others) routinely sell as little as 15 pounds or 7 kilograms of propane in a 20lb/9kg capacity tank. It wouldn't be so bad if they charged less for less propane, but they are also expensive. It also means you are more likely to run out while camping.

One service here prints the 7 kg quantity very clearly on the label, but who expects to buy a less-than-full container of anything, and who wants to exchange tanks more frequently than necessary?

I particularly despise Blue Rhino because they continue to publish a fraudulent statement regarding the fill level in their website FAQ, instead of just being honest. They also have an honest statement (quoted by Eric above) of the actual quantity in the tank.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

I use a luggage scale to weigh my propane tanks.

I thought that was for all those fish you catch?

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

Where I get my propane, if I fill my tank, and they put in 16.4 pounds, that is what I pay for. This is great, because if a tank is low, I can just top it off.

You're lucky - I haven't run across a station that charges for actual amount (rather than flat rate for a fill) yet, although I vaguely recall someone mentioning one in the Edmonton area. I agree the ability to top off is great - for most people, if they could depart for a camping trip with a full tank every time, they wouldn't need a second tank on the trailer.

Jim, can you share which station - or chain - this would be?

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

I thought with places that just do exchange, you do get a full 20 pound tank, or at least are supposed to. Could be different across the continent though.

Even different within the same province. As long as the label says how much the consumer is getting, it can be whatever amount they want. My earlier 7 kg example was in Edmonton at a gas station; I see exchange setups all the time, but rarely look at the quantity because I am normally not interested in using them.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by thoer

I thought that was for all those fish you catch?

Fishermen don't need anything to weigh the fish - it just limits the creativity in their story-telling.

[Jim Bennett]

Originally Posted by thoer

I thought that was for all those fish you catch?

He just GOES fishing.

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

Jim, can you share which station - or chain - this would be?

Calgary Co-op.

I thought more places do that. I fuel up there as often as possible, as you get an instant 3¢/litre grocery coupon, plus a 6¢/litre in membership refunds at the end of the year. Plus, they have full service, which I always prefer, if available.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

Calgary Co-op.

Thanks. None here, of course, but an option when passing through Calgary.

The equivalent here would be North Central Co-op, but most of their locations don't offer propane. I'll try to remember to check out one of the ones that does.

[hotfishtacos]

Originally Posted by thoer

I thought that was for all those fish you catch?

That's why he uses it for propane!

[rbryan4]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

It's the same here, and I agree: there's nothing wrong with the propane tank standards, it's just that these exchange services (Blue Rhino and others) routinely sell as little as 15 pounds or 7 kilograms of propane in a 20lb/9kg capacity tank. It wouldn't be so bad if they charged less for less propane, but they are also expensive. It also means you are more likely to run out while camping.

One service here prints the 7 kg quantity very clearly on the label, but who expects to buy a less-than-full container of anything, and who wants to exchange tanks more frequently than necessary?

I particularly despise Blue Rhino because they continue to publish a fraudulent statement regarding the fill level in their website FAQ, instead of just being honest. They also have an honest statement (quoted by Eric above) of the actual quantity in the tank.

I agree completely. Blue Rhino is very prevalent here, and its always the most expensive propane around to boot.

I get my tanks filled at the U-Haul store, and can verify the amount they dispense as well as the weight of the tanks. Its sold by volume which makes it great when the tank is partially full - and you only pay for the amount you get. As long as the tank certification stamp is not expired and it passes their visual inspection, they will fill it.

[thoer]

Same for me - U-Haul. Last time I was there was the first time anyone actually checked the tank date. I think when my tank is ready to expire, I'll do a Blue Rhino exchange just 'cause they are such a wonderful company

[Jim Bennett]

I have very rarely filled up where they do not check the date first. Not sure what the penalty is, but I know there can be one if they neglect this.

Do the gas station attendants in the US have to take some approved training on handling and dispensing propane at a fuel station? They do here. I have had to go to another station before, when they did not have someone trained working at the time.
http://www.propane.ca/sites/default/...2012-04(3).pdf