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Old 11-23-2013, 11:09 PM   #1
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Transfer Switch Question

If I understand correctly, the Carmanah Go-Power TS-30 transfer switch supplied by Escape can control and switch only two 120 v AC power sources. Therefore, if one chooses an inverter as an option, it would be connected to the default terminals of the TS and the shore power cord would be connected to the dominant terminals. Now the question... if one does not have shore power available but does have a portable generator, can the shore power cord be plugged into the generator resulting in all the trailer AC outlets being fed by the generator?

Thanks,
Larry
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Old 11-24-2013, 10:20 AM   #2
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Hi Larry,

We just picked up our 21. Escape now offers a transfer switch to all outlets as an option.

Kathie
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Old 11-24-2013, 11:26 AM   #3
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Regardless of what outlets are handled by the transfer switch, I assume that it is for the inverter, not an external generator.

Yes, the normal method to power an RV from a portable generator is to plug the shore power cord into it. Most generators don't have the typical 30-amp RV socket (NEMA type TT-30), so you would typically need an adapter. If you have a detachable shore power cord and want the generator right beside the trailer, you could make or perhaps buy a separate short cord to connect the generator to the the trailer without using the normal shore power cord. If the generator's socket and the socket of the detachable shore power cord are the same, that direct cord would also work as an extension for the shore power cord.
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Old 11-25-2013, 12:04 PM   #4
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I just talked to Reace and George.

When Escape installs the transfer switch they feed the (GO Power 30amp) transfer switch from a 20amp 120V AC breaker and the inverter output.

The transfer switch output (from the inverter or whatever the power cord is plugged in to - generator, 120V power grid, etc.) goes to another breaker box with 2 15amp breakers - which feeds the plugs. The microwave is normally NOT fed via the transfer switch, but can be if you request it. (You need to request it if you want to run the microwave from the inverter - we want to and have requested it.)
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Old 11-25-2013, 12:34 PM   #5
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Just trying to understand. But let's face it - I'm struggling ; ) . The standard exterior power cord is 30 amp, the trailer panel is 30 amp, and the wire fed from the panel to the transfer switch is 20 amp? j
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Old 11-25-2013, 01:05 PM   #6
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That is what Escape said.
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Old 11-25-2013, 01:41 PM   #7
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A 1500 watt inverter would only need a 15 amp wire, so a 20 amp feed would certainly be adequate.
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Old 11-25-2013, 03:03 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamman View Post
I just talked to Reace and George.

When Escape installs the transfer switch they feed the (GO Power 30amp) transfer switch from a 20amp 120V AC breaker and the inverter output.

The transfer switch output (from the inverter or whatever the power cord is plugged in to - generator, 120V power grid, etc.) goes to another breaker box with 2 15amp breakers - which feeds the plugs. The microwave is normally NOT fed via the transfer switch, but can be if you request it. (You need to request it if you want to run the microwave from the inverter - we want to and have requested it.)
Doug, Thanks for adding this comment about the transfer switch. When I originally asked about using a microwave on 12Volt, I was told that I would be fine as long as I ordered the 1500 watt inverter. When I just quoted your response to Kim, I was then told that yes, I would need the transfer switch, would I like it added to the build sheet? Living 3000 miles from Chilliwack, I would have been upset after hitting the road and finding out that I couldn't use the microwave with the 1500 watt inverter without adding "one more part!"
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Old 11-25-2013, 03:59 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
A 1500 watt inverter would only need a 15 amp wire, so a 20 amp feed would certainly be adequate.
The reason for 2 circuits is when you are on shore power, not the inverter. On shore power with the 30amp cord and no xfer switch you could run 2 full 15amp circuits at once - electric frying pan and toaster - say - on different circuits. (Assuming no other loads - batteries fully charged, no A/C, no water heater, etc.)

On the xfer switch you will be limited to 20 amps total from the outlets. (Unless of course you run heavier wire to the xfer switch and run it off a 30 amp breaker - which the power panel is not rated for.)
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:07 PM   #10
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Essentially, if the inverter is not installed I could run 2 appliances (assuming your conditions) if plugged into shore power; but if I select the inverter option I could only run 1 appliance because of how the inverter/transfer switch/AC supply are wired? j
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:18 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by jamie beers View Post
Essentially, if the inverter is not installed I could run 2 appliances (assuming your conditions) if plugged into shore power; but if I select the inverter option I could only run 1 appliance because of how the inverter/transfer switch/AC supply are wired? j
Depending on the appliances and the outlets - yes. In theory you lose but - how often will you run all those appliances at once? (And where do you keep them all? And where do you find counter space for them? LOL) Practically speaking I am quite happy with Escape's xfer switch implementation, which I have added to our build sheet.

The trailer can draw 30amps from shore power - split up however you like - but remember the converter/charger (and any 12V loads), fridge on auto, dual source water heater if on, and especially the A/C will cut into (or totally use up) that 30 amps. Escape is reasonably figuring those loads will exist - so a max of 20amps for the outlets is quite reasonable.
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:27 PM   #12
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Thanks very much for taking time to answer my questions! It all seems good. My goal is just to try to understand as much as I can - pros, cons, limitations, everything - as thoroughly as possible. Hoping to minimize the "I never knew/I wish I'd known..." moments down the road! : )

Geez - I never thought of this, your email seems to indicate that I might not be able to
plug in my electric margarita maker with the fridge, hot water, and A/C running full blast. Better buy that hand crank one..... j
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Old 11-25-2013, 11:00 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by jamie beers View Post
Thanks very much for taking time to answer my questions! It all seems good. My goal is just to try to understand as much as I can - pros, cons, limitations, everything - as thoroughly as possible. Hoping to minimize the "I never knew/I wish I'd known..." moments down the road! : )

Geez - I never thought of this, your email seems to indicate that I might not be able to
plug in my electric margarita maker with the fridge, hot water, and A/C running full blast. Better buy that hand crank one..... j
Jamie I think things have become a bit convoluted on this thread!!! You have to keep in mind that the only reason that your are running Air/C is because it's hot. Therefore, you have to set your priorities correctly. Probably Air/C first, and then Margaritas. Run the fridge on propane (get the "Texas" fan option... $125 to help keep the fridge cool), and don't heat your water for a shower... use cold!!!

Then you're "Good to Go"... don't worry about converters/inverters/transfer switches/etc.... "Be Happy"!!!

You're Welcome,
Larry
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Old 11-26-2013, 12:19 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamman View Post
I just talked to Reace and George.

When Escape installs the transfer switch they feed the (GO Power 30amp) transfer switch from a 20amp 120V AC breaker and the inverter output.

The transfer switch output (from the inverter or whatever the power cord is plugged in to - generator, 120V power grid, etc.) goes to another breaker box with 2 15amp breakers - which feeds the plugs. The microwave is normally NOT fed via the transfer switch, but can be if you request it. (You need to request it if you want to run the microwave from the inverter - we want to and have requested it.)
Jamman, I have been studying, in detail, a great number of posts on this forum. In addition, I have had a lot of questions answered by Kim at Escape. To date, I have found that Escapeís standard offerings and additional options all make perfect sense. They appear to configure all pieces to work in unison. However, your above described explanation received from Reace that the standard wiring from the inverter does not include the microwave has got me stumped. Why would that not be a standard connection?

We are planning to order their standard offering microwave (Dometic Model CDMW07) which has a 700W rating, the 1500W inverter, TS-30 transfer switch and the twin 6v battery package (232 AH rating).

Off grid, common sense dictates that one would not exceed 10 - 15 minutes per day on this microwave (12 - 18 AH) off the 6vís. Especially, no problem if backed up by solar.

Does anyone have an explanation for this Save me from asking Reace this question... Heís busy enough... building all of us our trailers...

Larry
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Old 11-26-2013, 12:37 AM   #15
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I did not ask him why. I *suspect* it is due to the high battery current draw when using the microwave. I *think* he is worried about indiscriminate use and ruined batteries.
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Old 11-26-2013, 01:34 AM   #16
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Yes, it makes sense Doug... after posting, I realized too that some folks may ask for the microwave only, but no inverter. Therefore standard wiring would be A/Current source, through breaker to microwave. I just assumed that if one asks for an inverter c/w TS, the output from the TS would include the microwave... but I should know what ASSUME stands for... LOL!!!

I sure learnt something from this thread... and again Doug, thanks for your help!!!

Larry
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Old 11-26-2013, 09:02 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stargeezer View Post
jamie i think things have become a bit convoluted on this thread!!! You have to keep in mind that the only reason that your are running air/c is because it's hot. Therefore, you have to set your priorities correctly. Probably air/c first, and then margaritas. Run the fridge on propane (get the "texas" fan option... $125 to help keep the fridge cool), and don't heat your water for a shower... Use cold!!!

Then you're "good to go"... Don't worry about converters/inverters/transfer switches/etc.... "be happy"!!!

You're welcome,
larry
lol : )
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Old 09-05-2014, 11:42 AM   #18
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Found this thread by accident, and am glad I did. Post #4 is very important if correct: that ETI will wire the microwave outlet only upon request. Have emailed ETI for clarification as like others I thought that by paying $300 for the Transfer Switch option that ALL outlets were wired.

I need some other advice though. Have ordered a Xantrex XPower 3000 modified sine wave inverter as a Vita Mix blender needs more power than the 1500 watt unit ETI offers. In a 21, what are the lengths of cable needed?
What gauge?
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Old 09-05-2014, 12:58 PM   #19
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Post #4 was correct at the time. ETI may well have changed things so it is always best to ask. And if they have please post the current info here.

Your questions about wire gauge and length are related. Shorter runs MAY allow smaller wires. It is best to put the inverter as close to the batteries as practical. I would check recent 21 build photos (and/or ETI) for locations. And the inverter installation manual for wire sizes.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:19 PM   #20
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Doug- will post ETI's response. Am still looking for input on cable length/size from any 21 owners who have installed their own inverters and connected to ETI-supplied Transfer Switch. It appears that battery/WFCO/Transfer switch are all in close proximity to each other.
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