2017 Ram Crew cab 5.7L 4x4 As a tow vehicle

[Chotch]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

Apparently this system is over 150 pounds lighter than a conventional fifth wheel plate system , better for me.

He did in fact say that the other option was to get a fifth wheel plate that was equal to the height of my bed walls which can be done with the Curt system as the height is 21 inches when used with a slide. However the weight is approximately 200 pounds for that system. And when that system is removed you still have the two rails.

Apparently the Andersen system weighs about 40 pounds and when removed as much cleaner for the bed.

I’m going for the Anderson hitch I’m comfortable with the weights.

When it’s all done and said maybe I’ll drive across some scales and report back.......

Again thanks everybody ....still open for your comments and concerns ....every day is a school day.!

Scotty2

I’m confused. Did Trademasters recommend the Anderson hitch? I use the Anderson Ultimate rail mounted set up in my F150 and I wouldn’t trade for a conventional 5th wheel hitch. It has many advantages, first being lightweight, very easy to remove and it doesn’t take up much space in the bed. But I don’t think that solves the clearance issue with those Ram boxes.

[Scotty2]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

You can always get a pull behind Escape Trailer.....I have had 2 Rams, they will pull a lot but carry little. Check you spare, it is probably a temporary which will need a full size for towing, both of mine were temp's.

Good call there....I had found myself in that situation with a friend pulling a large boat and trailer out of the Florida Keys. We ended up buying someone’s full-size spare and giving them our spare to get them back safely.

My spare on my Ram Rebel has a full size Good Year tire on an aluminum mag which may not be rated as well as my stock steal wheels with Toyo Open Country Tires.

[Scotty2]

Yes, I tried to post a correction as I inadvertently attached the wrong e- mail response ...

[Scotty2]

Originally Posted by Chotch

I’m confused. Did Trademasters recommend the Anderson hitch? I use the Anderson Ultimate rail mounted set up in my F150 and I wouldn’t trade for a conventional 5th wheel hitch. It has many advantages, first being lightweight, very easy to remove and it doesn’t take up much space in the bed. But I don’t think that solves the clearance issue with those Ram boxes.

The suggestion was for the Turnoverball. Then adding the Andersen Ultimate aluminum hitch. Which no doubt is a clean looking option. Then add chains & cord.
$2,820.00

“Brad” checked with the shop and they were good with RamBoxes, short or long beds.

However, in doing a little more homework I found it’s lighter to do the two rails in leu of the Turnover ball, and the using the steel Andersen 3200 model.

Yep.... then I’m stuck with those rails.

Also found the prices in BC to be almost $1K more then here in South Florida where we have slot of competitive pricing.

[Chotch]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

The suggestion was for the Turnoverball. Then adding the Andersen Ultimate aluminum hitch. Which no doubt is a clean looking option. Then add chains & cord.
$2,820.00

“Brad” checked with the shop and they were good with RamBoxes, short or long beds.

However, in doing a little more homework I found it’s lighter to do the two rails in leu of the Turnover ball, and the using the steel Andersen 3200 model.

Yep.... then I’m stuck with those rails.

Also found the prices in BC to be almost $1K more then here in South Florida where we have slot of competitive pricing.

The rail mount Ultimate set up is probably the lightest (and cheapest) way to go and I couldn’t be happier with mine. The rails have been a none issue for me. I still wonder about interface with those boxes please update us with the results.
🤔Was that quote Canadian or US dollars?

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

My spare on my Ram Rebel has a full size Good Year tire on an aluminum mag which may not be rated as well as my stock steal wheels with Toyo Open Country Tires.

It probably matters very little if the spare has the same load capacity as the other tires, as long as it has sufficient load capacity for the vehicle ratings (the rear gross axle weight rating would be the critical one). More importantly, the size and type of tire should match well for safe handling. Often the "full-size" spare is nearly the same diameter but dissimilar (in width or otherwise), which can be a limitation on loaded operation of the vehicle.

The wheel material doesn't matter; that can mismatch, as long as the dimensions (including offset) match. Trucks and motorhomes with dual rear wheels and alloy wheels routinely have steel wheels in the unseen inboard rear positions.

Spares were discussed in more detail in Towing and spare tires.

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

Good call there....I had found myself in that situation with a friend pulling a large boat and trailer out of the Florida Keys. We ended up buying someone’s full-size spare and giving them our spare to get them back safely.

My spare on my Ram Rebel has a full size Good Year tire on an aluminum mag which may not be rated as well as my stock steal wheels with Toyo Open Country Tires.

Hi: Scotty2... My tire situation is somewhat like yours. My Wrangler spare is mounted on a steel rim with 4 Toyo Open Country HT tires on the ground. It's a full size tire as I take a flashlight and look at it just to make sure it's still there. The one flat I had on the 5.0TA was caused by a drywall screw and a slow leak. I had to tow out to the dump stn. so filled the tire and had it plugged at the same time. 25 bucks and back where it came off of so I never have had to use a spare but it does add weight to the rear of the trailer to balance off the pin. It doesn't look to bad there either.
I do have a CAA/AAA RV Plus card just in case. Now if I could only get a card that worked on the spare around my waist I'll be all set!!! Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie

[Scotty2]

Bad news for me from “Andersen Hitches & Karl from Escape...

customerservice@anderseninc.com

Our system wouldn’t be compatible with this configuration. You would have bed rail clearance issues.

On May 6, 2020, at 9:24 PM, Squarespace <no-reply@squarespace.info> wrote:

Name: Scott DaSilva

Subject: 5th wheel set up for 2017 Ram Rebel 4X4 with 5’7” bed and Ramboxes!

Message: Greetings,

I’m in the process of purchasing a Canadian built a Escape fifth wheel Trailer. “Escape 5.0 TA”

This is a tandem axle trailer with a dry weight of 3800lbs. , a GVWR a 5500 lbs., and a pin weight of 630/900 lbs.

I have a 2017 dodge ram rebel crew cab with ram boxes and a 5’7” deep bed. I have 20 and three-quarter inches from the floor of the bed to the top of the side rails. The narrowest consistent with in the bed is 48 inches from floor to top rails.

The truck has a GVW of 6800 pounds and weighs in at 5461.
I’m guessing this leaves me a payload of 1339.

Do you offer a compatible towing solution?

Your reply reply is greatly appreciated.

My sincere thank you in advance!!!

Scott DaSilva
Deerfield beach Florida
(Sent via Andersen Hitches Help)

=============================


Hi Scott and Luann,

The ram boxes are going to be an issue. You will only get around 37 degrees turning angle before the pinbox will impact on the ram boxes. 37 degrees is not enough for enjoyable maneuvering.

We still have some time, so let us know what you would like to do.

Regards,
Karl

Karl Kenny
President
Escape Trailer

[Scotty2]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE3n_E2VKsU

This YouTube link shows a Ram 2500 pulling a large 5th Wheel with an Andersen hitch & 6ft bed.

[Chotch]

Sorry by this video is totally irrelevant. Completely different truck and trailer. For starters the 5th wheel is much larger and taller. The pin box looks like it goes over the truck box. If I where in your shoes and I really didn’t want to spring for a different truck, I’d look into getting a different bed without the boxes. You might even be able to find someone who would be willing to trade you. The bed can be changed out in a couple hours.

[Scotty2]

It wasn’t a relevant to me :-).

Didn’t know if we could swap out Pin box angle.

The bed widthis the same regardless of the fact that it’s a 6 foot bed.

I am in fact looking for a 5‘7“ bed as we speak yes should be a quick swap.

As I mentioned the Karl 8 foot beds and 6 foot beds are readily available for between eight and $1200 as take offs from new vehicles that had aftermarket utility beds have been installed

[Chotch]

Worked for GMC dealership years back. We always had at least a couple of beds sitting around for just that reason.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

The bed width is the same regardless of the fact that it’s a 6 foot bed.

Width does not depend on box length,and is probably even the same between the 1500 and the heavy-duty pickups, but the Rambox option makes the available width for clearance of the pinbox much narrower... so no, the bed widths are not the same between the Rambox and any non-Rambox. If the hitch is so high that the pin box is over the box sides that doesn't matter (that was the other option suggested by the Pulliam rep), but as already explained that is not likely practical with an Escape.

If the plan is to swap out the Rambox box for a standard box, that will address the pin box interference issue... but the video of the large trailer is still no more relevant than any random fifth-wheel and truck combination.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

Didn’t know if we could swap out Pin box angle.

You can change the lower section of the pin box, which isn't really an "angle" change. The shorter (horizontally) pin box could fix the Rambox interference issue (keeping the back end of the pin box from hitting the box sides in sharp turns), but the reach from trailer body to pin would be shorter and that could (depending on your hitch position) cause interference issues between the trailer and the back corners of the box or the tailgate when open - the hitch would need to be mounted further rearward than normal. The Lippert 1116 pin box is 5¾" shorter than the Lippert 1716 pin box (used by Escape) and fits the same "wings" (upper parts welded to the trailer frame); detailed dimensions are provided in Lippert's pin box quick reference document.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

I am in fact looking for a 5‘7“ bed as we speak yes should be a quick swap.

As I mentioned the Karl 8 foot beds and 6 foot beds are readily available for between eight and $1200 as take offs from new vehicles that had aftermarket utility beds have been installed

The longer boxes will likely be much easier to find, as it is unusual to put a service body that short on a truck. You might need to get a 5'7" box from a crashed and written-off truck with only cab damage.

[Scotty2]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

I’ve owned three Ram 1500 Quad Cabs with the 5.7 liter V8 (2011-2014-2019)
While they’ve all been good trucks , they would not be my first choice for towing an Escape 5.0 TA , My 2019 Ram has the best payload capacity of the three ( 1600 lbs) , but I decided the Escape 21 was the best match for my vehicle
Add up the loaded pin weight of an Escape 5.0 , the 5th wheel hitch weight , the weight of a driver and a passenger and your close to / over 1200 lbs of payload
Others have done it but I would not feel comfortable.

FYI We did have to change from the 5.0TA to the 21NE.
The only way around it was to change the pin box and that’s not allowed by ETI.
And like you said we were pushing weight limits to the extremes.
I hope to take possession of our trailer in a couple of weeks meeting delivery truck in Wisconsin. 👍

[steve dunham]

I hope you are pleased with your Escape 21 . The Fall is a great time to visit Wisconsin , warm days , cool nights and cold beer .

[steve dunham]

Originally Posted by Scotty2

FYI We did have to change from the 5.0TA to the 21NE.
The only way around it was to change the pin box and that’s not allowed by ETI.
And like you said we were pushing weight limits to the extremes.
I hope to take possession of our trailer in a couple of weeks meeting delivery truck in Wisconsin. ��

If you looked at the thread “ Trailer weights in the real world “ yesterday there is an interesting post . A member had his Escape 5.0 TA weighed and the pin weight was 920 LBS
I believe we all underestimate weights to fit our purpose so the post was a goodwake up call .We looked at buying an Escape 5.0 years back and abandoned the idea for several reasons ,the main one being , we did not wish to purchase a larger tow vehicle

[Chotch]

Originally Posted by steve dunham

If you looked at the thread “ Trailer weights in the real world “ yesterday there is an interesting post . A member had his Escape 5.0 TA weighed and the pin weight was 920 LBS
I believe we all underestimate weights to fit our purpose so the post was a goodwake up call .We looked at buying an Escape 5.0 years back and abandoned the idea for several reasons ,the main one being , we did not wish to purchase a larger tow vehicle

This is interesting, because looking at that chart there are weights ranging from 520 to 1036, the average is 737. I would really like to see how these trailers where loaded especially the 520 and the 1036. It would seem a drastic extreme. ETI advertises a hitch weight of 650 and that’s what I used when I went shopping for a truck. The 1660 payload on my F150 has thus far served me well. I have never weighed my rig but being that the truck rides perfectly level I can’t imagine I’m near the max payload.

[escape artist]

Originally Posted by Chotch

This is interesting, because looking at that chart there are weights ranging from 520 to 1036, the average is 737. I would really like to see how these trailers where loaded especially the 520 and the 1036. It would seem a drastic extreme. ETI advertises a hitch weight of 650 and that’s what I used when I went shopping for a truck. The 1660 payload on my F150 has thus far served me well. I have never weighed my rig but being that the truck rides perfectly level I can’t imagine I’m near the max payload.

Hi: Chotch... I weigh a lot more loaded too!!! Alf
escape artist N.S. of Lake Erie