Back of ball ratio and trailer stability - 21NE? - Page 2 - Escape Trailer Owners Community
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Old 05-07-2021, 02:54 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amel View Post
The reason I sent the 2 measurements is because the torsion axles and the center of the wheels are not at the same place. So I gave both to let you choose which one you needed. (See picture)
Sure, but the location of the square steel tube that you're calling the "torsion axles" doesn't matter - use the centre of the wheels.
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Old 05-07-2021, 03:13 PM   #22
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Didn't say it was a "great measure by itself".................but think about your statement a bit. Both of those metrics are interdependent.

Care to explain how you can have a "normal" (say 12.5%) tongue weight with a very low BOB% and stay below any realistic GVW limits? Leverage always wins..............
The tongue weight fraction considers only the average location of the trailer's mass as the fraction of the axle to coupler distance. 12.5% tongue weight means that the horizontal distance from the axle centre to the centre of mass is 12.5% of the distance from axle centre to the ball in the coupler. The trailer could have everything heavy concentrated in the middle, or all out at the ends; the stability will be very different. It could have no overhang beyond the wheels and very little body ahead of the wheels, or it could be the length of a football field; the aerodynamics will be different and the long one will likely have the mass further from the middle (but might not). The body could be very long at the rear but mostly empty, or it could be short. Stability could be anything from dangerously low to excellent.

The ratio being discussed appears to be the ball-to-axle over the overall length (ball to bumper). This measure only considers the outside of the box, not what's in it. A low ratio (ball to axle less than 60% of overall length) indicates that the axle is close to the middle, but it says nothing about where the contents of the box are. If the heavy contents are rearward the tongue weight will be low; if they are forward the tongue weight will be high. In designing a trailer it's easy to put nothing in the back but a bed, with a kitchen and appliances and battery and propane all in the middle to front, and have a desirable 10% to 15% tongue weight with the axle right in the middle of the body; the only stability problem would be that side winds will tend to push the trailer's rear downwind, and so the front of the trailer and back of the tug upwind, turning the tug out of the wind and likely encouraging sway. Of course Escape doesn't do that; appliances are reasonably close to the middle, the axle location is well rearward of the trailer body middle in current models (not so much in the discontinued 15'), and there are no front-kitchen (or rear-kitchen) models.

What GVWR is the concern? The tongue weight fraction is relevant to the tug's capacities; the length ratio isn't very relevant to weight, but if cargo is used as ballast to fix problems then of course there is a limit to how much cargo can be carried.
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Old 05-07-2021, 04:23 PM   #23
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As I stated, they are interdependent.


Believe I tried to close out this discussion a few posts above..........


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Old 05-07-2021, 04:51 PM   #24
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On the 2010 19 I loaded it for 12.5 % tongue weight on 3640 tow weight ready for an outing. My tongue weight was about 440. On the 2013 21 the tongue weight is 500lbs on 4380 tow weight. In both cases I tow dead level with no problems. The dual six volt batteries in the front box of the 19 gave me plenty of weight on the tongue. Reace was an extremely competent designer in my opinion and unless the trailer was unreasonably loaded, it towed like a dream, no sway, no porpoising and no off center pull. In both cases I could and can take my hands off the wheel at 60 mph and there is no drift. Side to side balance is important too.
YMMV
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Old 05-07-2021, 05:03 PM   #25
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On the 2010 19 I loaded it for 12.5 % tongue weight on 3640 tow weight ready for an outing. My tongue weight was about 440. On the 2013 21 the tongue weight is 500lbs on 4380 tow weight. In both cases I tow dead level with no problems. The dual six volt batteries in the front box of the 19 gave me plenty of weight on the tongue. Reace was an extremely competent designer in my opinion and unless the trailer was unreasonably loaded, it towed like a dream, no sway, no porpoising and no off center pull. In both cases I could and can take my hands off the wheel at 60 mph and there is no drift. Side to side balance is important too.
YMMV
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Good to hear!


Thanks.
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Old 05-07-2021, 06:02 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by 7Gentex View Post
Believe I tried to close out this discussion a few posts above..........

I guess, "Bobs your uncle".
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Old 05-07-2021, 06:34 PM   #27
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On posting I do not always read what’s already been posted and sometimes I post something that someone else has posted first. Other times I’m the first poster and answer the question proffered. Then the post goes on for a while with multiple opinions and repeated “same answers”. Sometimes the original poster makes a statement that he’s good with the answer and needs no further info. It’s all good and good with me. I always figure if you don’t want to hear information or an opinion, don’t read it. I do not read anything about 5th wheel hitches, Television, Movies or several other subjects because they don’t interest me or I just “don’t need to know.
Easy does it and have a good camping season. We just got back from 6 nights of camping. It rained one night. The sound of that rain on the top of the Escape, falling like so many ping pong balls is a favorite of mine after many nights in a leaky tent. Others may find it a nuisance. When I hear the furnace click on and the heat starts. I remember cold nights in a thin cotton bag and I close my eyes and sleep.
Have a great season, get mellow. Eat well.
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Old 05-08-2021, 06:59 AM   #28
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Well said, Dave, the Iowan prophet.......
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Old 05-12-2021, 10:08 AM   #29
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Here is some info on the 19' maybe someone with a 21 NE could request this from ETI
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19' axle measurements.jpg  
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