Getting worried. The new 5TA is 1100 pounds heavier. Ok with Tacoma??

[alanmalk]

Less than a week to go until the new 2015 production schedule comes out and I'm getting nervous. The new 5TA has put on 1100 pounds, up from 4400 to 5500 in its new format. My tow vehicle, when it arrives, is going to be a Tacoma, V6, manual transmission, off-road suspension and 73" bed (medium size). I ordered the truck before the new specs were announced and a bigger vehicle is not an option. Total payload on the Tacoma is listed around 1450 pounds. Adding up two passengers and a full tank of gas to be around 450 pounds then adding the theoretical king pin weight of around 900 pounds, for a total of 1350 - doesn't leave much room for error.

Would anyone on the forum have experience with a mid-size truck and a 5500 pound fifth-wheel trailer? Or just opinions - from "you're crazy" to "no problem"?

Thanks,
Alan

[Donna D.]

I think you're waaay high considering from this post down: http://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f2...html#post52897

"Reace mentioned that he weighed the first 5.0 off the line at around 3700 lbs fully optioned out making the pre-camping weight anywhere from 3350 to 3700 lbs."

[alanmalk]

I should have said the GVWR went from 4400 to 5500.

Quoting from Tammy's email:
"4. The GVWR is 5500lbs. With 900lbs on the hitch and 4600lbs on the axle. The dry weight is 3,300lbs."

[Donna D.]

Well, I'm reading this from Reace, it's John's 5er: http://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f2...html#post51258

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

I think you're waaay high...

Not really - just using the wrong values, perhaps.

Originally Posted by alanmalk

The new 5TA has put on 1100 pounds, up from 4400 to 5500 in its new format.

Those are the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) numbers for the old and new 5.0. That's how much the trailer is allowed to weigh with all your stuff in it, not necessarily what it will weigh when you tow it.

Using the quoted 3350 to 3700 pound weight for the dry (but equipped) trailer, you add a water heater full of water (50 pounds), a couple tanks of propane (76 pounds, for two 20-pound tanks when full)... and you decide how much more in water and in your stuff.

We have used our current trailer at about 600 pounds heavier than the dry as-equipped weight. A realistic loaded weight for a 5.0 TA would then be at least 3600 pounds, but as much as 4200 pounds or more, depending on your equipment, water, and cargo.

Yes, the base weight of a 5.0 TA is hundreds of pounds more than the original 5.0. Only two original 5.0's arrived at trailer meets and were weighed (as reported in the often-quoted FiberglassRV thread Trailer Weights in the Real World):

ITEM_LENGTH_MAKE_____MODEL______AXLE__TONGUE_ __TOTAL
97___19_____Escape_____5.0__________2860_____780__ __3640
104__19_____Escape_____5.0__________3220_____680__ __3900

So these people (who are likely both members here) had 1000 to 1300 pounds of options, water, propane, and their stuff in the trailer... and both were still well under their trailers' 4400 pound GVWR. Add 1300 pounds to the 5.0 TA's base dry weight of 3350 pounds, and you get 4650 pounds... again far short of 5500 pounds.

The extra axle on the 5.0 TA makes it easy to add a bunch of weight-carrying capacity, which can make it look like the trailer is heavier than it is if you are not clear on the meaning of GVWR.

[alanmalk]

I don't dispute the numbers. Ours will be equipped very similarly, I suspect. Now add a full tank of water ( some of our favorite places have no drinking water ) and the usual camping necessities, and the "it-would-be-nice-to-have goodies ( canoe, screen tent, camp chairs, endless list...). (I have a bad case of "take-it-all-itis.) I'm willing to bet I can reach very close to the max GVWR if left to my own devices. Then we have to drive west from Denver up and over any number of passes at 10,000 or higher depending on the destination. My thinking is to anticipate a worst case scenario and rejoice when it doesn't happen. Or - force myself to "downsize" to the 19 and not worry.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

I should have said the GVWR went from 4400 to 5500.

Quoting from Tammy's email:
"4. The GVWR is 5500lbs. With 900lbs on the hitch and 4600lbs on the axle. The dry weight is 3,300lbs."

It appears that it takes me about 24 minutes to assemble an explanation of what may have already been understood...

That dry weight from Tammy is dry (no water or propane) and base equipment (no options), as well as of course empty (none of your stuff).

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

Ours will be equipped very similarly, I suspect. Now add a full tank of water ( some of our favorite places have no drinking water ) and the usual camping necessities, and the "it-would-be-nice-to-have goodies ( canoe, screen tent, camp chairs, endless list...). (I have a bad case of "take-it-all-itis.) I'm willing to bet I can reach very close to the max GVWR if left to my own devices...
My thinking is to anticipate a worst case scenario and rejoice when it doesn't happen. Or - force myself to "downsize" to the 19 and not worry.

Valid reasoning... but remember there's nothing in the trailer that stops you from overloading it, so if you really pack in the cast iron cookware, that 19' could weigh over 5000 pounds, too!

[alanmalk]

Well, being (somewhat) realistic, I'm optimistic I can keep the total under (but close to) 5000.
No cast iron! But there is a big stack of cut hardwood firewood in my back yard begging for a camping trip to show its stuff. Susannah will hold me back...

But the original question remains - how will the Tacoma behave with 5000 pounds on its tail?

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

But the original question remains - how will the Tacoma behave with 5000 pounds on its tail?

I can't answer THAT. But, don't carry water for miles EVER. That's not only the dirty stuff, but fresh water as well. At more than 8 lbs per gallon, why would you ever want to pay the MPG on your tug? Fill up your fresh water tank(s) close to destination and empty the dirty water absolutely, positively as soon as you can. Even if that means a tote and you dump at your site (flushies, pit toilets).

I live in an area with the BEST fresh water in the nation... I still won't haul it just to camp. YMMV.

I hope you get this figured out to your comfort and satisfaction...

[Donna D.]

Brian, I'm not confusing anything. Nothing will change the dry weight of the trailer. The one thing we can all change is how we pack. Water, cast iron, wood for fires, heavy lounge chairs, etc., etc., etc., all add to the final weight for the tug. AND, then there is where you tow... the flats or over the Rocky Mts...

[alanmalk]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

At more than 8 lbs per gallon, why would you ever want to pay the MPG on your tug?

Not willingly, of course.

Some of our favorite camping locations - NM, West Texas, etc - have some of the worst water in the country. Try Roswell, NM for example. You can watch the flakes of gypsum salts settle to the bottom of every glass of tap water. I really do have to haul the good stuff all the way from home on many occasions.

(In the "old days", we used to dry camp and had to backpack 5 gallons for 3 miles uphill. Apparently the trails never went downhill, in the old days.)

And yes, I have hauled buckets of grey water to the privy and understand the need to keep the grey/black tanks empty if at all possible. But the advice - direct from ETI - says with the fresh water tank it's all or nothing. A half-full tank sloshes too much.

I'm sure someone with a V6 - past or present - will be able to help.

[jamie beers]

Total payload on the Tacoma is listed around 1450 pounds. Adding up two passengers and a full tank of gas to be around 450 pounds

Sorry, this isn't totally germane to the main point of this thread.

No need to include the weight of a tank of gas in the payload calculations. GVWR is curb weight plus payload, curb weight includes full tank of fuel.

Thus, already saving yourself a few lbs. in your calculations.......

[alanmalk]

Thank you Jamie, you just saved me enough weight to compensate for a couple of trail bicycles.
(See, no limit to my want-it-all.... On the other hand, Susannah would be happy with a 15 and a couple of pairs of clean socks for a week. We'll have to compromise. )

[JaneM.]

Originally Posted by alanmalk

But the advice - direct from ETI - says with the fresh water tank it's all or nothing. A half-full tank sloshes too much.

I hadn't heard this - I can guess, but what is their concern?

[Donna D.]

It's not just ETI, all brands of all molded towables will tell you a partial tank of water sloshes (okay, OLIVER is adding battles). If water sloshes, you end up with different axles weights as you go down the road. BUT these fresh water tanks aren't huge. Like some MOHOs and 5th wheels. It MAY not be a big concern for YOU.

[WestEnder]

Firewood is another thing to get at your destination. Stop those undesirable invasive species from hitching a ride to a new home. Some places it's even illegal to bring wood from out of the area.

[padlin]

I have no experience with the Tacoma but I do believe it is a tad small for the 5.0TA. Subtract out the 120 lb tank of gas, you are still getting close to the max payload, especially when you add in all your planned extras.

1450 payload
-330 passengers
-900 projected loaded pin weight
-100 Hitch weight

Will it pull the trailer, yes. Will it handle the payload, not the way you want to be able to use it. Will you like the ride, maybe, maybe not.

The 21 or used 5.0 may fit your needs/wants better then the TA.

[Chapitre]

Bob,
what do you plan to tow your TA with?

[padlin]

F150 Ecoboost, 2200 lbs payload