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Old 10-05-2020, 02:59 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpaharley2008 View Post
Brian,
A custom trailer manufacturer should know which truck can handle their product, at least more so than the truck manufacturer knowing what trailer their product can handle! That is the point being made.....
Not really. Unless they have experience with that specific truck, there's no expertise in a trailer manufacturer on which to base this. Auto manufacturers extensively test their vehicles with trailers (but only of course a small selection of sample trailers); most trailer manufacturer's testing consists of taking a unit for a drive with whatever truck they own and saying "yeah, that feels okay".
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Old 10-05-2020, 03:01 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Donna D. View Post
And it's entirely possible that ETI has sold a 5.0TA to an owner of a GMC Canyon with a 5’2” bed and that we wouldn't know about it.
Yes, it's certainly worth asking them. If they don't know of an example, I wouldn't expect them to have any other useful input.
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Old 10-05-2020, 03:59 PM   #23
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Have TradeMasters do the work if you can. They are great.


They know what they are doing.
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Old 10-05-2020, 04:07 PM   #24
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I would love to but the borders are closed. I’m looking for someone in my
Area that is just as good
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Old 10-05-2020, 06:32 PM   #25
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This question came up in another thread, and this was my answer based on our 5'0" Ranger bed. With an extra 2" you would have a little bit better turning angle, but not much.
I could also move the kingpin position a little further back if I got a tailgate with a cutout that would allow the hitch to move freely above it, but that would put the kingpin further behind the axle. I'm surprised that the Ranger has more payload than some full size trucks, (1,732 lbs on mine)
That auto-sliding hitch sounds like it would do the trick if they confirm it will work on your Colorado/Canyon.

"Theoretically, using Escapes' 5th wheel guidelines, the Ranger 5 ft bed "could" tow the 5.0 TA. My bed height is 55.5 and they say no higher than 56" with the standard axle. That would be too close for me, so I would opt for the high lift axle for the extra clearance. I would not feel comfortable with the pin any closer than 32" to the tailgate, and that distance would also give me more than the necessary clearance on the corners at 51 3/4" . Unfortunately, a pin mounted 32" from the tailgate only provides 28" from the front of the bed, so add another inch to the cab and Escape says I can only be safe making a 53 degree turn without crunching the cab (may be a little more in practice).
A 6' bed would theoretically allow a 90 degree turn."
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Old 10-05-2020, 06:56 PM   #26
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Have you weighed your truck to see what the real does really does weight
Factory legal payload maximum is listed on the door sticker along with J2807 compliant rating allowing for a weight of 300 lbs. for driver and all passenger in the truck ....``` I have a Ram Eco diesel and has 1390 lbs. payload listed minus wife and me weighting at 400 lbs. leaves us about 100 lbs. short J2807 allowance of the factory sticker listed MAX weights . Now real carrying capacity and with my Anderson rail kit with all mounting hardware leaves me about a another 100 lbs. short in payload bring the truck to 1190 lbs. Real payload . Loading all my crap in the bed plus fuel and trailer pin weight and were just legal by 10 lbs.
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Old 10-05-2020, 08:15 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oreo View Post
Factory legal payload listed on the door sticker is J2807 compliant allowing weight for 300 lbs. for driver and all passenger in the truck .... I have a Ram Eco diesel and has 1390 lbs. payload listed minus wife and me weighting at 400 lbs. leaves us about 100 lbs. minus J2807 allowance compared to the the factory sticker listed weight . Now at 1290 lbs. real carrying capacity and with my Anderson rail kit with all mounting hardware leaves me about a another 100 lbs. short in payload bring the truck to 1190 lbs. Real payload . Loading all my crap in the bed plus fuel trailer pin weight and were just legal by 10 lbs.
I'm sure I don't understand the shenanigans involving "minus J2807 allowance" in your calculating

I'd love to see a pic of your Ram door sticker. Does it make reference to "J2087 allowance" or just have a simple statement of load capacity as on my F150 (pic attached), with a simple and explicit explanation in the Owners Manual referenced on that sticker (also attached)?
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F150 LOAD STICKER.jpg   PAYLOAD from F150 Owner Manual.png  
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Old 10-05-2020, 09:50 PM   #28
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2021 GMC Canyon Elevation Crew Cab Long Box V6 gas

For those who might be interested for their research

Here’s the label from a 2021 GMC Canyon Crew Cab Long Box V6 gas Elevation trim that I test drove last week.
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4C82E12C-B54B-4074-8169-9301AB1826D4.jpeg   B7CF59FB-3D01-4F74-9A49-7C053C5CF1AC.jpeg  
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Old 10-05-2020, 10:01 PM   #29
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Ram web page
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Old 10-05-2020, 10:13 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camp4528 View Post
For those who might be interested for their research

Here’s the label from a 2021 GMC Canyon Crew Cab Long Box V6 gas Elevation trim that I test drove last week.
Looks clear enuf, thanks for sharing.

BTW, as far as 'actual weight' ... shortly after purchase of my '05 F150, before any aftermarket add-ons, I weighed it with a full tank of gas. It was 5386#. For that vehicle:

[door sticker GVWR (7050#)] - [door sticker 'payload' (1729#] = 5321# 'sticker-derived curb weight'

I figured that close enuf to 'trust' the VIN-specific door sticker data. YMMV.
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Old 10-06-2020, 08:34 AM   #31
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Thanks Centex.

There are a lot of factors at play and for completeness, I neglected to mention that the label in my post is for the 4x4 Canyon.
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Old 10-06-2020, 08:49 AM   #32
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If you ask GM anything, they will tell you it will launch into outer space if they think they can sell you something. Don't listen to your local RV dealer either. My local RV dealer had a Airstream behind a Jetta. Contact Escape.

I do recall a 5.0TA behind a Colorado Diesel here on the forum, they commented they were very happy with it.
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Old 10-06-2020, 09:03 AM   #33
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My only advice is “RTOM “ for your particular vehicle .
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Old 10-06-2020, 09:21 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by steve dunham View Post
My only advice is “RTOM “ for your particular vehicle .


Just FYI re: the J2087 thing .... J20187 bears on standardized determination of GCWR and max trailer weight ratings. While certain assumptions are made about occupants and cargo for the purposes of that standard, none of that bears on determining compliance with the 'payload rating' of a vehicle.

You won't find anything about "minus J2807 allowance" in any Owners Manual payload determination guidance, including, for example, the Owners Manual for a 2020 Ram 1500:
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Excerpt from 2020 Ram 1500DT Owners Manual.png  
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Old 10-06-2020, 09:22 AM   #35
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For comparison, here's the 1,732 payload sticker for our 2019 Ford Ranger Supercrew XLT, 2WD, electronic locking rear axle, tow package. We don't have too many options.
I suspect 4WD and more options would lower that payload rating. Our GVWR is 6,050 lb (2,744KG)
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Old 10-06-2020, 09:31 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Radar1 View Post
For comparison, here's the 1,732 payload sticker for our 2019 Ford Ranger Supercrew XLT, 2WD, electronic locking rear axle, tow package. We don't have too many options.
I suspect 4WD and more options would lower that payload rating. Our GVWR is 6,050 lb (2,744KG)
Yep, those mandated (USA and Canada) stickers are VIN-specific (thus the VIN always included on the sticker, cropped-out in the pic above but visible on the examples posted previous).

To the extent that OE (factory installed) options affect the allowable payload, that's reflected in the number on the VIN-specific sticker found on any given vehicle.
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Old 10-06-2020, 07:28 PM   #37
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RV-Project.Com SAE J2807 Tow Ratings.
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Old 10-06-2020, 07:30 PM   #38
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SAE J2807 uses a specific set of assumptions to calculate maximum trailer weight ratings: Vehicles with a GVWR of less than 8,500lbs factor in a 150lb driver and 150lb passenger in their tow ratings. Vehicles over 8,500lbs GVWR add an extra 100lbs for cargo. When considering a J2807-based tow rating for your vehicle, you need to subtract additional weight for heavier or additional passengers or cargo load from the maximum tow rating.
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Old 10-06-2020, 07:37 PM   #39
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The way I read this in the GVWR there is a 150 lbs. allowance for passenger and driver in this calculation , total weight 300 lbs.not listed in the door sticker
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Old 10-06-2020, 07:43 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oreo View Post
SAE J2807 uses a specific set of assumptions to calculate maximum trailer weight ratings: Vehicles with a GVWR of less than 8,500lbs factor in a 150lb driver and 150lb passenger in their tow ratings. Vehicles over 8,500lbs GVWR add an extra 100lbs for cargo. When considering a J2807-based tow rating for your vehicle, you need to subtract additional weight for heavier or additional passengers or cargo load from the maximum tow rating.
But none of that bears on payload rating / compliance as suggested by your post #26.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oreo View Post
The way I read this in the GVWR there is a 150 lbs. allowance for passenger and driver in this calculation , total weight 300 lbs.not listed in the door sticker
We'll just have to agree to disagree on that.

Carry on, flogged this enough!
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