Karl with EV Ford Truck

[ghosthunter]

https://youtu.be/63AT_cy2icE


Interesting.

[Ron in BC]

Very interesting but, as Karl pointed out, pretty much a non-starter for trailer towing.

I put it in perspective by imagining that I was using one on one of our regular trips. It would crap out or just make it to our regular lunch stop. Then it'd be a really, really long lunch stop.

Ron

[KarenPDX]

This is my hope for a future vehicle. We just need Truck stops to put in some electric charging stations and batteries to get up to 500 miles on a charge and I think this could be a true tow vehicle. I don’t anticipate people being too anxious if they need to charge every 100-150 miles and unhitch the trailer first.

[Iowa Dave]

How about a great big V-8 Honda generator and 40 gallons of gasoline in the truck bed. Charge as you go. Oh, that might be counter productive,huh? Ok then,
tandem towing with a great big solar panel on a trailer behind the travel trailer. Yeah, that’s the ticket. Then thieves could steal two trailers at once.
Iowa Dave

[WillyB]

New technology takes some time to align itself to real world applications. Sooooooo..........I'm sure things will improve over time.

A friend mentioned battery change out stations to overcome the 10 hour recharge time. Interesting idea to work out.

[JeffreyG]

I work for an electric car OEM. I'm very enthusiastic about electric vehicles.

I will tell you that a sometime RV tow vehicle is one of the more difficult applications for an EV. The problem comes down to use cases.

Couple examples:
1) Imagine a couple that owns two cars. One can be a dedicated commuter. This vehicle can be built with a relatively small battery and is cost competitive because it is cheap to fuel.
2) Imagine a heavy use vehicle like a semi truck. This vehicle needs a huge battery and is very expensive, but because the usage is consistent and heavy, it too can justify the cost in fuel savings.

Now think about a pickup truck, used for commuting 90%+ of the time and then used for towing over long distance occasionally. The occasional use case demands a huge battery which is expensive and heavy. But this is grossly oversized for the 90% day-to-day use case. So the vehicle is way too heavy and expensive for normal use.

Similar, a retired RV-ing couple. They don't even have the commuting use case, but they still need that huge battery for their long travel days. So now they have a huge, expensive battery that mostly sits around unused when they are camped at a single location.

Either way, it's hard to design an EV that can do huge work, infrequently.


There have been a lot of proposed alternate approaches.


Iowa Dave talked about a generator in the truck bed fueling the vehicle. This would not be practical, but it is essentially the same concept as a hybrid electric. The problem here is cost. If the vehicle is primarily electric you have the cost of the battery and motor, PLUS the cost of an engine and generator. It adds up to an un-economical solution set.


Another one I've heard of is the idea of EVs with batteries that can be swapped. So you just drive a while, pull in, and swap out your battery with a newly charged one. Problems:
1) This means you need 2-3 batteries in existence for every vehicle. That's not economically viable.
2) Batteries are valuable and can wear out. Who's going to give up their battery for an unknown one? People don't even like propane cylinder exchanges, and those cost relatively nothing.

[SteveSgt]

Originally Posted by JeffreyG

I work for an electric car OEM.

I have "a handful of" longtime friends who work for two of the brands that have major sites in the S.F.Bay area. Some of them think that the solution to the RV problem will be that the trailer carries significant extra battery capacity. This is exactly what's shown in Airstream's electric trailer concept.

What do you think of that solution?

[JeffreyG]

Originally Posted by SteveSgt

I have "a handful of" longtime friends who work for two of the brands that have major sites in the S.F.Bay area. Some of them think that the solution to the RV problem will be that the trailer carries significant extra battery capacity. This is exactly what's shown in Airstream's electric trailer concept.

What do you think of that solution?

Still a cost challenge, in that you have a very expensive battery sitting in the RV doing nothing most of the time. I mean, good news is this RV will be killer for boondocking.

Also good news, the EV itself will not be lugging around the weight of that huge battery when it isn't needed.

Maybe this is the most practical of the impractical solutions. For now.

[splitting_lanes]

Eleven years ago I picked up my electric car from the dealer and used it to commute 60 miles each way to work and back — needing to charge at work to make it back home at the end of the day. I build a box that I could use to ‘combine’ two 120v circuits and get a 240 circuit from so I could level 2 charge wherever.

Now, all kinds of electric cars are on the road with 200-300 mile ranges, and there’s level 2, CCS, Tesla, and CHademo chargers in many more places. I expect another decade and we’ll see some pretty viable electric RV solutions, give or take.

11 years ago there was a guy ( who now runs a leaf battery replacement shop ) who built a jet turbine charger that could fast charge his leaf while driving. Not saying it was a great solution, but… it was a solution that was towable with a leaf.

I’m excited to see what electric RVs come out. I think the towable storage or storage plus generation is feasible. Did Jeffery G switch from a diesel truck mfg to an electric truck or car mfg, or are you at the same company and it switched. Always enjoy your insight.

[Donny A]

The Lightning is a great vehicle for the contractor that does business in a city. It can power the job site and then get charged up at home over night. I don't see it to be any good for towing to a remote location. Where would one charge it after getting to some BLM site in the middle of nowhere?

[MarkinVan]

Check out the E-Stream Concept.

https://www.airstream.com/blog/the-a...ource=hs_email

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by ghosthunter

https://youtu.be/63AT_cy2icE


Interesting.

another perspective on the Lighting Ev truck

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8gH52gKejE

'Hoovie', a youtuber who's a car nerd, had already panned it for towing in a previous video, this time he discovers it can only go like 65 miles in cold weather before you get down to critically low. 2nd half of the video, he's off drooling on a Hummer EV demo car he was loaned, he has the attention of a labrador retriever in a squirrel forest.

if you're not familiar with Hoovie, he's got a long track record of doing dumb stuff, like buying cheap supercars then being shocked at how expensive restoring/repairing them is.

[emers382]

Originally Posted by splitting_lanes

Now, all kinds of electric cars are on the road with 200-300 mile ranges, and there’s level 2, CCS, Tesla, and CHademo chargers in many more places. I expect another decade and we’ll see some pretty viable electric RV solutions, give or take.

If there are so many TVs with this ability I do not understand why they put in six Tesla and two "other" chargers in a grocery store parking lot only 50km south of Winnipeg on the main highway to the border. It's about 130 miles from Grand Forks ND to Winnipeg, but now you could stop before reaching Winnipeg.

I shopped at that store a few days ago about 36 hours after a light snowfall and it was obvious nobody had used a charger there as the snow was undisturbed. Of course with temperatures overnight around -30C I wouldn't be driving an EV that route.

[splitting_lanes]

Originally Posted by emers382

If there are so many TVs with this ability I do not understand why they put in six Tesla and two "other" chargers in a grocery store parking lot only 50km south of Winnipeg on the main highway to the border. It's about 130 miles from Grand Forks ND to Winnipeg, but now you could stop before reaching Winnipeg.

Hi Adrian! Yeah, I’m a little bothered by how many Tesla charge spots there are compared to the open standard ( all the others ) spots in many places here in the Bay Area. Tesla did open source their connector, finally, but I don’t trust them at this point.

[ghosthunter]

In the US another issue is they cannot keep the charge stations they have in good working order. They put them in a location where there is no maintenance support for them and no way to get help when it stops working.

1/4 of the charge stations are not working at any given time.

[MarkinVan]

Seems if one had an EV as your TV, you'd be staying at RV sites with hookups and charging would be ok that way.

[Eggscape]

We have friends with a Tesla and they can’t make it through the mountains to our house in Kelowna from Vancouver without stopping to charge. A few times the only location with a few chargers has been full and a 2 hour delay for them. That is not towing and the chargers are not set up to allow you to charge if you were towing. When they get to Kelowna they have to spend another hour or so charging before they get to us so they have power to leave for home.

Personally I think we will look back and realize the last five years was prime for electric vehicles as there were enough chargers around to make it work. I can’t imagine the lines at the charging station if even 10% of the vehicles driving between Vancouver and Kelowna were electric.

I also have no idea what they have in mind for charging the billions of cars in cities that only have street parking.

I think if a person wanted to make a successful business they would bring back the 400 lb trailer pictured below. It was ahead of its time…but now with smaller cars and electric vehicles they would sell for sure.

Here are some details:
“1989 Teardrop American Outbacker. This gull wing teardrop features a molded shell of polypropylene that eliminates leaks, rot and rust. Overall length is 9 feet 4 inches, width 7 ft 6 in, height 5 ft 6 in. The pod can be easily removed from the trailer with three fasteners. The weight of the pod is 225 lb the total weight the whole assembly is 400 lbs. Easily towed by large motorcycles and small cars.”

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by Eggscape

Here are some details:
“1989 Teardrop American Outbacker. This gull wing teardrop features a molded shell of polypropylene that eliminates leaks, rot and rust. Overall length is 9 feet 4 inches, width 7 ft 6 in, height 5 ft 6 in. The pod can be easily removed from the trailer with three fasteners. The weight of the pod is 225 lb the total weight the whole assembly is 400 lbs. Easily towed by large motorcycles and small cars.”

There are nine members on FiberglassRV with an American Outback

[JeffreyG]

Originally Posted by splitting_lanes

I’m excited to see what electric RVs come out. I think the towable storage or storage plus generation is feasible. Did Jeffery G switch from a diesel truck mfg to an electric truck or car mfg, or are you at the same company and it switched. Always enjoy your insight.

I changed jobs. Did diesel engine development for a couple decades and then decided to try something new, so now I'm developing electric drive units.

[John in Santa Cruz]

Originally Posted by MarkinVan

Seems if one had an EV as your TV, you'd be staying at RV sites with hookups and charging would be ok that way.

I usually travel 200-300 miles per day, sometimes 500-700 if I'm crossing several western states to a destination such as southern Utah.