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Old 10-14-2016, 11:28 AM   #1
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New tow for 19

We are in the market for a new car for my wife, with plans to buy a 19 next year. This will be her daily driver around town with our baby and she wants something that isn't huge and trucky in the city. We are going to be test driving over the next month or two and shopping year end deals. I am looking for input on towing, especially over the passes here in WA. Currently the top 3 are the highlander, pilot and sorento. We are also looking at lightly used MDX and ML350 diesel. Has anyone towed with more than one of these to be able to compare? I worry about the tongue rating on the sorento, because it isn't clear if it is 350 or 500 lbs but I like the size. Is the mdx worth the upgrade over the pilot? I worry about the ML350 electronics and how it will hold up with lots of short trips, but it seems like it would tow the best.
I have driven a grand cherokee and an explorer and did not like either. The new traverse could be a consideration as well, but I trust toytoa/honda quality more than gm. We don't want to go to a bigger truck based vehicle, I would rather pack light on trips than have to deal with one of those day to day.
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Old 10-14-2016, 11:52 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor231 View Post
We are in the market for a new car for my wife, with plans to buy a 19 next year. This will be her daily driver around town with our baby and she wants something that isn't huge and trucky in the city. We are going to be test driving over the next month or two and shopping year end deals. I am looking for input on towing, especially over the passes here in WA. Currently the top 3 are the highlander, pilot and sorento. We are also looking at lightly used MDX and ML350 diesel. Has anyone towed with more than one of these to be able to compare? I worry about the tongue rating on the sorento, because it isn't clear if it is 350 or 500 lbs but I like the size. Is the mdx worth the upgrade over the pilot? I worry about the ML350 electronics and how it will hold up with lots of short trips, but it seems like it would tow the best.
I have driven a grand cherokee and an explorer and did not like either. The new traverse could be a consideration as well, but I trust toytoa/honda quality more than gm. We don't want to go to a bigger truck based vehicle, I would rather pack light on trips than have to deal with one of those day to day.
We towed our 17' Casita deluxe with our 2011 MDX and it was a fantastic tug for us.

and a wonderful daily driver. Drives way better than a midsized SUV should.

our trusted mechanic highly recommended it, for reliability and comfort and performance.

I think it is a lot nicer than a Pilot.

we'll tow our forthcoming 2017 (with the fancy WDH from ETI) and we'll know how it does.... and I'll report back.

we travel light, i bought a tongue scale for making sure tongue weight is correct.... and quite a few people here have towed a 21' with somewhat similar HP + torque + capacity SUVs and reported back that it is fine.

and

New (or used) cars lowest price. New Car Lowest Price - I highly recommend them.

Keep in mind that he only negotiates the deal… you are actually buying the car * from a dealer*

NewCarsLowestPrice.com-Buy Car/Lease Car/Auto Quotes

His name is David and he is fantastic. Total pro. We have used him a couple times, and pals have used him many times. Everyone is always VERY happy. Saves you $$$$ and no hassle. He does car sales plus leases. Handles trade ins, if need be.

$159 flat fee.
He also brokers / researches loans with no markup. $59 fee.
Highly recommended!!!! Car dealers suck.

Oh yeah he does new, , trade ins, purchase, lease, whatever. I believe he does used as well.

He will save you $$$. Guaranteed.
Just call him.
Trust me.

The usual lowest rate that AAA, costco or the dealers will offer is $500 above "dealer invoice" for a new car.
However there are always internal kickbacks and bonuses that are hidden in the car dealer system. (Just read consumer reports magazine for this info)

David was able to get us $750 LESS THAN dealer invoice on our new SUV. He admits that was an exceptionally good deal but it gives some indication.

He deals directly with the dealers, and then the winning dealership actually brings the car to your door. If you want you can take it for a test drive (I recommend this) then you sign the paperwork. Takes about an hour. No stupid pressure for overpriced add ons... Mats... Underbody sprays you don't need... Etc.

So it is the dealer that brings you your car.

Plus David deals with loans, but without markup. The dealers ALWAYS mark up the loans, in a hidden way. Again - it is the actual bank that does the loan for us, not david. He just finds the best deal.

The paperwork all happens at delivery at your home.... Including any loan paperwork.
Super easy.

:-)

His fee also includes unlimited phone consultation. He is a car guru and can advise you on different makes and models.
:-)

No, I do not benefit if you hire him.

John
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Old 10-14-2016, 12:32 PM   #3
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Suggest you google "invoice prices" or read this CBC story.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/car-...cing-1.2601437
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Old 10-14-2016, 01:10 PM   #4
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Suggest you google "invoice prices" or read this CBC story.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/car-...cing-1.2601437

Not sure if you are suggesting that the original poster Sailor 231 or I read that article... but yes, I myself am well aware that "dealer invoice" $ numbers are largely a sham, as there are all sorts of kickbacks and incentives going on, behind the scenes, at the dealerships.

Which is, in my opinion, why a good car broker in either Canada or the USA is all the more valuable.

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Old 10-14-2016, 01:27 PM   #5
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Plus David deals with loans, but without markup. The dealers ALWAYS mark up the loans, in a hidden way. Again - it is the actual bank that does the loan for us, not david. He just finds the best deal.
And, David makes money on the loan through a kickback from the lending agency, just as the dealer sells a loan to a lending agency. In any event, you are paying a fee, buried in your loan payments.
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Old 10-14-2016, 01:40 PM   #6
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Car dealer friend told me long ago that if we sold you the car we got you. It is just all relative of "how much" the got you is. Some buyers that pay sticker subsidize the one's that get better prices, and so on. I've always been aggressive with my car deals and my salesman from 10 years ago is now the president of the dealership. I just send him an email when I need a car on a good used one (never buy new anymore) on their lot with a "stupid" offer and if he likes it he tells me to pick it up by 5pm. So far he has taken all my "stupid offers" and laughs at what I got away with when I pick the car up. I remember my friends advice though and still know "they got me."
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Old 10-14-2016, 01:42 PM   #7
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I know it's de rigueur to poke fun at car salesmen and dealers (no, I'm not related nor do I know any), but folks have to made a living in this world and deserve some recompense for their time, effort, knowledge, overhead, inventory, etc. It's tempting to go into a sticks & bricks facility and glean all the info to be had from the salespeople and then go buy a similar item off the internet as it is cheaper. Bad form, in my opinion. I'll get off my soapbox now...

Edited: Oops...really off topic.
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Old 10-14-2016, 01:55 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
And, David makes money on the loan through a kickback from the lending agency, just as the dealer sells a loan to a lending agency. In any event, you are paying a fee, buried in your loan payments.
In my opinion.... you are posting conjecture as if it was fact.
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Old 10-14-2016, 01:56 PM   #9
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I am not really interested in a fight over how to get a good deal on a car, I will do my research and negotiate. I expect the dealer will make some money, otherwise they won't sell it and I am ok with that.

I am interested in peoples towing experience with an escape 19 and a 2nd or 3rd gen highlander, 2016 Sorento, 2016 Pilot, 2014+ MDX or Mercedes ml350 diesel.
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Old 10-14-2016, 02:02 PM   #10
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I hear your point Karen, but the horse is out of the barn on that issue and it is even worse in the retailer space. This is the negative argument on anyone that buys anything on Amazon or online retailers and has gone in to a brick and mortar, played with the item, then ordered it online.
Brick and mortar businesses are adjusting and learning to play in the new world even car dealers who now have very aggressive Internet sales departments, aggressive online pricing, and online search presence. As with all change it is coming and everyone has to learn to adapt to the new business model and how to capitalize on it in order to continue to thrive.
But now back to the topic....
I can only offer towing a 19 with a Nissan Frontier so we'll abdicate to others who might have towed with the vehicles you're interested in.
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Old 10-14-2016, 02:07 PM   #11
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Here is my .02$ worth on the subject. Taken that I have not purchased tires nor brakes on any of my vehicles, or for that matter filled both propane tanks on any of my trailers, over the past 30 years, I look at my final price paid on a new vehicle or trailer similarly to a "tip" paid for good service. If both of us are happy then we have reached an agreement. There are ways the dealer can sweeten a deal with add ons that really do not cost anything to the parties involved. Often called "an arms length transaction" it is freely reached in the open market. As long as you and they are happy then that is all that matters.
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Old 10-14-2016, 02:33 PM   #12
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Carl,
I tow with a Honda Pilot, and am very happy with it. However, I'm only towing a 17, so my comment has little import.
When I researched tow vehicles, the top candidates ended up being Pilot and Highlander, with Sorrento being a close second tier. I had read of issues with the Kia power plant/powertrain, although friends have a small Kia sedan that is approaching 200k miles.
As far as reliability: I posed the question to a friend who owns an auto parts store. He said that he "sells the least repair parts, for Hondas and Toyotas."
So, Pilot and Highlander were the final choices, and I found a good deal on a Pilot.
It is a V6, with HP and torque almost identical to the Highlander. We have towed over the Cascades, Sierras, and Tehachapi Mts. (several mountain passes in the 5000 ft elev. range) with no problems.
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Old 10-14-2016, 04:39 PM   #13
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It sounds like the 2016 pilots have torque vectoring awd from the mdx, which is a plus in my book. Also going to add the touareg tdi to list, but it would need to be a good deal as I worry about their future with the vw scandal.
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Old 10-14-2016, 06:47 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by sailor231 View Post
I am not really interested in a fight over how to get a good deal on a car, I will do my research and negotiate. I expect the dealer will make some money, otherwise they won't sell it and I am ok with that.

I am interested in peoples towing experience with an escape 19 and a 2nd or 3rd gen highlander, 2016 Sorento, 2016 Pilot, 2014+ MDX or Mercedes ml350 diesel.
Hi there Sailor,
I have had a 19' since May and have put about 5000 km on it now. We tow it with a 2014 Highlander AWD and have had no troubles. One of the roads we use to get into the interior of the province is the Coquihalla Highway, featured on a TV program called Highway From Hell because of the steepness. The Highlander zips up there like stink. Hope this helps.
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Old 10-14-2016, 06:53 PM   #15
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Wish vehicles used for towing had the option for oversized brakes other then just bigger engines.
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Old 10-14-2016, 07:18 PM   #16
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I tow my 19 with a Honda Ridgeline, and it is my only vehicle. It tows the 19 with ease, I do have Anderson hitch, which I tighten just enough for anti-sway.

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Old 10-14-2016, 10:39 PM   #17
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We just finished an 8,500 mile trip to the east coast and back, towing our 2015 Escape 19 with a 2014 Jeep Cherokee with a 270 hp V-6, and 9-speed transmission. We use the Andersen hitch, and have been very pleased with both the Jeep Cherokee and the Andersen (and of course the virtually flawless Escape trailer). The Cherokee has a 4,500 towing capability (with the tow package), and we have weighed our Escape loaded at about 3,500 pounds. The Jeep does well even up and down the mountains.
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Old 10-14-2016, 10:53 PM   #18
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We have a 19 and a Highlander, that we purchased new in 2011, and have towed the trailer with this vehicle since the trailer was new in 2013. We have 87,000 kms on the vehicle with about 16,000 kms towing. We have had no problems with the vehicle except for replacing an axle bearing. We change the transmission fluid earlier than required. Brake wear has been normal. We have the factory receiver hitch and heavy duty alternator and transmission cooler.

The vehicle is a very smooth ride, reliable and a comfortable daily driver, the best SUV we have owned for this purpose. It's a good tow vehicle, I would prefer more torque and firmer suspension for towing, but it offers a very good balance between a daily driver and a tow vehicle. We plan to tow with this vehicle for another 5 years.
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Old 10-14-2016, 11:11 PM   #19
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I am contemplating the purchase of a Toyota 4Runner to tow my 19 ( to be delivered in July 2017). I am buying new so that there will be used vehicles for others to buy. Call it a public service!
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Old 10-15-2016, 01:12 AM   #20
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Wish vehicles used for towing had the option for oversized brakes other then just bigger engines.
I wouldn't worry about it. We use trailer brakes so that the tug doesn't do any more braking work that it would if fully loaded and not towing. Descending grades is a job for engine braking, not the brakes. In case of trailer brake failure, any modern braking system has the capacity to handle a single stop from highway speed without fade. It's tire traction, not the size of the brakes, which is the limitation to braking in street conditions (racing is different).

Some performance packages for some vehicles do offer larger brakes, but those are typically high-performance cars rather than SUVs, vans, and trucks. I suppose some of the high-priced German SUVs would offer both sufficient towing capacity and optional performance braking packages... although at huge expense.
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