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Old 05-02-2022, 06:33 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz View Post
tires and service is a LOT cheaper than a new truck. and 130000 miles isn't much at all on a truck, my F250 has 260,000 and counting.
Yes i can do all the things i need for just the tax on the new one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selkirk View Post
I agree, the second gen Tacoma is a very straightforward truck to service. Replacement parts for common wear items are pretty easy to source (at least in my area) and there a huge level of aftermarket support for the 2nd gen.....especially for suspension-related components.

This is assuming that that the OP's truck doesn't suffer from the dreaded frame rot that commonly afflicts first and second gen Tacoma's from rust-belt areas.
Rust it the biggest concern. Toyota just inspected and filled the frame with the rust inhibitor. My truck was one of the problem years. they have extended the warranty to 12 years. The good news is I still have 3 years on the frame warranty. If it rust threw in that time frame they would replace it. Of course they are doing everything possible to help prevent that. If i keep it it only be 2 more years as i like to sell it while it still covered. I am not sure who covers the cost of all the little items that would have to be replaced. Of course we could use a little more room and i had planed on replacing in 2022. On the ford I have a dealer with 2 trucks in stock and will let me order for invoice and hold my trade value 4-7 months to come in. I was hoping that waiting might be better discounts,But experts are saying new shortage will last to the end of 2024 and used will go past that because of the shortage of 3 year lease. of course if I new the future I be rich. I never been good at buying and selling at the right time. seems every house I sell has been in a poor market. However I Did buy my escape at the perfect time. I had no idea at the time I ordered black on Friday 2019. Got the black Friday discount. Now that I think about I wish I bought two.
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Old 05-02-2022, 07:02 PM   #62
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"Invoice" is just a number on a piece of paper. That's not what the dealer pays.
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Old 05-02-2022, 07:24 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
"Invoice" is just a number on a piece of paper. That's not what the dealer pays.



That's true but it a few grand less than msrp. and other dealers I been talking with are 4,000 over msrp. I not paying over msrp.
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Old 05-02-2022, 07:32 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John in Santa Cruz View Post
btw, to save a trip to the dealer, here's the 'catalog' that shows all the packages and options on 2022 4Runners. https://www.auto-brochures.com/makes...unner_2022.pdf

that site, https://www.auto-brochures.com/index.html has nearly every manufacturer's brochures for nearly every model going back 15-20 years, very handy when you are researching late model used cars.

Thanks for this. It makes comparisons between versions very easy.
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Old 05-02-2022, 08:01 PM   #65
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Insurance and taxes are cheaper used. Maintenance costs go up. Reliability is a best guess. I still have my ‘98, but I’ve traveled enough backroads to know that a 25 year old piece of plastic, say a heater valve for example, can leave you totally stranded. For many of the places we go, I decided to get another truck. You can buy newer used, but every time I put pencil to paper, I’m better off with what I already have, or new. It was time for something newer. I’ve only been totally stuck twice while traveling. My ‘98 lost a fuel pump rather suddenly a couple of years ago, and I had an ‘87 truck that lost a tranny in ‘94. Both times I was stuck for awhile because help, parts, and service were a long way off.
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Old 05-04-2022, 10:12 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEWYORKHILLBILLY View Post
I am in the market for a new tow Rig. I currently have a 2011 Tacoma with the V6 4.0 engine. It seems to do well unless I am in the mountains out west. most of my towing is east of the rocky mountains. I looking for feedback towing with the newer 3.5 engine. I think they been using it since 2016 . let me know you experiences good or bad.
I have a 2016 Escape 21. My tow vehicle is a 2018 Chevy Colorado, with the turbo duramax 4cyl. diesel engine. This vehicle tows my trailer well over all the Colorado mountain passes better than my 2055 Chevy Suburban. The turbo charger helps at the high altitudes. When towing in the mountains and desert hills of Utah I get 15 to 17 mpg which is better than the 11-12 mpg in the Suburban.
without the trailer, I get 23 to 30 mpg based on where I am traveling. I have very pleased with this vehicle for towing and the off road capability as well.
Good luck on your vehicle search.
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Old 05-04-2022, 10:14 AM   #67
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Tow vehicle

The 2019 Ranger ECO boost engine coupled with the 10 speed transmission has plenty of power. We just completed a 4200 mile trip through Colorado, Wyoming and Utah. The turbocharged engine only derates about 1% per 1000 feet of altitude. We towed at altitudes in excess of 11,000 MSL with no noticeable loss of towing power. We are very impressed and pleased with the 2019 Ranger as our tow vehicle.

Our 2018 Tacoma had a 3.5 L six cylinder NON turbocharged engine with a six speed automatic transmission. At 10,000 feet altitude it loses 30% of its power. Very poor in the mountains and rev a lot to get the job done. The issue is the engines maximum torque is at 4600 RPM and that’s where it likes to run when high output is required. At low RPM it has no power. (278 hp @ 6000 rpm, 265 lb.-ft. @ 4600 rpm). The ranger has it maximum torque (310 lb.-ft @ 3,000 rpm) with its turbocharged engine.
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Old 05-04-2022, 10:19 AM   #68
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Tacoma towing

We live in north central Washington, so going most anywhere involves crossing mountain passes. When we decided on an E 19, we knew the 2014 Tacoma V6 would be straining on the nearby passes, so we opted for a Tundra which handles the passes much better. The biggest surprise for me has been mpg; the Tundra gets only about 2 less than the Tacoma in daily driving. And the upgrade in riding comfort with the Limited package is worth the extra cost.
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Old 05-04-2022, 10:23 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by NEWYORKHILLBILLY View Post
That's true but it a few grand less than msrp. and other dealers I been talking with are 4,000 over msrp. I not paying over msrp.
I ordered an F-150 from a dealer that sells at msrp minus any Ford factory incentives and discounts. Here's a link to the list of dealers. Though the article is about the Bronco, if you scroll down you'll find the list that applies to all vehicles Ford sells.

https://www.carindigo.com/news/here-...021-bronco-suv
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Old 05-04-2022, 11:45 AM   #70
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I have experienced MPG is really depend on my speed and the raod slope as well. So far I've towed my escape for about 13K miles and mine never get better than 14 Mpg at amlost falt highway at about 60 and if I bummed up it to upper 70s, it easily can goes down to 11.5-12 Mpg. Truck MPG without the trailer at the 60 and 70 is changing between 23 and 19 Mpg.
I am towing 19 feet trailer with 2019 HEMI, 4*4, 3.91 arear axle that can tows 11K and makes it almost feeling we are not towing any thing behind either in the montains!
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Old 05-04-2022, 12:04 PM   #71
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I have a 2003 Tundra 4.7L V-8 that I bought new in 2002. It has 102k miles on it and I LOVE it. I've had it for 20 years now and never a problem. First new front brakes recently and no rust. Depending on conditions maybe 15mpg. I'd get another in a heartbeat but this one will probably outlast me. It tows our Escape 21 fabulously. I paid $18k for it new and, I don't know, maybe I could get that for it now. I've found notes on it with phone numbers in case I want to sell it. Just sayin.
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Old 05-04-2022, 01:44 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by ESCAPERS View Post
I have a 2003 Tundra 4.7L V-8 that I bought new in 2002.
In my mind, the V8 first gen Tundra would be about the perfect tow vehicle choice for a 19 or 21.....for those who desired the reliability/longevity of a Toyota in a less-than-full-size package.

Back in the day, I had hoped that the Toyota would at least offer the 4.7 V8 powertrain as an option in the second gen Tacoma...once they supersized the Tundra.
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Old 05-04-2022, 03:14 PM   #73
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Wow I was hoping some one had a 19' and 3rd generation Tacoma. I was aware of Vermilye experiences with the 21 and his truck up grade. I really respect his opinion as he has so many miles towing escapes. F150 or tundra adds another 12000. I need to get some accurate weights of my 19 my shipping weight say 3723, but if I subtract my cargo weight(1420lbs)listed on my yellow tire sticker from 5000lbs is 3580Lbs . The silver sticker above says I have 579 KG (1276lbs)cargo capacity. If you subtract that from 5000 its 3724lbs . I suspect the silver sticker is the correct weight. how much more does a 21C weigh ,Better yet Jon whats you sticker say. I think we have about the same options or did when you picked up. I got both solar panels 2 6volts large fridge, power awning and front storage box. I did not get the front power jack to reduce tongue weight. I did get the spray foam witch EFI says weigh 130lbs . I still cant see it being that heavy. oddly they add that to the weight of the trailer weather is a 21,19,or17. I am starting to think thats the kit weight wet.
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Old 05-04-2022, 06:58 PM   #74
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New rig

I have been towing a 19 since 2020. I have a GMC Canyon with the 4 cylinder diesel. I have averaged 21.7 mpg, best - 25, worst with head winds - 16.5 . When not towing I average 28 in town and 33 on the highway. Love this vehicle and the mileage.
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Old 05-05-2022, 07:31 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selkirk View Post
In my mind, the V8 first gen Tundra would be about the perfect tow vehicle choice for a 19 or 21.....for those who desired the reliability/longevity of a Toyota in a less-than-full-size package.

Back in the day, I had hoped that the Toyota would at least offer the 4.7 V8 powertrain as an option in the second gen Tacoma...once they supersized the Tundra.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ESCAPERS View Post
I have a 2003 Tundra 4.7L V-8 that I bought new in 2002. It has 102k miles on it and I LOVE it. I've had it for 20 years now and never a problem. First new front brakes recently and no rust. Depending on conditions maybe 15mpg. I'd get another in a heartbeat but this one will probably outlast me. It tows our Escape 21 fabulously. I paid $18k for it new and, I don't know, maybe I could get that for it now. I've found notes on it with phone numbers in case I want to sell it. Just sayin.
My 2004 Tundra (4.7 V8 Extended cab Limited) is hands down the best vehicle I have ever owned. Unfortunately, since I live in the land of salted roads, I'm starting to experience frame issues and Toyota in Canada has ended the frame replacement campaign.
At 355,000 km (221,000 miles) I still trust it to go anywhere but I have been thinking of a replacement. My hope is that manufacturers have realized that this segment of the truck market is worthy of investment and that the next generation of GM, Ford and Toyota mid-sized trucks supposedly coming for the 2023 model year will be a big step up in finish and towing/payload capability.
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Old 05-05-2022, 10:36 AM   #76
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Hi There.

Sorry just saw this post when I put one up on how our 2020 4runner with WDM and 21NE has performed over the mountains. I "think" the new Tacoma and 4runner share the same underlying systems. I posted on performance. What do you have for and Escape. We live in Ithaca. Tks.
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Old 05-06-2022, 01:32 AM   #77
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We tow our 19 with a GMC Canyon v6 with no problems

We tow our Escape 19 with a 2019 GMC Canyon v6 with no problems We’ve taken it from phoenix to Leadville Colorado over Wolf Pass with zero problems. I didn’t even know I had a trailer behind me. No sweat and made in America.
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Old 05-11-2022, 01:44 PM   #78
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Towing with a Forerunner 4.0liter

We just returned from a 4500km trip south from Vancouver BC to Sonoma/Napa area, then back north via Reno and Bend Oregon and through the Cascades- lots of climbing on that trip.
Towing a 19' Escape with 2 ebikes on the back (100 pounds).
I tow with a 2013 Forerunner Ltd with a 4 liter engine. Averaged 16.1 miles per imperial gallon (17.5 liters per 100 km or 13.4 miles per USG). Our travel partners were towing a similar sized trailer (not an Escape) with a 2020 Tacoma with a 3.5 liter engine. He is a mechanic, and did complain that the engine really sucked fuel on the hills.
When we filled up at the same times, with equal mileage we found that the 4 liter forerunner was about 10-12% better fuel economy.
I also note that I was not towing strictly in 4rth gear, as recommended by Toyota- my mechanic friend indicated that as long as i "worked the throttle" and didn't let the engine lug, it would be fine, and I would get better fuel economy- he was correct.
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Old 05-11-2022, 07:32 PM   #79
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Been up and down the Rockys in Colorado pulling my 19 with my 2012 4Runner and have zero complaints. Added WDH, tranny cooler, tranny temp monitor, and Timbren bump stops. Not sure I needed any of that, but comforting. Previous tow vehicles were 2017 V8 F150 & 2008 V8 5.3 Silverado. All of them work hard on the long passes. Been all over US including Alaska and most Canadian provinces. Time spent climbing steep mountain pass was so negligible I can't imagine purchasing a tow vehicle for that purpose.
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Old 05-11-2022, 08:44 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingfish View Post
Time spent climbing steep mountain pass was so negligible I can't imagine purchasing a tow vehicle for that purpose.
Ditto.
Gear down and enjoy the view.
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