First pictures of E21 LE

[Ron in BC]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

Comparing 21' layouts, the LE allocates more of the length from rear wall to door to the bed than the regular 21' uses for the dinette, leaving less of that length for the counter.

A mould for a trailer costs tens of thousands of dollars and in the past has taken months to make. This is just a floorplan option, not a separate model, so I wouldn't expect the new mould which would be required to reposition the wheel wells. Not changing the axle position also avoids a unique frame.

That's the conclusion I came to when I was trying to design a 21 with a 19 interior. Although I knew ETI would never sell me a shell I thought that sooner of later maybe an insurance write-off would become available.

After several tries I came to a similar conclusion. The door position is the limiting factor, at least for what I'd want to do. Although I'd quite happily gut a 21 write-off to put a 19 interior in it I realized that I'd draw the line at cutting out and re-positioning the doorway.

Of course now that I have a 21 the 19/21 has lost it's allure.

Ron

[Karl@Escape]

This is a layout change only, and the photos are from our concept. Thx to Jim for posting. We concept first to ensure we can solve all the engineering challenges, we do not test out on customers. We used a bad fiberglass shell (yes it happens), so we did not invest in laying flooring etc.

We are building a proper inventory unit that we will use for professional photos.

We had a lot of customers who really wanted this layout, we listened and made it happen.

Karl

[stratos175]

I would agree with others based on the pictures this looks way more closed in center of the space and then why would anyone need a dinette that big for a 21' trailer? Now if you are hosting poker night in your trailer maybe .
We love our 2014 21' but now that we've had it for a year have decided the climbing over someone is not much different from scooting off the bed, so would prefer a true queen in the back, dinette in JUST the space the bed is now and rest of layout stay the same. But I know we can't have everything.
Thanks for sharing the pictures.

Enjoy the journey,
Steve

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by stratos175

I would agree with others based on the pictures this looks way more closed in center of the space and then why would anyone need a dinette that big for a 21' trailer? Now if you are hosting poker night in your trailer maybe .

We love our 2014 21' but now that we've had it for a year have decided the climbing over someone is not much different from scooting off the bed, so would prefer a true queen in the back, dinette in JUST the space the bed is now and rest of layout stay the same. But I know we can't have everything.

We certainly don't need that huge dinette. Give us more storage and counter space. The dinettes in the current 21'ers are large enough.

We also fall into the group that would want a scoot-off or walk-around queen. That's the original reason for purchasing the 5.0. However, any camper that has the dinette in the front or side is nixed by us. That was one flaw of our 25' Bigfoot. We want the dinette in back where we can look out at the scenery, not our pickup. We have no problem looking at our pickup when sleeping. I know many others who feel the same way.

Enjoy,

Perry

[Jim Bennett]

I know it would mean a new mould, but if the door was ahead about a foot with little other change, it would allow for a smaller dinette, though still a good size, and for more cabinetry and counter.

I love the potential for this layout much better than the original.

There seems to be a bunch of people who hang out inside the trailer more than others, as they promote the rear dinette so much. We are outside if the weather is nice most of the time for cooking and eating and everything else. Yes, there are some sites where the view out the back is better, but also many campgrounds where it is a wall of trees, or you are backing into neighbours. I did not mind the front dinette in our 19 at all. Layout to me for general use is the most important part. We use the bed WAY more than the dinette, so it's location is key for us.

[Lisa]

It makes sense that many current owners do not like this floorplan- previous models have been geared more for couples than families. I think this new layout opens up the market for families who need the extra living and sleeping space, as well as couples who like to entertain or sometimes travel children or grandchildren.
We outgrew our 17B with the addition of child #3 and are very excited by this new layout that will fit the entire family

[steve dunham]

It is a poor utilization of the available space . A dining area that seats 6 would appeal to a limited audience where more counter / storage space would be a positive asset

[rubicon327]

Originally Posted by Lisa

It makes sense that many current owners do not like this floorplan- previous models have been geared more for couples than families. I think this new layout opens up the market for families who need the extra living and sleeping space, as well as couples who like to entertain or sometimes travel children or grandchildren.
We outgrew our 17B with the addition of child #3 and are very excited by this new layout that will fit the entire family

Agreed, but don't forget that the current 19 with cot option has quietly been the frontrunner with a sleeping capacity of 5. Without a cot in this new layout you will be able to sleep 5 but the children will all be in the same bed. A bunk of some sort as an option would sure be nice. If it is done like the bunk in the 19 then you break it down and still have a the full dinette area unimpeded when needed. If Escape puts in some effort I believe they can come up with some interesting options to make the large front dinette area more useful and appealing to different buyers.

[Eggscape]

Originally Posted by Lisa

It makes sense that many current owners do not like this floorplan- previous models have been geared more for couples than families. I think this new layout opens up the market for families who need the extra living and sleeping space, as well as couples who like to entertain or sometimes travel children or grandchildren.
We outgrew our 17B with the addition of child #3 and are very excited by this new layout that will fit the entire family

I have to agree that it would be much nicer to lounge around the table on a rainy day with some of our oversized camping friends than with our 19. The U shape dinette truly does need extra length/foot room for 4 full-size adults, kids dogs etc.
It will be interesting to see if they use the same length 19 table. The extra length seat on the drivers side would mean you would not have to slide the table to get in.
We don’t live full time in our trailer and eat simple when we camp, so the flip up counter gives us the extra we need on the few times we cook inside.
I think the layout has merit and glad to see ETI quickly making more options available for people with what they have on hand.

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

There seems to be a bunch of people who hang out inside the trailer more than others, as they promote the rear dinette so much. We are outside if the weather is nice most of the time for cooking and eating and everything else. Yes, there are some sites where the view out the back is better, but also many campgrounds where it is a wall of trees, or you are backing into neighbours. I did not mind the front dinette in our 19 at all. Layout to me for general use is the most important part. We use the bed WAY more than the dinette, so it's location is key for us.

Compared to every other camper we've camped with we are always outside. It's where we live and why we're camping. We've been known to make fun of our friends who live most of the time in their campers. However, we love to camp in the shoulder seasons when it rains quite a bit. If it's raining and warm enough we'll be outside underneath our awning. If it's cold we eat breakfast inside, but usually are out the rest of the day. In the spring and fall we are in our camper at times and want to enjoy the scenery from our window. It makes being inside more pleasurable. We also avoid packed campgrounds where our camper is backed into others. If possible, we always take the outside of the loop.

The 5.0 is the first camper we've ever owned that had a rear dinette. Hadn't realized how nice it is to be in the dinette and see the outdoors the vast majority of the time, because we're awake. When we sleep, we sleep, and don't need to see outside, so having the bed in back with a view is worthless to us.

Of course, YMMV.

Enjoy,

Perry

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by rubicon327

... If Escape puts in some effort I believe they can come up with some interesting options to make the large front dinette area more useful and appealing to different buyers.

Even in stock form, it's so long that by removing the table it could be used as twin beds for kids. With the U-shape, maybe the benches could sleep three smaller kids?

[cpaharley2008]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

Even in stock form, it's so long that by removing the table it could be used as twin beds for kids. With the U-shape, maybe the benches could sleep three smaller kids?

and adding a built in bunk option would give you 4 children capacity with 2 adults in the rear, family of 6 camper.....

[Patandlinda]

For us the dinette is too huge on new 21 layout. Having our nice 4 person dinette is plenty because it gives a place to sit inside if needed . We like to also be outdoors . Really don’t want almost 1/2 the trailer with a dinette . Really hate where the shower is in the 21 , like it where it is on our 19 . A few more inches for counter and shower , perfect . Bed running like the 19 in front, perfect Don’t care for smaller bed in 21 either .Nice queen bed which is plenty of room like our 19 . Pat

[Bear101]

Thank you for the pictures. Does anyone know if Escape is considering a custom mattress or or there is some other way they will use the extra 4 inches in width (relative to the 19) for the queen bed?

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by Bear101

Thank you for the pictures. Does anyone know if Escape is considering a custom mattress or or there is some other way they will use the extra 4 inches in width (relative to the 19) for the queen bed?

But it sure makes it easier to make the bed when there's airspace around the mattress. Jamming the bedding between the wall and mattress isn't any fun. Plus that airspace may keep the condensation down in the mattress.

[Bear101]

Originally Posted by Donna D.

But it sure makes it easier to make the bed when there's airspace around the mattress. Jamming the bedding between the wall and mattress isn't any fun. Plus that airspace may keep the condensation down in the mattress.

Good Point Donna

[cpaharley2008]

Yes, I have always requested that the mattress be made smaller to allow air around the sides of the bed, really keeps condensation down.

[Bear101]

Originally Posted by Jim Bennett

I know it would mean a new mould, but if the door was ahead about a foot with little other change, it would allow for a smaller dinette, though still a good size, and for more cabinetry and counter.

I love the potential for this layout much better than the original.

I agree with Jim that a door shift would be a very interesting option and I wonder if people could think in the mindset of keeping the current mold and what they could do. I have mentioned adding a pantry on the driver side of the dinette that is floor to ceiling and the depth of bench seat but if one consider taking a little more width a narrow version of the 21 classic set of drawers with a small counter top could be added in this location. I am thinking of it as a place for a coffee maker with extra pantry storage. I concede that I am thinking selfishly here about this being only a two person unit and I acknowledge that we do not watch TV when we camp so I would also consider this mod as having a conventional dinette, though with one bench longer than the other, and not the C shaped bench but there is potential here.

[Donna D.]

I wonder what maintenance items are hiding under the bed. On the standard 21' the water heater, pump and black tank are under the bed and the batterty(ies) are under the dinette. With the sidebath 19' the black tank is under the toilet. IS there some electrics, but mostly storage under the bed?

[jennykatz]

If they put the bed up front they would not need the front window or the front window guard .Who wants to look at your tow vehicle when camping .We have the e21 and i would like to have a bigger dinette maybe another foot or so . Still looking forward for the new 23 -25 from Escape