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Old 07-02-2020, 12:08 AM   #81
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Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Trailer: Plan: 2021 May - E5.0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
We too crossed the Rubicon. Coming from tenting to a trailer. We are in our mid sixties and haven't given up on tenting completely. Still do some back packing trips in a two man tent, but our main style will certainly be in the trailer. Such luxury not getting yourself off the ground!! Leaves you in better shape to climb the next mountain.
I like all of the Escape trailers and everyone has their own needs and wants.
I really liked the 5.0 but the only problem for us was reading in bed. The ceiling height is somewhat limited in the 5.0, so if reading in bed is a consideration, it might cramp your style. Though in my case after a good hike, my staying power when I hit the bed is usually under a minute.
We do read in the bed. That's my favorite place to read. But - I can get away with reading eBooks. My wife prefers real books. So, we will definitely look at that aspect when we look at E5.0.

Thanks again!
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Old 07-02-2020, 12:26 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by kavm View Post
Hi Sean,

I just looked up the Novakool fridge model (9000) with front ventilation. Seems like a very nice choice! A question: The stock fridge from Escape seems to run on electricity and propane. Not sure if the Novakool one does as well. Or, am I just mistaken where the propane to electricity conversion takes place?
There is no conversion from propane to electricity. The stock fridge from Escape is an absorption refrigerator and converts heating to cooling. The Novakool uses a compressor just like your house refrigerator.
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Old 07-02-2020, 12:34 AM   #83
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
Yes it is the RFU9000. Big advantage for this model is the front venting. You didn't need to allow for top and bottom convection venting. We had Escape eliminate the side cut out on the outside of the trailer for the absorption fridge. We had them leave the top venting just for added circulation which was recommended by Novakool.
We installed 4x100 A Battle Born Lithium batteries.
Likely overkill as we found on a recent 9 day camping trip with somewhat cloudy weather our 190W solar panel (at least I think it is 190 W) supplied by Escape kept our batteries fully charged. We never got below 96% of our battery
I was looking at doing the same refrigerator in the 5.0 TA. It appears it wouldn't burn any more than about 60 ah a day under normal conditions which a good solar system would replace. Your 9 day camping trip shows this to be true. I would have ETI put in two 190W solar panels and I would install a 250ah Lifepo4 battery.
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Old 07-02-2020, 01:28 AM   #84
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I wanted just 12V. They are simply hassle free. The downside is they require 12V power. To offset that I increased the available 12V power with my 4x100 amp batteries.
The fridge offered by Escape is 3 way power, propane, 12v and 120V. The problem is that when these absorption fridges operate on 12V they are pigs for power. They will kill your battery in no time. A 12V compressor fridge is very energy efficient. And they operate with such ease and efficiency regardless of ambient temperature, that is the way I wanted to go.

I would not call myself very handy, but can do some simple stuff like I did with my trailer.
There is however a very good company in Bellingham WA that can do everything for you. They can install Lithium, Battery Monitors, the Fridge etc.

When you get closer you can send me a Private Message and I can put you in contact with them. I haven't used them personally, but I know people who have.
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Old 07-02-2020, 01:34 AM   #85
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Putting in two panels would likely do the trick with a 250A lithium battery. One alternative would be have the 190W roof top panel supplied by Escape, then having a portable solar panel so you could move around if your trailer is in the shade. I do have the Zamp port installed so that will give me the option if need be. So far I haven't needed it
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Old 07-02-2020, 09:53 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
The fridge offered by Escape is 3 way power, propane, 12v and 120V. The problem is that when these absorption fridges operate on 12V they are pigs for power. They will kill your battery in no time. A 12V compressor fridge is very energy efficient. And they operate with such ease and efficiency regardless of ambient temperature, that is the way I wanted to go.
Our older Dometic RM2510 is 2-way (no 12V) and I finally got it working well on propane after several checks and modifications. I will say that if I start to have insurmountable troubles with it the Nova Kool 12V fridge will be a definite consideration. I already have 12V power, AC power, upper and lower vents and supplemental condenser fans if needed to aid venting. The fans can apparently be hooked up directly to the fridge control board. Already checked the dimensions and the RFU6800 would fit for width and depth but would need about 7" more in height if you have the smaller existing fridge with microwave over top. If you have the larger fridge it might already be close. They even have models that are AC/DC switchable. So for someone that camps with hookups they could always switch to AC after traveling if desired.

Two questions for you Sean - since you omitted the lower sidewall vent you would have no access to the back of the fridge. Is the RFU9000 with front venting designed differently where you have access from the front? Also since this vents to the interior versus the exterior does it add any noticeable heat to the interior (which would be fine in winter but possibly a nuisance in summer)?

Thanks for posting. You are leading the way with lithium and a 12V compressor fridge!
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:42 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by rubicon327 View Post
Our older Dometic RM2510 is 2-way (no 12V) and I finally got it working well on propane after several checks and modifications. I will say that if I start to have insurmountable troubles with it the Nova Kool 12V fridge will be a definite consideration. I already have 12V power, AC power, upper and lower vents and supplemental condenser fans if needed to aid venting. The fans can apparently be hooked up directly to the fridge control board. Already checked the dimensions and the RFU6800 would fit for width and depth but would need about 7" more in height if you have the smaller existing fridge with microwave over top. If you have the larger fridge it might already be close. They even have models that are AC/DC switchable. So for someone that camps with hookups they could always switch to AC after traveling if desired.

Two questions for you Sean - since you omitted the lower sidewall vent you would have no access to the back of the fridge. Is the RFU9000 with front venting designed differently where you have access from the front? Also since this vents to the interior versus the exterior does it add any noticeable heat to the interior (which would be fine in winter but possibly a nuisance in summer)?

Thanks for posting. You are leading the way with lithium and a 12V compressor fridge!
You can access the motor components etc from the front. The grille for venting can easily be removed and there is a reasonable amount of room to work with. I did look at going AC/DC but was told it really is a waste of money, roughly $150 more. If you have AC services to plug into, it will power your converter which in turn will power the fridge. Both Novakool and others didn't think it was really worth it. As for heat being discharged into the trailer, I also looked into that. I discussed this with Novakool (very helpful staff) and they said any heat would be negligible. After installing I would agree with them. I can't feel any heat to speak of coming from the vents. Having the roof top vent still in place helps I think as the hot air rises.

When I had Escape cut the cabinet to fit my fridge, I did eliminate the cupboard for the microwave that is above the fridge. I don't have a microwave so I don't miss that.
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:51 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
I did look at going AC/DC but was told it really is a waste of money, roughly $150 more. If you have AC services to plug into, it will power your converter which in turn will power the fridge. Both Novakool and others didn't think it was really worth it.
Thanks. I had realized this but was wondering if there still might be some operational advantage. In further reading of Nova Kool's manual since it is a compressor fridge it operates no differently whether using 12VDC or 120VAC as the source.
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:58 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
As for heat being discharged into the trailer, I also looked into that. I discussed this with Novakool (very helpful staff) and they said any heat would be negligible. After installing I would agree with them. I can't feel any heat to speak of coming from the vents. Having the roof top vent still in place helps I think as the hot air rises.
Sean do you happen to know with the rear vented fridges if it is ok to use the standard outside air inlet and outlet supplied by Escape? I ask because the inlet air will be very hot or very cold at times depending on the weather. Not sure if they are designed to be cooled with "tempered" air from the cabin? Their venting diagram makes me believe they are designed to be cooled with air from inside the trailer.
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File Type: jpg venting.JPG (136.6 KB, 7 views)
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Old 07-02-2020, 12:21 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by kavm View Post
We are in a similar position - approaching this decision as something to enable our outdoor access and enjoyment as we age across the 60s and somewhere into the 70s. My wife was thoughtful enough to see the very persuasive rationale arguing for space and towing characteristics of E5.0 offered by the experienced members on this site. The importance of space as we grow older as well as spend longer periods enjoying the trailer was clearer to her than me - and made the decision easier. So, it has been very helpful thread/interaction already.
Now that you're getting serious about the 5.0TA I don't want to turn you off it since we love ours. However one consideration if you're using the trailer into your 70's then have Escape reinforce the bathroom wall in order to mount handles for easier dismounting the steps. The reason we bought ours used was the owner could no longer handle the steps and they were forced to sell. See the handle in one of the attached pics from the ad when we bought it in 2018.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/UFj1UrIqZxChMGIh1
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Old 07-02-2020, 12:28 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
I wanted just 12V. They are simply hassle free. The downside is they require 12V power. To offset that I increased the available 12V power with my 4x100 amp batteries.
The fridge offered by Escape is 3 way power, propane, 12v and 120V. The problem is that when these absorption fridges operate on 12V they are pigs for power. They will kill your battery in no time. A 12V compressor fridge is very energy efficient. And they operate with such ease and efficiency regardless of ambient temperature, that is the way I wanted to go.

I would not call myself very handy, but can do some simple stuff like I did with my trailer.
There is however a very good company in Bellingham WA that can do everything for you. They can install Lithium, Battery Monitors, the Fridge etc.

When you get closer you can send me a Private Message and I can put you in contact with them. I haven't used them personally, but I know people who have.
Thank you very much! Will definitely take you up on this. Appreciate it.
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Old 07-02-2020, 12:51 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by emers382 View Post
Now that you're getting serious about the 5.0TA I don't want to turn you off it since we love ours. However one consideration if you're using the trailer into your 70's then have Escape reinforce the bathroom wall in order to mount handles for easier dismounting the steps. The reason we bought ours used was the owner could no longer handle the steps and they were forced to sell. See the handle in one of the attached pics from the ad when we bought it in 2018.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/UFj1UrIqZxChMGIh1
Thank you very much! These are very good ideas. The picture was very helpful - as it made me realize the grab handle is on the outside. [Somehow associate it with the slippery bathroom.] Seems like it'd not be a bad thing even before the 70s for getting up and down without light in the night. I have added it to the list. Many thanks!
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Old 07-02-2020, 01:12 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by kavm View Post
Thank you very much! These are very good ideas. The picture was very helpful - as it made me realize the grab handle is on the outside. [Somehow associate it with the slippery bathroom.] Seems like it'd not be a bad thing even before the 70s for getting up and down without light in the night. I have added it to the list. Many thanks!
The grab handle in those photos looks like it is mounted right on the corner, screws would go into the existing framing inside the walls with no additional reinforcing needed in the walls. We had that wall reinforced and added a grab rail going down the steps as well.
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Old 07-02-2020, 02:12 PM   #94
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The grab handle in those photos looks like it is mounted right on the corner, screws would go into the existing framing inside the walls with no additional reinforcing needed in the walls. We had that wall reinforced and added a grab rail going down the steps as well.
Thank you so much! I will admit to being slightly on the obtuse side on this. Not having seen E5.0 in person doesn't help We have a video call scheduled for tomorrow with Samuel Schneebeli of Escape, so that will help a bit.

What I added to our Escape build list is the reinforcement of the bathroom wall facing the cabin. We will not need the grab bar or rail right now but it will give us an option to install handle and/or rail for support when using the stairs whenever we feel the need.
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Old 07-02-2020, 02:56 PM   #95
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Sean do you happen to know with the rear vented fridges if it is ok to use the standard outside air inlet and outlet supplied by Escape? I ask because the inlet air will be very hot or very cold at times depending on the weather. Not sure if they are designed to be cooled with "tempered" air from the cabin? Their venting diagram makes me believe they are designed to be cooled with air from inside the trailer.
I don't think it matters where the air is coming from, but to be sure you should contact Novakool. I have found them to be very helpful. Though I think what they are really looking for is that the air passes over the motor. With the ventilation guides they show the air would come in from the bottom, flow over the motor and then vent through the top, all with gravity convection.

If you relied on the outside side vent in the trailer, and the roof vent, the air is not likely to pass over the motor, rather it would come from the side wall of the trailer and straight up through the roof vent.

The main reason I went with the front venting, was to not worry about the air flows.
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Old 07-02-2020, 03:00 PM   #96
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Sean do you happen to know with the rear vented fridges if it is ok to use the standard outside air inlet and outlet supplied by Escape? I ask because the inlet air will be very hot or very cold at times depending on the weather. Not sure if they are designed to be cooled with "tempered" air from the cabin? Their venting diagram makes me believe they are designed to be cooled with air from inside the trailer.
Just other quick note. Novakool fridges are used in many RV's but also in boats. Their diagrams for air flow usually show air from inside the cabin as many applications would not have the luxury of side vents, I.E. Boats, unless of course you are the Titanic. I know they would not be relying on tempered air from inside the cabin
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Old 07-02-2020, 04:19 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by Sean Murry View Post
I don't think it matters where the air is coming from, but to be sure you should contact Novakool. I have found them to be very helpful. Though I think what they are really looking for is that the air passes over the motor. With the ventilation guides they show the air would come in from the bottom, flow over the motor and then vent through the top, all with gravity convection.

If you relied on the outside side vent in the trailer, and the roof vent, the air is not likely to pass over the motor, rather it would come from the side wall of the trailer and straight up through the roof vent.

The main reason I went with the front venting, was to not worry about the air flows.
Thanks Sean. If I get serious I will speak to Nova Kool. The good news is I have two very efficient, quiet, high volume 12V fans from my absorption fridge condenser performance upgrades. At only 0.46A for 116 CFM they could be attached to the control board and provide forced ventilation if the convection venting is not sufficient.

https://www.grainger.com/product/31C...2ff4eebf48c7bb
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File Type: jpg 66A484FD-73B6-461A-935E-1F42553FA88F.jpg (259.7 KB, 8 views)
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Old 07-02-2020, 05:04 PM   #98
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Thanks Sean. If I get serious I will speak to Nova Kool. The good news is I have two very efficient, quiet, high volume 12V fans from my absorption fridge condenser performance upgrades. At only 0.46A for 116 CFM they could be attached to the control board and provide forced ventilation if the convection venting is not sufficient.

https://www.grainger.com/product/31C...2ff4eebf48c7bb
I think with the fans you have you would be in a very good position with fresh air coming from your side vent. Likely have more air circulation than straight convection.
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Old 07-02-2020, 07:43 PM   #99
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Sean - This is fantastic information! Gives us some very good idea of the pros and cons (few) of the Lithium batteries! Find it very compelling idea. Kind of hoping that Escape can offer it in the 2021 models (with May 2021 delivery timeframe, that's what we will be looking at). This is partly because we are very uninformed and not handy with mechanical or electrical things (computers are the only exception ). That'd be the best.

Otherwise - I will get in touch to get personal advice on the Lithium battery based configuration.

The refrigerator you installed for sounds really nice. Quite interested in it. I will definitely be in touch when we get closer to configuring it - likely from the 2021 catalog.

The one challenge is that we are not handy at all. Are there outfitters / businesses near the Escape office that can install things like these for us? Does Escape help you do that at all? If I understand correctly, the US customers take delivery on the US side of the border...

Thank you very very much for sharing the insights!
Hi kavm. I just sent to a private message with the details of the RV Shop in Bellingham. Thought you might like to have that in case you have any questions as you are planning out your purchase.
Thanks
Sean
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Old 07-02-2020, 10:36 PM   #100
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Hi kavm. I just sent to a private message with the details of the RV Shop in Bellingham. Thought you might like to have that in case you have any questions as you are planning out your purchase.
Thanks
Sean
Thank you very much! Much appreciated.
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