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Old 03-18-2023, 11:10 AM   #61
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One of the main reasons I chose SOK for our batteries was Bluetooth, so I could look at my phone to see the SOC, battery temp, and voltage. I didn't want to remove our dinette cushions and lift the board to see those items. Many other batteries are now including bluetooth.

Food for thought,

Perry
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Old 03-18-2023, 11:18 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Centex View Post
Just FYI, I have the mentioned Bestgo 400Ah version ('standard', not 'pro'), this from the (attached) spec sheet regarding storage:
Storage Temperature: -10įC ~ 40įC ( for ≤ 3 months); Keep SOC at 40~60% for long term storage
Note the attached sheet also has dimensioned drawings for your reference.

As to price, it appears that the current is ~$300 less than I paid on 05/28/2021.

There's many more lithium options on the market today but FWIW I've zero regrets about the Bestgo purchase, IMO it's a very robust item with a set of ratings that more than meet my requirements. The rated BMS Maximum Discharge Current is more than adequate for any 'starting' or continuous loads I've been able to impose through my 2000W (nominal) / 4000W(surge) xantrex Freedom XC inverter. I'm running a 250A Class T fuse between the battery and my DC+ bus with a 200A breaker between the bus and my inverter.
Maximum Discharge Current:
≤ 200 A @ 60min,23įC, 30%≤ SOC ≤100%
≤ 400 A @ 15s, 23įC, 30%≤ SOC ≤100%
≤ 650 A @ 0.5s, 23įC, 30%≤ SOC ≤100%

The vendor (ECPC) was a pleasure to work with, very responsive to tech questions, IMO it's a product worthy of consideration by folks looking for an LiFePO4 solution.

All the specs look solid, the only downside I see is the weight, 89 lbs. This is an issue if it needs winter removal for aging bodies. Of course help can usually be gotten.
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Old 03-18-2023, 11:34 AM   #63
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All the specs look solid, the only downside I see is the weight, 89 lbs. This is an issue if it needs winter removal for aging bodies. Of course help can usually be gotten.
Since our batteries will need to be removed when at home in Minnesota, weight was another of our considerations. No way could I move an 89 pound battery. I strained with my 63 pound SiO2 battery and +60 pound AGM's. I wanted a light battery and the 100ah SOK at 28 pounds was best for me.
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Old 03-18-2023, 11:42 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perry Butler View Post
One of the main reasons I chose SOK for our batteries was Bluetooth, so I could look at my phone to see the SOC, battery temp, and voltage. I didn't want to remove our dinette cushions and lift the board to see those items. Many other batteries are now including bluetooth.
Not in the least discounting the utility of such built-in-the-battery BT monitoring capability, I'll just note that similarly convenient remote battery monitoring capability can be had with many of the shunts having remote display and/or BT on the market today (Victron BMV-712 with external temperature probe, for example).

Granted an external battery temperature sensor may not be quite as precise as one built-into the battery, IMO it's perfectly adequate for warning of the extremes of practical concern.

Personally I like having fewer interfaces for monitoring my overall system, I find it easier to learn and become facile with the relatively consistent Victron BT interface common to both their shunt and MPPT controllers, but YMMV for sure, no worries!

IMO it's really wonderful how many different ways there are to assemble a system offering features to meet most any user preferences and requirements these days!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perry Butler View Post
Since our batteries will need to be removed when at home in Minnesota, weight was another of our considerations. No way could I move an 89 pound battery. I strained with my 63 pound SiO2 battery and +60 pound AGM's. I wanted a light battery and the 100ah SOK at 28 pounds was best for me.
That's certainly a valid criteria for your situation, I sure wouldn't want to try seasonally lifting my 89# battery either , it's great that you've found a setup that works for you (and maybe other folks, too)!

Lacking that seasonal removal need, I'm happy to have one heavy battery with only one pair of cables to attend. For me it's the KISS solution, obviously different from your understandable requirements though.

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Old 03-18-2023, 01:31 PM   #65
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Not in the least discounting the utility of such built-in-the-battery BT monitoring capability, I'll just note that similarly convenient remote battery monitoring capability can be had with many of the shunts having remote display and/or BT on the market today (Victron BMV-712 with external temperature probe, for example).

For me it's the KISS solution, obviously different from your understandable requirements though.

Yes, KISS for me and KISS for you can be quite different.

I have a BMV-712 and it doesn't tell me the individual battery voltage. SOK's AA app reads each battery invidually. That would have been handy on our first, dual 6v AGM failure in 2019, when the one AGM failed, and would have saved a lot of time.

The BMV-712 did tell me the AGM failure when the batteries were charged by the WFCO to 20.3 volts though, and it did save a lot of time.

AFAIK, you can only hook one battery temp module to the 712. There may come a time I want to know the temps individually, like an overheating situation.

However, the SOC on the AA app SOK uses is not accurate on the SOK's. Even our dealer, Current Connected, agreed it's inaccurate. (right now the BMV reads 81% SOC, whereas the SOK app reads 87%). The longer it's been since the batteries were brought to zero by the BMS the worse the accuracy gets. I don't even look at the AA app's SOC anymore. I believe the BMV-712 is much more accurate for SOC.

Again, like you said, we're all different.



Enjoy,

Perry
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Old 03-18-2023, 02:39 PM   #66
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The Victron SmartShunt can measure the intermediate voltage between 2 6V cells, but you can't use the temp probe if you wire it that way.

however, one advantage of on-battery bluetooth monitoring, if your batteries have the built in charger powered heater for sub-freezing conditions, an external shunt doesn't know how much power went into the heater before the battery started charging, so its amp hour estimates will be wrong.
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Old 03-18-2023, 04:10 PM   #67
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My dream unlimited budget battery bank would be two Victron 300 AH batteries with the External BMS, the best in continuous output and monitoring . 3 grand apiece however.
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Old 03-18-2023, 05:00 PM   #68
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My dream unlimited budget battery bank would be two Victron 300 AH batteries with the External BMS, the best in continuous output and monitoring . 3 grand apiece however.
how does an external BMS work? 6-8 wires to each battery ?
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Old 03-18-2023, 05:12 PM   #69
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No there’s an in and to the battery , if there’s two it’s a daisy chain . Very robust
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Old 03-18-2023, 07:08 PM   #70
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No thereís an in and to the battery , if thereís two itís a daisy chain . Very robust
the internal BMS on LiFePO4 batts is connected to each of the 4 cells as well as the power in and out. it is in series with the ground/negative terminal so it can shut the battery off in case of overload, under temp, etc.

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Old 03-19-2023, 10:49 AM   #71
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Im sure the Victron has the same internal cabling but the bms connects through a small multi pin cable . The daisy chain is for multiple batteries. The bms connects through the Victron VE bus system so it talks to the victron inverters and through their Cerbo GX all the solar controllers so they coordinate for the best charging algorithms to the battery. Internal bms of course is blind to other equipment and shunts give the voltage (and temp if you have the sensor installed ). The other internal bms battery that connects and coordinates is the Pylontech 100 amp hour. It daisy chains to each other and has a Canbus connection to connect to the Victron Cerbo gx. However both battery systems are expensive at 1000 or more for a 100 amp battery. Victron does have a range up to 330 amp hour . As I said in another post had I known about the system integration I would have purchased these. Stupid expensive, but so was my trailer and tow vehicle. The reason I went with 2 SOK the continuous output, I suspect 1 200 amp hour Victron would have been enough for our needs.
In the meantime our 3 month journey from coast to coast begins in June , much of it in Canada at Provincial campgrounds so I’ll see how the system holds up. At the end of May I’m going to the Mount Airy Fiddle Festival to play and jam with my friends, it will be a week off grid.
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Old 03-22-2023, 04:40 PM   #72
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The big question is do you have solar? We are having no problem keeping our two 100 ah SOK batteries 100% full most days in Arizona and New Mexico. We donít go to places with shore power, nor do we need a generator. In our 5.0 our WFCO charger was disabled for nearly three years and didnít miss it. Currently we have 160 watts on the roof and our 100 watt portable.

Now we did have four cloudy days with snow and rain in New Mexico, where our SOC got down to 45%, but two days later our 260 watts of solar got our batteries back to 100%.

Waiting at home are two 200 watt panels that will probably be overkill (560 watts) to be installed in May. Once the 400 watts are installed the portable will not be needed. However, Iíll be installing an inverter for toast, occasional microwave, and, we believe, Terry will be getting a c-pap in May. If not for the c-pap Iíd only be adding one 200 watt panel. I find portables a PITA and it wonít be needed, even in shade, with 350 or more watts on the roof. Weíre having no problems charging our three laptops and two cell phones too.

Do we need DC-DC? No, going on two straight months starting January 11, our solar has done its job (even though I have a Victron DC-DC sitting at home that was purchased for a voltage regulator that probably will be sold). Do we reach 100% every day? No, but you donít need to reach 100% daily with lithium. Plus, I donít want to add additional wiring in the truck or camper.

We foolishly thought we needed a lithium specific charger, a Victron Blue Smart 30 amp charger, for our batteries. Itís been used twice. Once to zero out the SOK batteries that Current Connected (our vendor) suggested using our F150ís inverter. Once, for jollies, to see what itís like charging from the 150ís inverter, and it just charged the batteries quicker than the solar panels, but perhaps someday weíll need it. Besides our truck is quieter than any stand-alone generator. Rather than buying a charger for your WFCO Iíd just get the Victron charger for you generator.

We decided to start simple and guess what? It works.

If you donít have solar, and/or arenít willing to put (more?) solar on your roof, you donít need a different charger in your WFCO or DC-DC. Once installed, solar is passive, needs no attention, works going down the road or when boondocking, and doesnít need plugging and unplugging, . However, if you have amp-hour anxiety spend away.

Food for thought,

Perry

Excellent advice.
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Old 03-22-2023, 06:31 PM   #73
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I agree with what Barry says with the exception that if you put in the small Victron 18 amp dc (it’s pretty cheap) you get some amps in your battery while driving down the road, probably about 10 amps, it’s passive and does protect your tow battery from being drained by a low charge lithium battery if you stay hooked up. I see no down side for the little money they cost. It goes in between the 7 pin charge wire (the black one) the battery of 12 volt bus in your converter. If you want more amps than that then it gets more complex with running a dedicated wire. Ymmv
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Old 03-22-2023, 08:06 PM   #74
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If you don’t have solar, and/or aren’t willing to put (more?) solar on your roof, you don’t need a different charger in your WFCO or DC-DC. Once installed, solar is passive, needs no attention, works going down the road or when boondocking, and doesn’t need plugging and unplugging, . However, if you have amp-hour anxiety spend away.
Sorry I meant to say:

If you don’t have solar, and/or aren’t willing to put (more?) solar on your roof, you probably need a different charger in your WFCO or DC-DC.

We’re currently having no problems with our 160 watts on the roof and the 100 watt portable solar panel. With the current solar we can get by with the existing charger and no DC-DC to buy, install, and worry about. Once home, I’ll be installing 400 more watts on the roof making the existing charger really needless and certainly no need for DC-DC. After all, we went 2 1/2 years with our WFCO charger disconnected and no DC-DC in our 5.0.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NEWYORKHILLBILLY View Post
So if I disable my charge line and just charge off solar and program the Victron to stop charging at 5 Celsius. I would solve that problem. The big question will I even miss what the F150 charge line puts out. Maybe a switch in the charge line would be a better solution.
When I get home I’ll just disable the charge line from my F150. KISS.

Enjoy,

Perry
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Old 03-22-2023, 08:49 PM   #75
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One concern I have with the Bluetooth battery is what the long-term support for these apps will be. Most of them are using the Xiaokiang app. It seems like every time I rely on something Bluetooth it will have connections problems. I just put my batteries back in for the season and my Victron mppt and 712 would not connect. Just keep saying wrong password. After several emails with Victron it was determined that would need to reset the pin codes. To do that you need the PUK code. The only records of these codes in on the sticker on the back of the unit. Well, that was A issue being they both installed. On the MPTT I was able to get A inspection camera in to get it, But the 712 had to be removed and reinstalled. of course, now have a record of these codes. My sync 4 in my 2022 F150 will no longer keep a reliable Bluetooth connection since its last update. My point is Bluetooth is great when it works.
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Old 03-22-2023, 11:17 PM   #76
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My victron devices are now (except for the dc to dc) connected to a Cerbo gx with screen with ve direct cables. Of course the Cerbo and screen wasn’t cheap, but the reporting and history of the devices is outstanding, I also have connections to mopeka propane sensors and ruuvi tag temperature and humid sensors. There’s less reliance on Bluetooth (except for the sensors). I have deep control over my inverter/charger/transfer switch and charge profiles. None of this cheap, but I expect the equipment to be working long after I’m not.
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