High Altitude Kit Dometic Furnace

[Seneca]

Above 8000 feet the furnace on my 2019 Escape 19 does not work well. For whatever reason, the refrigerator and the hot water heater seem unaffected by altitude. The furnace works fine below 6-7000 feet, and is only rated to perform below 5000, so I'm not claiming there is anything wrong with it. There is a high altitude kit that can be installed, and a #60 orifice, as well.

Does anyone have any experience with that fix? Does it work? If I go that route, would the furnace perform normally at ordinary altitudes?

I read the thread on adjusting the regulator to deal with this issue, but I'm a little hesitant to go in that direction because it's only the furnace that's in issue and I don't want to affect the refrigerator or hot water heater.

I mostly use the trailer in the summer in the mountain west and camp in places where I have no access to electrical power, so the space heater option is a non-starter.

Thanks!

[davidmurphy02]

What is the high altitude kit - I have not heard of that and can't find anything on it, do you have a link? The #60 orifice, part #31086, seems to be the standard orifice for this furnace, I can't find any mention of more than one orifice size.

[EscapeBoulder]

Seneca: While I can't directly answer your question, I have an interesting observation.

I live at 8,300' elevation west of Boulder, CO. Using our 2018 Escape 19'er at higher elevations (up to 10,000' near Leadville, CO), I find that our refrigerator and furnace work fine. But our water heater has issues. I guess I find it strange that you have elevation issues with your furnace, we with our water heater. Go figure.

[davidmurphy02]

I would be inclined to try adjusting the propane pressure first - it's a pretty good chore to remove the gas valve & burner assembly to change out the orifice, if indeed that is a different orifice. A manometer/gas pressure gauge is not terribly expensive and can be handy to have on hand to diagnose any other problems that pop up down the road. There is a test port on the side of the regulator that is easy to attach the manometer to, and adjusting the pressure regulator is easy when your gauge is attached right there. It may be worth a try to see what your pressure is reading at the higher altitudes and adjusting the pressure down to see if that makes a difference, and also if it has any effect on your other appliances. If it doesn't help or has an adverse affect it only takes a second to set it back to what it was before.

[Seneca]

Thanks, guys.

The part number for the high altitude kit is 32503. Dometic bought Atwood and the RV repair shop guy I talked to told me I'd need the model and serial number of the furnace Escape installed in my 19 before he could tell me whether it was compatible.

Dealing with the regulator may be the way I end up going. Living at high altitude (7000 feet) and using the trailer at elevations that are higher (up in the Aspens, basically), propane issues are a PITA. But, if you're sleeping with the windows open so you can hear the stream gurgle, it's kinda inconsistent to complain that it's nippy in the mornings.

[davidmurphy02]

Interesting - I can find the high altitude kit, which seems to consist of a new exhaust tube and external fitting, but no explanation of what it does. The exhaust tube in our furnace is a straight pipe, and the one in the high altitude kit is offset quite a bit and would likely not line up with the opening in the external door.

I did see a mention someplace, unconfirmed, that the standard orifice in the furnace is a 50 and that the 60 orifice is for high altitude, so that could be a possibility to try if nothing else works. The only problem with changing an orifice is that if it is sized specifically for high altitude the furnace may not work properly at lower altitudes, and it's a lot of trouble to change it out. Certainly easier to try adjusting the propane pressure down first since that's both cheaper and much easier to do.

Trying to get a furnace issue figured out can be a hair-pulling experience, I had an intermittent ignition problem that drove me crazy this spring. Replaced the circuit board, replaced the flex duct and grill inside with a straight pipe to improve air flow, bought a manometer and checked propane pressure, lowered propane pressure at high altitude....all to no avail. Finally determined that the only thing left was the gas valve/igniter so I pulled that out and replaced it....bingo! Now it's about time for the sail switch to crap out again

[MVA]

Originally Posted by Seneca

Thanks, guys.

The part number for the high altitude kit is 32503. Dometic bought Atwood and the RV repair shop guy I talked to told me I'd need the model and serial number of the furnace Escape installed in my 19 before he could tell me whether it was compatible.

Dealing with the regulator may be the way I end up going. Living at high altitude (7000 feet) and using the trailer at elevations that are higher (up in the Aspens, basically), propane issues are a PITA. But, if you're sleeping with the windows open so you can hear the stream gurgle, it's kinda inconsistent to complain that it's nippy in the mornings.

Please post if the high altitude kit makes a difference. I am also at 7000' but have been reluctant to change out orifices that would cause our trailer to be not functional at sea level. I have noted the furnace is less effective (less heat output) at higher altitude. It is interesting the different problems people have had with altitude; mine was the 6 cf refrigerator would not stay lite, but the water heater was fine and the furnace was satisfactory. I agree with David; I would check the pressure at the regulator first (under static conditions). I have mentioned in other posts that apparently the regulators are factory set higher pressure than the frig spec. If the pressure is too high, at higher altitude the richness of the propane-air mixture will be exasperated.

2 cents

[IanC]

This is a little disconcerting to hear. We like to camp in the Eastern Sierras at around 9000 ft. Had no idea the heater has problems at that altitude. Our tent trailer heater works fine at altitude. I'm curious if this is a sporadic problem or if others experience the same issue of the heater not working at higher altitudes?

[davidmurphy02]

Originally Posted by IanC

This is a little disconcerting to hear. We like to camp in the Eastern Sierras at around 9000 ft. Had no idea the heater has problems at that altitude. Our tent trailer heater works fine at altitude. I'm curious if this is a sporadic problem or if others experience the same issue of the heater not working at higher altitudes?

This is like a lot of other things - most owners have no problem, but issues at high altitude are not uncommon. Typically the fridge is the most sensitive to high altitude because it has the smallest flame, but some owners - undoubtedly a small minority - have encountered issues with the water heater and furnace. Of course, many people never camp at 9,000 feet so it's hard to say just how common problems are.

The issue at high altitude is that the air is thinner so propane, at the regular pressure can create a mixture that is too rich in propane and doesn't burn as well - you can sometimes hear the burner sputtering and not sounding quite normal in the water heater or fridge, and at very high altitudes sometimes the fridge will have trouble staying lit. One fix for this is to adjust the propane pressure regulator to a lower pressure at very high altitude. I wouldn't mess with it unless you encounter problems since many people don't, but it is for sure something to try if one or more of your propane appliances is struggling at high altitude and it's good to have this arrow in your quiver when you're out in a remote area.

There is an adjustment screw under a round black plastic cover on the front of the propane regulator. On the side of the regulator there is a port for attaching a manometer / gas pressure gauge. When you measure the propane pressure you want the system under about a 50% load - a quick approximation for this is to just turn on a couple of stove burners. With a manometer hooked up you can see what your pressure is, and slowly turn the adjustment screw to adjust the pressure up or down. Normal pressure is around 11 WC, at high altitude people have had some success adjusting it down to about 10.

Lots of manometers on Amazon and elsewhere, here is one: https://www.amazon.com/Dwyer-Pressur.../dp/B00F34RH68. I like this one because most gauges read from 0 - 35 or so, this one reads from 0-15 so the graduations on the dial are easier to see. There are also digital manometers with a digital instead of analog gauge, work pretty much the same way but I tend to prefer analog. Sometimes pressure regulators have been known to go bad and if you have a manometer and are experiencing issues with propane appliances at any altitude you can quickly check and determine whether your propane pressure is OK.

[gbaglo]

Corded electric

[davidmurphy02]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Corded electric

Didn't catch that typo in the product description - no electricity needed

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by davidmurphy02

Didn't catch that typo in the product description - no electricity needed

Doesn't instill confidence.

[davidmurphy02]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Doesn't instill confidence.

Well, here's a link from Dwyer's website....I was just able to find the Amazon ad quicker so I posted that but Dwyer does have a pretty good reputation, I bought mine based on a recommendation from another forum user.

https://www.dwyer-inst.com/Product/T...its/SeriesLPTK

[MVA]

Originally Posted by davidmurphy02

This is like a lot of other things - most owners have no problem, but issues at high altitude are not uncommon. Typically the fridge is the most sensitive to high altitude because it has the smallest flame, but some owners - undoubtedly a small minority - have encountered issues with the water heater and furnace. Of course, many people never camp at 9,000 feet so it's hard to say just how common problems are.

The issue at high altitude is that the air is thinner so propane, at the regular pressure can create a mixture that is too rich in propane and doesn't burn as well - you can sometimes hear the burner sputtering and not sounding quite normal in the water heater or fridge, and at very high altitudes sometimes the fridge will have trouble staying lit. One fix for this is to adjust the propane pressure regulator to a lower pressure at very high altitude. I wouldn't mess with it unless you encounter problems since many people don't, but it is for sure something to try if one or more of your propane appliances is struggling at high altitude and it's good to have this arrow in your quiver when you're out in a remote area.

There is an adjustment screw under a round black plastic cover on the front of the propane regulator. On the side of the regulator there is a port for attaching a manometer / gas pressure gauge. When you measure the propane pressure you want the system under about a 50% load - a quick approximation for this is to just turn on a couple of stove burners. With a manometer hooked up you can see what your pressure is, and slowly turn the adjustment screw to adjust the pressure up or down. Normal pressure is around 11 WC, at high altitude people have had some success adjusting it down to about 10.

Lots of manometers on Amazon and elsewhere, here is one: https://www.amazon.com/Dwyer-Pressur.../dp/B00F34RH68. I like this one because most gauges read from 0 - 35 or so, this one reads from 0-15 so the graduations on the dial are easier to see. There are also digital manometers with a digital instead of analog gauge, work pretty much the same way but I tend to prefer analog. Sometimes pressure regulators have been known to go bad and if you have a manometer and are experiencing issues with propane appliances at any altitude you can quickly check and determine whether your propane pressure is OK.

David's reply and explanation is great - only comment if you are short of time (like you are leaving tomorrow!) you can make your own manometer. Lot's you youtube videos.

[IanC]

Great info David! I'll print this one out and hang on to it just in case. I don't even have my trailer yet, but good to know there is a fix for the problem if it arises. Thanks.

[dfandrews]

Originally Posted by IanC

This is a little disconcerting to hear. We like to camp in the Eastern Sierras at around 9000 ft. Had no idea the heater has problems at that altitude. Our tent trailer heater works fine at altitude. I'm curious if this is a sporadic problem or if others experience the same issue of the heater not working at higher altitudes?

Ian,
Since you camp where we camp, I'll comment.
We take our 2015 Escape 17A into the Eastern Sierras regularly. We typically are camping at 8,000-10,000 ft. Everything works fine: furnace, frig, stove.
My guess is that problems are sporadic, with some, if not many, related to regulator adjustment.
Hope to see you and your Escape sometime.

[BigSwede]

It didn't occur to me that this could be a problem, though it should have. In any event, I was camping at 9,700 feet in Wyoming last month, furnace and fridge worked fine (don't have a water heater).

[IanC]

Good to hear Don and Steve. And Don, thanks again for showing us your 17 foot Escape. Can't wait to get ours.

[azjack]

Years ago, maybe with the 19 I had a problem with some propane appliance in Colorado so I went to see a mobile RV tech and he adjusted my regulator, no more problem so I bought a manometer for myself. I think I used it once, not sure where it is now but probably in a good home. Now all of my propane items seem to work fine up to 10,000'
AZjack

[Seneca]

Thanks, everyone.

I'm going to start with the regulator. I've ordered the Dwyer manometer that David recommended and, assuming that the regulator is at the factory setting of 13, reduce that to 11.5. Hopefully that will resolve my issue at altitude, and if my propane runs to lean at sea level, I'll just adjust it back. If that doesn't, I think I'll have the furnace serviced this fall (it will have been in use for three seasons) and look into having a high-altitude orifice switched out for the standard issue one (assuming that's possible). I'm going to hold off on the high altitude kit until all else has failed.

IanC--don't be deterred or put off by all this. Stuff comes up, and some of it doesn't come up until you've used the trailer for a while. For instance, everybody talks about changing out the hot water heater's anode rod every year or so (good idea) but for some reason, people don't mention so much the need to clean the water pump's intake filter regularly. I'm here to tell you if you don't clean the gunk out of that thing periodically, you will lose water pressure and could (if you're sufficiently oblivious) burn out the pump, I suppose. Not to hijack my own thread.