Long showers with 120V hot water heater?

[richm]

With full hookup and a the two-way (120V) hot water heater, how much hot water can it generate in the long run? Is it hot for the first several gallons, then lukewarm? Just trying to understand.

I'm choosing trailer options, and I want to understand whether two-way hot water makes a big difference in terms of length of showers when hooked up.

[Vermilye]

It won't make hot water as fast as you can use it showering even with both 120V & gas running simultaneously, but I've never run out showering. Some mixing takes place as the cold water enters the bottom of the tank & the hot water goes out the top, but for the most part it doesn't get cold for most of the 6 gallons.

For me, the advantage of the 120V option is leaving the switch on all the time & by the time you are set up, the tank is hot.

[Bill and Earline]

Rich,

I originally thought the two-way water heater made sense since I am often paying for electricity at many campgrounds. Someone pointed out that I'd probably never make the money back on the 2-way, due to the modest cost of heating water solely with propane. Sort of a lifetime worth of propane for the additional cost.

The electric heats the 6 gallons just fine, but has a slower recovery rate than propane.

Now I've learned you can run both electric and propane at the same time, and it's darn close to a perpetual supply of hot, especially if I don't hog the hot water.

[cpaharley2008]

You will probably run out of water before it gets too cool to use.......remember you are camping and not at home.

[dosby]

Hot water didn't run out when we were camping this past weekend. We took very quick showers, though, ~8-10 showers plus hand-washing barely filled our gray tank. 6 gallons of hot water is enough for quick showers.

[richm]

Thanks Vermilye, Bill and Earline, and Jim! This helps a lot, not just for the details I hadn't found elsewhere, but the results. Knowing you can run both propane and 120V and have a relatively normal shower is very helpful.

My boys and I would just as soon be in a tent or be backpacking. But not the women, and this sound like it could make them far more comfortable if we do full hookups periodically throughout trips, while also able to do boon-docking or dry camping in national parks. Thanks!

[rubicon327]

Originally Posted by richm

With full hookup and a the two-way (120V) hot water heater, how much hot water can it generate in the long run? Is it hot for the first several gallons, then lukewarm? Just trying to understand.

I'm choosing trailer options, and I want to understand whether two-way hot water makes a big difference in terms of length of showers when hooked up.

For the Suburban SW6DE:
Gas (12,000 BTU/H burner): 10.2 GPH recovery
Electric (1440 W element): 6.0 GPH recovery
Combined: 16.2 GPH recovery

When dividing by 60 to convert to GPM you can see it isn’t that much. Won’t keep up with long runs of hot water at full shower flow. Navy showers!

[Bill and Earline]

Using Rubicon numbers, let's say I use 3 gallons of the hot water, with some cold mixed in, of course, then the dual heat water heater would recover to full temp in about 11 minutes. This depends on the incoming water temp, but that time frame works at our house/ camper.

I know better than to use more than my half.

Another old trick to extend the use of the gray tank: catch the kitchen sink water in a tub that sits in the sink, then pour it down the toilet. The black tank can use the additional water flow, and it never fills normally.

[Iowa Dave]

We had the Two way heater on the 19 but I never looked for the electric switch till the day we sold it. Tried it, worked fine. Bought the 21 had the switch on the water heater, use it all the time and the propane when we don’t have the hookups. Sometimes we camp with family and they don’t have a shower. So the way it usually goes is an extended shower session where each lady is give the privacy of showering and making themselves ready for bed while the boys set outside and drink. It is not back to back to back showers and everybody usually judiciously uses the water they want. Sometimes I decant small buckets of water off the grey tank and dump it in the black tank to give us another day or two before dumping. Last spring I stayed in a campground that offered a dump service. Left for the day at 8 am, on the way out told the host to dump my tank. Returned that night, clean tanks, everything properly buckled up. Easily worth the $10 charge to me. Showed up on my credit card next month.
Iowa Dave

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by rubicon327

For the Suburban SW6DE:
Gas (12,000 BTU/H burner): 10.2 GPH recovery
Electric (1440 W element): 6.0 GPH recovery

Trivia for the nerds:
12,000 BTU/h is 3520 W, so if the heater were 100% efficient when running on propane it would recover at 2.4 times the rate of the electric heater, or 14.7 GPH. Since it only recovers at 10.2 GPH, the heater is only 70% efficient. That's not surprising, and it doesn't mean that electric heating necessarily makes sense, but there's certainly room for improvement on the propane-fired side.

[richm]

Originally Posted by Iowa Dave

... So the way it usually goes is an extended shower session where each lady is give the privacy of showering and making themselves ready for bed while the boys set outside and drink. It is not back to back to back showers and everybody usually judiciously uses the water they want.

Thanks Iowa Dave. Great ideas.

[Gasguy]

Myself,wife & teen daughter can take back to back showers with 5-10 minutes interval & have only come up short once. That’s when I followed up after daughter who absolutely drained the water heater of hot water. Like others mentioned if your going to be taking long showers turn the propane part of the heater on, it’s like a turbocharged water tank.

[Greatboatz3]

Originally Posted by Vermilye

For Me advantage of the 120V option is leaving the switch on all the time & by the time you are set up, the tank is hot.

Probably I miss understand, by "leaving I leave the switch on all the time", but if the electric switch was on while boondocking wouldn't the hot water heater try to run off of the inverter or does it "know" it needs to be hooked up to shore power?

[davidmurphy02]

Originally Posted by Greatboatz3

Probably I miss understand, by "leaving I leave the switch on all the time" but if the electric switch was on while boondocking wouldn't the hot water heater try to run off of the inverter or does it "know" it need to be hooked up to shore power?

The hot water heater is not wired to the inverter so it only uses AC when you are plugged into shore power, that's why you can leave the switch on all the time.

[cpaharley2008]

Just remember to insure there is water in the unit before turning on the electric option or propane.......

[Vermilye]

Originally Posted by Greatboatz3

Probably I miss understand, by "leaving I leave the switch on all the time", but if the electric switch was on while boondocking wouldn't the hot water heater try to run off of the inverter or does it "know" it needs to be hooked up to shore power?

I did add an internal switch for the water heater so I can turn it off when winterizing, or connected to a low amperage power source, or running on my 900 watt generator. Easier than going outside, and the outside switch often fails from use.

[Greatboatz3]

Thank you David, Jim and Jon

[sofmerc]

soo trying to wrap my head around this "payback" of electricity...as a newbie. I will be mostly plugged in 80/20% I'm guessing. I live in Fl so need to be plugged in for Aircond at least 5 months of the year. I'm assuming CG have a flat fee for AC hookup per night. What would I be saving if I omitted dual water heating ac element?

[HABBERDABBER]

I'm not certain if I understand your question, but all the Escape water heaters are propane fired, and electrical water heating with a resistance element is the option addition. Unless you go thru hoops to get a special electric only water heater, your options are propane only or propane with electric.


If you go propane only, there are aftermarket electric heaters that can be installed in the anode fitting, about $100, that work well. I have one in my rig. Hot Rod is one brand, & there are others. Only downside to that route is an additional electrical extension cord to the power pedestal. No biggie.


If you are usually plugged in, the electric option is a reasonable choice. What you will save? You'll be spending $$$$thousands to get the rig, I wouldn't fret about pennies or dollars of saving either way.


Get the 2-way water heater, is my advice. They work, well.....but I'm overly opinionated.

[tdf-texas]

Originally Posted by Vermilye

It won't make hot water as fast as you can use it showering even with both 120V & gas running simultaneously, but I've never run out showering. Some mixing takes place as the cold water enters the bottom of the tank & the hot water goes out the top, but for the most part it doesn't get cold for most of the 6 gallons.

For me, the advantage of the 120V option is leaving the switch on all the time & by the time you are set up, the tank is hot.

I always worried about burning up the electric heater element by accidentally having the hot water heater switch on when it was not full.

This mod solved my worries as I could always, at a glance, tell if the hot water heater electric was on. It also took care of the outside switch fail problem as we now never turn it off.

https://www.escapeforum.org/forums/f...itch-8535.html

Jon, I've seen where you added a on/off switch for the hot water heater for your 17 - did you do something like that on the 21?