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Old 02-25-2015, 06:20 PM   #1
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Need help understanding the power systems in the trailer please

Kind of embarrassing to show my ignorance here but I'm not clear on which items in the trailer draw their power from which sources. I found snippets of info in various forum questions, and some info in the owners manual (although I can't find that online anymore), but no answers to the real life application questions. This is my understanding (which may or may not be correct!):
  1. When connected to shore power everything runs off the shore power except for the stove and water heater which always run on propane.
  2. When not connected to shore power
  • stove, water heater and fridge run on propane
  • everything else runs from the battery
So how does all that change when you have solar? Are there things that won't run from the battery (ex. Microwave, AC?)? Or is it just that they draw so much power that you wouldn't want to? If you have solar does that supplement enough power to run the energy hog appliances? Do any appliances run directly from the solar power? Or is it just that the solar power is used to recharge the batteries and the appliances still run off the batteries? If you don't have solar power, how do the batteries recharge? Is it only when hooked up to shore power or maybe while traveling?

Told you I was confused!
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Old 02-25-2015, 06:28 PM   #2
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Basically you have 3 types go power systems, propane for the stove and furnace and water heater, 12v for your lights and MaxxFan and water pump and the furnace blower, 120v for your a/c and microwave. The 12v runs off your battery and the solar panel recharges your battery. While towing your tow vehicle will also recharge your battery. While hooked up to cg electric your converter will also recharge your battery. Thus with the more 12v use you have more ways to recharge. I hope this helps....
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Old 02-25-2015, 06:31 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Jill View Post
Kind of embarrassing to show my ignorance here but I'm not clear on which items in the trailer draw their power from which sources. I found snippets of info in various forum questions, and some info in the owners manual (although I can't find that online anymore), but no answers to the real life application questions. This is my understanding (which may or may not be correct!):
  1. When connected to shore power everything runs off the shore power except for the stove and water heater which always run on propane.
  2. When not connected to shore power
  • stove, water heater and fridge run on propane
  • everything else runs from the battery
So how does all that change when you have solar? Are there things that won't run from the battery (ex. Microwave, AC?)? Or is it just that they draw so much power that you wouldn't want to? If you have solar does that supplement enough power to run the energy hog appliances? Do any appliances run directly from the solar power? Or is it just that the solar power is used to recharge the batteries and the appliances still run off the batteries? If you don't have solar power, how do the batteries recharge? Is it only when hooked up to shore power or maybe while traveling?

Told you I was confused!
Hi - you are pretty close on everthing. the solar only recharges your batteries. the major appliances will not run on 12v as the consumption of battery power would be 2 great.

the batteries recharge when plugged in to shore power or when travelling from your connection to the tow vehicle ( although this charging is very slow ).

I would suggest you get 2 6v batteries and the solar option. You may want to consider the inverter option ( this converts the 12v up to 120v and would let you run the microwave, or the drip coffee pot etc. ) when not on shore power. You would need the 1500watt inverter.

It is easier to have done by ETI now than for you to try and do later.

Ken
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Old 02-25-2015, 06:33 PM   #4
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Also, you can only run the a/c when hooked to shore power or to a portable generator.

Ken
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Old 02-25-2015, 06:36 PM   #5
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The hot water tank may/can also run off 120v, if equiped that way from the factory. Optional.
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Old 02-25-2015, 06:56 PM   #6
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One more thing to add: the fridge can run on propane even when you have hookups. In fact, most Escape owners have reported the fridge cools better on Propane. Absorption fridges require a heat source to start and sustain the absorption cycle. Propane is an excellent heat source.
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Old 02-25-2015, 07:23 PM   #7
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Jill, it is an excellent question and never do we see a good basic explanation of this. You are one step ahead of most newbies for asking.

If you intend to be in campgrounds a lot, you would want the dual water heater so you do not have to use your propane. You also can use a small electric cube heater to not pay and bother with propane when hooked up. One with a thermostat is good.

The 1500-watt inverter that can be bought from ETI is said to be good enough to run the microwave by some and not good enough by others. It may depend on what else you have running if using the microwave, or not. Maybe some more people can give their experience on that. I think you would have to forget the A/C with solar, at least without a whole lot more solar and more than two 6-volts, which you would also want with solar, as Ken said.
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Old 02-25-2015, 07:42 PM   #8
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Might be more then you care to know but you can try reading "The 12 Volt Side of Life", 2 parts.

The 12volt Side of Life (Part 1)
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Old 02-25-2015, 07:45 PM   #9
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Thank you for all the very helpful input. I'm sold on the need for the dual batteries and solar as well as the dual water heater. I don't remember seeing the dual water heater as an option but will ask. Floating Cloud are you also saying I should get more than the dual 6volt batteries if I want solar? Didn't see that as an option either.

I wonder if we want the 1500W inverter after all. For $480 it will allow me to run the microwave when no hookups, but not very well? Probably a toaster oven would need the inverter as well, but not a coffee maker for us. We make aeropress coffee so no power needed for that. And then when the inverter allows those appliances to run, I'm guessing it draws a lot from the battery. If so we might be better off to learn to live without them when no hookups. Even if we have the 1500w inverter we still can't have AC. Maybe we just plan accordingly.

I'm beginning to learn that trailering is all about conserving - water, energy, space etc. Live smaller and simpler!

Thanks again for the input. It's all much clearer now.
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Old 02-25-2015, 07:53 PM   #10
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No, Jill, I meant can't run A/C. Two six-volts are good. There is an additional charge I think for transfer switch regarding inverter which, as far as I understand, is pretty well needed, although someone might want to comment on that, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill View Post
Thank you for all the very helpful input. I'm sold on the need for the dual batteries and solar as well as the dual water heater. I don't remember seeing the dual water heater as an option but will ask. Floating Cloud are you also saying I should get more than the dual 6volt batteries if I want solar? Didn't see that as an option either.

I wonder if we want the 1500W inverter after all. For $480 it will allow me to run the microwave when no hookups, but not very well? Probably a toaster oven would need the inverter as well, but not a coffee maker for us. We make aeropress coffee so no power needed for that. And then when the inverter allows those appliances to run, I'm guessing it draws a lot from the battery. If so we might be better off to learn to live without them when no hookups. Even if we have the 1500w inverter we still can't have AC. Maybe we just plan accordingly.

I'm beginning to learn that trailering is all about conserving - water, energy, space etc. Live smaller and simpler!

Thanks again for the input. It's all much clearer now.
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Old 02-25-2015, 08:10 PM   #11
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Jill, it's easier if you boil it down to basics. The question to ask is do you want to use an ac outlet when boondocking? If no, no need for an inverter. If yes, get one.

As for the Air Conditioner, the inverter doesn't output enough wattage to run it. Its a hookup only thing. The solar offered on an Escape doesn't change that.

Solar allows you to keep your batteries up when boondocking, and IF you have enough solar and enough battery capacity to store the power it produces, you can go unhooked indefinitely without running out of power. The single 160w panel and dual 6v batteries we got will be adequate for extended boondocking, provided we don't try to run appliances all the time.

The Microwave that ETI installs is a 1000 watt, so a 1500 watt inverter will run it just fine.

Cheers,

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Old 02-25-2015, 09:16 PM   #12
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Ok; my $.02 worth: had dual 6V on 17B w/no solar and then solar/inverter with single 12V with the 21. The 17B was good for maybe 4 days max before needing a charge. The 21 battery is never below 2/3 charge w/solar.

In CA and other sunny states a single Group 29 12V($75 upgrade) w/solar will be fabulous, irrespective of whether you want to run your AC on it(which is impossible). However, if you would rather not have the drone of a "GenSet" (noisy stinky generator) BUT want to run an appliance or two(like a VitaMix) then by all means get the solar/inverter- but save $175 and pass on the dual 6V batteries. We've been out in the 21 a LOT since 9/17 and there is no issue with battery charge.
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Old 02-25-2015, 09:26 PM   #13
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Ross, do you have an inverter?

We have been to campgrounds where we are in deep wooded areas and I wonder if a solar panel would get a thing. That's the little problem with fiberglass --- you need to be out of the sun as far as UV but you need to be in the sun for solar.
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Old 02-25-2015, 09:31 PM   #14
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Hi Wally- I do have the 1500W inverter plus transfer switch. The thing is- I almost bought a 40W portable solar panel for the 17B....there is a thread that posts how one can hook up a simple Bargman type plug- and it only takes 4 hours to charge dual 6V batteries. So its not all or nothing; you're going to get good charging while driving down the highway(at least) unlike your vehicle can provide.
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Old 02-25-2015, 09:36 PM   #15
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Hi Wally- I do have the 1500W inverter plus transfer switch. The thing is- I almost bought a 40W portable solar panel for the 17B....there is a thread that posts how one can hook up a simple Bargman type plug- and it only takes 4 hours to charge dual 6V batteries. So its not all or nothing; you're going to get good charging while driving down the highway(at least) unlike your vehicle can provide.
Good points. Also, you will still get some charging even in the shade, although its quite reduced. The cells are photovoltaic, which means they react to the light. More light (direct sun) more power. As for UV protecting the trailer, try 303. Can't do much about the heat from being in the direct sun though.
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Old 02-25-2015, 10:05 PM   #16
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Given that technology changes so quickly, there's a good chance that solar power technology could some day soon be sufficient to power the air conditioner right? And if that's the case we would want the inverter. I think we will get it for now, because "we" are not handy enough to add something like that later.

Thank you for the input on the dual batteries Ross, but we'll probably still get them. I know we want to do a lot of off season camping, and with our drought parched climate now, the thought of days in the Pacific North Wet with rain and no sun sounds delightful!

Looks like ours will be a full build. It sure is hard to eliminate options when you don't have an established pattern for how you will camp.
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Old 02-25-2015, 10:35 PM   #17
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Hi Jill- rain does sound good! March Miracle?
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Old 02-25-2015, 10:36 PM   #18
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If u are running a 120v television then u will need the inverter if dry camping.

ken
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Old 02-25-2015, 10:40 PM   #19
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Hi Jill- rain does sound good! March Miracle?
Let's hope so - it's our last chance of the season I think!
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Old 02-25-2015, 10:42 PM   #20
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If u are running a 120v television then u will need the inverter if dry camping.

ken
We were thinking of getting the TV ready option but try watching TV from our laptop first. Laptops run on 12V for recharging right? What if we plug in a better monitor - do you know if that would be 12V or 120?
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