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Old 04-10-2017, 09:45 AM   #1
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Safety of Propane on while traveling?

Is it safe to have the propane running the fridge while traveling? What if the flame goes out?
What if you're in an accident?
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:58 AM   #2
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Is it safe to have the propane running the fridge while traveling? What if the flame goes out?
What if you're in an accident?
If you look back here and on FGRV you will find this has been discussed ad naseum. The final verdict is that there are a bunch of points of view, and nobody is changing the mind of those who have made theirs up (mine included ).

I usually have mine on all the time, other than places like tunnels and ferries that require it shut off.

If a flame goes out, the gas valve to the appliance shuts off. It is pretty much only fridges that folks operate on the go, and the odd time the the furnace.

I checked with the Federal and all Provincial Departments of Transport, and it is fully legal in all jurisdictions to have it on while in motion.

If you are in an accident, I think you would have bigger things to worry about. Fast discharge from a propane tank will cause the valve to close. Fuel leaks on your tow vehicle would be more of a worry.

Anyway, be prepared for lots of controversy which usually is part of this topic of discussion.
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:29 AM   #3
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Propane

Hi Jim/
Good summary of past forum activity. I too tow with the propane refrigerator on. Once in a great while my fridge will blow out and when I stop I hear it clicking and it restarts. I have a remote sensor with a readout in the tow vehicle so I know if I'm starting to warm up. Time to stop anyway.
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:34 AM   #4
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Dave,
I thought when you got warmed up, you started drinking.....
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:49 AM   #5
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Hi Jim
My mother, who wasn't much of a drinker used to observe that alcohol must
Indeed be something magical as it was consumed to keep you cool in the summer and warm in the winter. I've been a lifetime testing that theory. But not while driving (anymore). Propane to keep things cold or heat things up. Can't be the only thing on Earth that works that way can it?
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:55 AM   #6
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Hi Jim
My mother, who wasn't much of a drinker used to observe that alcohol must
Indeed be something magical as it was consumed to keep you cool in the summer and warm in the winter. I've been a lifetime testing that theory. But not while driving (anymore). Propane to keep things cold or heat things up. Can't be the only thing on Earth that works that way can it?
Dave
Yes, but how does alcohol or propane know the difference?
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Old 04-10-2017, 11:07 AM   #7
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... Fuel leaks on your tow vehicle would be more of a worry.

Anyway, be prepared for lots of controversy which usually is part of this topic of discussion.
I remember decades ago when hydrogen powered cars were being tested and Mercedes has some hydrogen powered buses they were testing. Very promising in that the only thing that would be emitted in any quantity was water. Some people were very concerned about the hydrogen being "explosive" Somewhere I read a comparison of how much more dangerous gasoline fumes were than hydrogen gas, and the same applies to LP. Mythbusters did some fun episodes determining what it actually to make an LP explosion.
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Old 04-10-2017, 12:37 PM   #8
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Hi Jim/
Good summary of past forum activity. I too tow with the propane refrigerator on. Once in a great while my fridge will blow out and when I stop I hear it clicking and it restarts. I have a remote sensor with a readout in the tow vehicle so I know if I'm starting to warm up. Time to stop anyway.
Dave
Hi: Iowa Dave... I'm still amazed that something that heats up by propane can cool something down!!! The piece of hammock style furnace filter twist tied to the lower fridge vent keeps ours alight.
As for battery charging that's a whole nother matter. If I can feel my pacemaker battery clicking I'm outa luck!!! When asked by my Urologist how they charge it I told him "Its up to my wife to charge it"!!! Alf
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Old 04-10-2017, 03:53 PM   #9
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If you get into an accident, and the propane tanks fly forwards severing the high pressure lines, and something else is on fire from the accident, would you want to have this going on inside your vehicle:



Sure, the probabilities are low, as they are with driving in general. Gasoline fires aren't pretty either, but society has collectively decided that the benefits of driving outweigh the risks. You'll have to make a similar choice regarding propane use and the fridge. I'll go with 12 volt whenever possible myself, and consider propane in limited cases.
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Old 04-10-2017, 04:23 PM   #10
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If you get into an accident, and the propane tanks fly forwards severing the high pressure lines, and something else is on fire from the accident, would you want to have this going on inside your vehicle:



Sure, the probabilities are low, as they are with driving in general. Gasoline fires aren't pretty either, but society has collectively decided that the benefits of driving outweigh the risks. You'll have to make a similar choice regarding propane use and the fridge. I'll go with 12 volt whenever possible myself, and consider propane in limited cases.
Since the propane tank(s) are bolted done, and in many cases in an enclosed carrier (5.0/5.0TA a compartment; bumper pulls in the optional front storage box), it will take one heck of an accident to have the tanks displaced to a point that the high pressure lines are severed. If an accident is that catastrophic, you may be lucky to survive. And given the fact that the 12 volt demand of a Dometic refrigerator will quickly drain a battery/batteries that are not being concurrently recharged, I, like Jim, will continue to run on propane when traveling. Obviously, the decision is a personal one, but a 12 v short can also start a fire. I personally consider the risk of using propane on the go just slightly greater than running into a rhinoceros on any highway in North America. And I have seen batteries discharged to the point that recovery is impossible. I think that is a far greater likelihood than a propane fueled fire.
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Old 04-10-2017, 04:50 PM   #11
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Since the propane tank(s) are bolted done, and in many cases in an enclosed carrier (5.0/5.0TA a compartment; bumper pulls in the optional front storage box), it will take one heck of an accident to have the tanks displaced to a point that the high pressure lines are severed.
They are bolted down, but not at the bottom. If I remember correctly, on the 17b at least, there is a long skinny rod to the top, which would apply an enormous lever arm force at the top during a collision. Obviously, I haven't tried this experiment, but I would question whether or not this long rod can withstand the violent sideways forces involved in a 50-60 mph collision. The rod appears to have been designed to hold normal vertical up/down driving forces, not sideways violent ones.

Even without that, sideways impacts at traffic lights and stop signs are another category of collision that is common relative to forward impact collisions. I'm pretty sure a direct impact could sever something in that area.

I agree though that this kind of risk is far less than the risk of driving in general. Maybe a tad higher than a rhinoceros collision though.
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Old 04-10-2017, 05:01 PM   #12
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They are bolted down, but not at the bottom. If I remember correctly, on the 17b at least, there is a long skinny rod to the top, which would apply an enormous lever arm force at the top during a collision. Obviously, I haven't tried this experiment, but I would question whether or not this long rod can withstand the violent sideways forces involved in a 50-60 mph collision. The rod appears to have been designed to hold normal vertical up/down driving forces, not sideways violent ones.

Even without that, sideways impacts at traffic lights and stop signs are another category of collision that is common relative to forward impact collisions. I'm pretty sure a direct impact could sever something in that area.

I agree though that this kind of risk is far less than the risk of driving in general. Maybe a tad higher than a rhinoceros collision though.
The base plate for the tanks is attached to the trailer frame with steel screws. The "Skinny" rod is actually a 3/8" threaded rod that sandwiches the tanks between an upper slotted steel bar and the base plate, basically forming a single unit attached to the frame. Shear forces are pretty effectively transmitted to the frame.
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Old 04-10-2017, 05:25 PM   #13
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The base plate for the tanks is attached to the trailer frame with steel screws. The "Skinny" rod is actually a 3/8" threaded rod that sandwiches the tanks between an upper slotted steel bar and the base plate, basically forming a single unit attached to the frame. Shear forces are pretty effectively transmitted to the frame.
I hear what you are saying, and it's very possible you are right that this assembly could withstand those forces, but I don't have the ability to calculate it or estimate it from experience. To me, that warrants caution, unless the manufacturer tells me it's ok.

I would guess the failure point, at whatever maximum force this can withstand, would be the threads rather than the rod itself, or alternatively the metal piece that holds the tanks down from the top.
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Old 04-10-2017, 05:27 PM   #14
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...or the weight of the rhinoceros?
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Old 04-10-2017, 05:28 PM   #15
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Suggest the tank valves be disconnected and opened prior to travel and when empty, shift to park.
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Old 04-10-2017, 06:07 PM   #16
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Almost everything we do has an inherent risk of danger, we just have to decide whether to accept it or not. So many things we regularly do are much of a higher risk factor than something ever happening to your propane tank which if released from it's restraints due to an accident. that at least for me is not even considered to be a risk in the least. We could not move if we were to worry about every potential risk we take.

Besides, if the force from an accident was enough to ever cause the propane tank to break loose, probably get pierced when it hits something anyway.

My preference is to live life, not worry about how it ends. But, we must each do what works best for us, and even if you do wish to turn your tanks off while in motion, there is nothing wrong with doing so.
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Old 04-10-2017, 06:13 PM   #17
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The Escape manual states to turn off the propane tank when in motion. I am a scaredy cat when it comes to things like flames and propane so for me, it is an easy solution: Let the battery do the work. If we stop for long periods of time, then the propane goes on for that duration.

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Old 04-10-2017, 06:15 PM   #18
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If you get into an accident, and the propane tanks fly forwards severing the high pressure lines, and something else is on fire from the accident, would you want to have this going on inside your vehicle...
No, and I assume that neither would anyone else. That's why modern (as in made in this century) high pressure propane hoses (or "pigtails") use a connector on the tank end which incorporates an excess flow valve: if the hose is ripped apart, the momentary high flow rate of propane trips this valve nearly closed, so only a very small rate of flow continues.

This is the valve which Jim mentioned in post #2. It is also the source of annoyance when the tank valve is suddenly opened into an RV plumbing system which is not already up to operating pressure, because the momentary flow surge trips the excess flow valve.
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Old 04-10-2017, 06:26 PM   #19
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The Escape manual states to turn off the propane tank when in motion. I am a scaredy cat when it comes to things like flames and propane so for me, it is an easy solution: Let the battery do the work. If we stop for long periods of time, then the propane goes on for that duration.

Lorna
And when you buy coffee at McDonalds, the cup has a waning on the side which states that coffee, which is best brewed at temperatures slightly below boiling, is extremely hot. Millions of people consume hot coffee daily with no problem so you have to ask yourself, why does McDonalds include this warning. Of course, if you follow the news then you already know the answer, and it has something to do with what a certain profession does best, and that is inventing a problem which in reality is not a problem. So you have to ask yourself another question and that is why would ETI include a statement in the manual telling you to turn of the propane tank(s) when in motion. I wouldn't be surprised if Reace himself runs the refrigerator on propane when traveling. But let's get to a more important issue. How many here have been brazen enough to cut the little tag off your mattress or pillow that States "do not remove under penalty of law?
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Old 04-10-2017, 06:27 PM   #20
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Few days ago, a woman sat in her car, in her driveway, with a child in the back seat, while her other daughter ran into the house to get something.
Tree fell on the car.
Luckily all three are fine, and nobody is suggesting that trees be cut down.
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