Help With Battery Decision

[thoer]

Originally Posted by fudge_brownie

I was not able to upload the file to the files sections, not sure of the reason. Pick one:

• It does not like me
• I ate something with a hole in it for breakfast
• It's broke
• I do not have permission
• The name has spaces in it
• The file size is 2 MB, several photos included

Paul - thanks very much for your work on the solar panel instructions - they are very well done and informative.

A question, with running the panel thru the 7 pin and into the trailer, doesn't the trailer's built in charging system regulate the charge? - so that the solar charge controller should not be needed? Or does the 7 pin input bypass the internal system and go directly to the battery? In that case, what prevents overcharge when we do long drives towing - the tow vehicle's voltage regulator? Is the built in charging system only in the circuit when plugged into AC?

Thanks again!

[fudge_brownie]

Eric,
From my understanding you can have multiple chargers at work on your batteries. The rooftop mounted solar units are charging while going down the highway, simultaneously the vehicle charging system is charging the battery (s). So a solar unit, whether portable or permanent will continue to charge while plugged to shore power. Pretty uncommon to have all three going at once but it could be done.

The solar charger on the solar panel does bypass the built in Escape charger and goes direct to the battery. This charger is reducing the solar output of approximately 32 volts to a variable rate of around 13.4 volts. So it reduces the charge and operates as a battery charger at the same time.

I was worried about voltage loss by using the 7 pin Bargman connector and the related wiring. The run of about 8 feet could cause some loss. I experimented with connecting solar directly to the battery and could not definitively state it was better. It is much more convenient to use the trailer side Bargman 7 pin. Perhaps if I had better measuring instruments I would detect power loss.

I would guess the voltage regulator on the vehicle is limiting the charge going to the Escape, after all it is also charging the vehicle battery. Here the long runs from alternator to Escape battery and the gauge of the wire come into play. I believe unless you pay unusual attention to the wire gauge you are not getting much down the pipe to the Escape battery.

My take on charging Escape batteries is the tow vehicle is the slowest and least reliable method, shore power is a bit better but the WFCO 8955 is panned on many forums as being unable to get to boost mode, thereby being very slow to charge, short of replacing the WFCO with a Progressive unit I think the solar charger gives me the best results and it is what I used before putting the trailer into storage.

Paul

[Ray N]

Thanks, everyone for the input. There was a lot of good information there.
It looks like the optional 12 volt battery is a definite buy.

I'm still torn between an inexpensive solar option and simply spending more of our time in commercial campsites that supply electricity.

Paul, thanks for the solar plans, if I go solar that looks like how I'll do it. One question, does that Sunguard solar controller guard against over-charging?

Do any of you know if the standard factory installed trailer towing package that comes with a Toyota Tundra, (ours is a 2011), has the heavier wire? The package did say it included a heavy-duty alternator and battery.

I don't think there is any chance of us leaving Florida. We've lived here for 37 years and been retired for six of them - people don't normally retire and move north!

Thanks again,
Ray N

[cpaharley2008]

Once you get your Escape you may find yourself wandering around the country, often without hookups, solar is always there, silently working for you, even while towing. I found with the single group 29 battery I was fully charged every morning, even after using the furnace all night.

[fudge_brownie]

Ray
The Sunguard charger is a three stage charger, what stage you get is dependent on the battery state. This is similar to the WFCO charger that came with my Escape. The stages would be boost on a depleted battery, regular charge and then the equivalent of a trickle charge. The Sunguard automatically switches between the three stages. The answer to your question is Yes, the charger does prevent an overcharge.

There are more expensive chargers from Morningstar Sunguard; this one is sealed and can be exposed to the elements and it is one of their least expensive. For the limited use we are putting it through I thought it fit the bill.

If considering a portable panel I would recommend considering two smaller panels, for example 30 or 45 watt. The advantages are smaller dimensions and then the space they will store. Plus if you hinge them together you are providing some protection to the panel surface. I would hope to be able to store these in the wardrobe.

Paul

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by thoer

... with running the panel thru the 7 pin and into the trailer, doesn't the trailer's built in charging system regulate the charge? - so that the solar charge controller should not be needed?

No.

Originally Posted by thoer

Or does the 7 pin input bypass the internal system and go directly to the battery?

Yes, normally it's that simple.

Originally Posted by thoer

In that case, what prevents overcharge when we do long drives towing - the tow vehicle's voltage regulator? Is the built in charging system only in the circuit when plugged into AC?

Yes and yes.

[Brian B-P]

Originally Posted by cpaharley2008

In addition, if your tug battery goes down, you have a back up with the 12v set up.

I assume that you mean using a set of booster/jumper cables to start the tug; that would work with the pair of 6V batteries as well.

It would only be possible to remove the trailer battery and temporarily install it in the tug if it fit... which depends on the battery size and tug of course but seems unlikely to me for anything larger than a Group 24 battery.

[Jim Bennett]

Originally Posted by thoer

Paul - thanks very much for your work on the solar panel instructions - they are very well done and informative.

A question, with running the panel thru the 7 pin and into the trailer, doesn't the trailer's built in charging system regulate the charge? - so that the solar charge controller should not be needed? Or does the 7 pin input bypass the internal system and go directly to the battery? In that case, what prevents overcharge when we do long drives towing - the tow vehicle's voltage regulator? Is the built in charging system only in the circuit when plugged into AC?

Thanks again!

Brian pretty much covered this. I do use a small charge controller when plugging in through the 7-pin connector.

[thoer]

Originally Posted by Brian B-P

No.


Yes, normally it's that simple.


Yes and yes.

Thanks Brian - that is what I assumed, but I've learned to be careful with my assumptions.......

[Stargeezer]

With thanks to Paul Braun for emailing me a copy of his "Solar Made Easy" article and "lieb" for their referral to CEA Solar, I was able to find a kit that capitalizes on the good ideas of both. Reading Paul's article I thought why would anyone drill additional holes in the trailer if the portable panel could be plugged in directly to the seven pin male trailer connector (simply, plug & play). Then from lieb's referral, the folding panels, storage case and self contained PWM charge controller (matched to the wattage of the panels) makes for a nice complete unit.

However, my challenge was with CEA Solar located in Arizona (long transport, customs, currency exchange, etc.) and no connector to take advantage of Paul's idea, this would still be a bit of an undertaking. Well today, thanks to the power of the internet, I took a telephone and website journey around North America. After about ten telecons, I reached a commercial solar panel distributor on his cell phone as he was working on an Oilsands project in Ft. McMurray, AB. Although he could not help me by offering any of his products (too large), he did refer me to a company based... are you ready for this... some 2 hours south (in Victoria) of where I live. It solved my need and did both Paul & lieb proud. The following is the link to their website... special note... there is a cute video describing their product.

Hope others may find this of some value.

Portable Solar Kits (120, 80 & 40 watts) | GPElectric

[hillary]

Oh cool, that's the kit we bought (80 watt) but when we bought it there were no accessories!! Now I have to find a place to buy the 7pin connector and extension cord for next year

[cpaharley2008]

That is the company Escape uses when installing the optional solar on the roof (which is not hole driven but glued onto the roof) very good solar panels.