21 in National Park Campgrounds & National Forest Campgrounds - Escape Trailer Owners Community
Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×

Go Back   Escape Trailer Owners Community > Escape Me | General Topics > General Escape
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 08-03-2020, 01:07 AM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Vancouver, Washington
Trailer: 2020 Escape 21 NE
Posts: 10
21 in National Park Campgrounds & National Forest Campgrounds

My family of three is heading out on a year long social distancing road trip. We’ve placed the order for a 21NE. However, I’ve recently become a bit concerned that the additional 2 feet of length compared to the 19 is going to put the combined length of our tow vehicle (Ram 1500 Crew Cab Short Box) and 21NE just over the 40 foot maximum that I see floating around the internet for the bulk of National Park and National Forest campsites. We plan to do a fair amount of light boondocking (i.e., less developed sites without hookups - not so much all out BLM-type boondocking). Our tow vehicle plus 21NE combined length will be 40 feet 9 inches. Does anyone have experience with a similar combined length tow vehicle trailer combo in National Park and National Forest campgrounds? Hoping that experience is positive. I’ve got a message out to Joldie at Escape to see if switching our order out to the 19 is still even an option or if the trailer has already started production. Another wrinkle is that we’re having BattleBorn LiFePO4 batteries installed in the 21, and wonder if those would even be installable by Escape inside a 19, since it looks like the batteries are usually outdoors on the 19? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Maybe I’m just getting unnecessarily nervous about those 9 inches over 40 feet length? Thanks in advance!
Dustin Richardson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 05:21 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Bill and Earline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Signal Mountain (Chattanooga), Tennessee
Trailer: Escape 21 November 2014; 2022 GMC 1500 3.0L
Posts: 681
Dustin,

We have towed our combination, which is about the same overall length into Corps of Engineers, Bureau of Land Management, state parks, county parks, state forests, National Forests, and most of the more well known National Parks in most of the states and provinces--even the Yukon, and have never run into an issue with a 40 foot limit.

My guess is that what you are seeing is meant for a single unit (big bus) that is over 40 feet due to turning radius or inability to unhitch and park along-side. The turning radius with the trailer is pretty much the same as the tow vehicle unhitched as long as you keep an eye on the trailer tires during a turn. The well publicized hair pin turn at Chisos Basin at Big Bend National Park, for example, was no problem.

See what others say, but I think you'll be fine with the 21.

Bill
Bill and Earline is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 05:28 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Mike Lewis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Santa Rosa County, Florida
Trailer: 2014 Escape 21 Tow: 2024 Toyota Tundra
Posts: 3,097
When you arrive at a campsite you can unhitch then move your truck in at an angle so that the overall length is less than forty feet. I have camped at many national parks and have run into problems related to this only once, at Kalaloch Campground in Olympic National Park. There I found it impossible to keep my trailer and truck on the pad in the campsite, and I had to move. If necessary, you can always unhitch your trailer and park your truck in the campground's parking lot. I didn't want to do this at Kalaloch so I left.

The overall length of my 21 Classic and Toyota Tacoma is 39 feet, one inch. I know this because the Washington State Ferry people measured it. If the combination had been over forty feet I would have had to pay a higher fare to get on the ferry. So you'll get dinged there.

Personally I would not change my order from a 21 to a 19 over this issue. Others may have a different opinion.
__________________
Mike Lewis
She don't lie, she don't lie, she don't lie-- propane
Photos and travelogues here: mikelewisimages.com
Mike Lewis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 06:19 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Southwick, Massachusetts
Trailer: None, sold my 2014 5.0TA
Posts: 7,124
I believe the only time you might have an issue is if the TV is hanging out in the road. As mentioned, you can usually park the TV at a bit of an angle to make it fit. The hard part is getting a 40' site.

Get the 21.
__________________
Happy Motoring
Bob
padlin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 07:29 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: North of Danbury, Wisconsin
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21C
Posts: 3,033
We’ve run into this problem at Federal Campgrounds on several occasions towing our 17 ft Casita with our 2014 Ram truck . The front of our truck stuck out in the road waiting to be hit so we unhooked the trailer and parked our vehicle in the overflow lot ( Out of sight and a two block walk)
These campsites were listed at 37 ft which should have been enough for a 17 ft trailer and a 19 ft vehicle but !
I wish campgrounds were more consistent with how they measure campsites . It seems some make allowances for a full size tow vehicles and some don’t .

PS ; We’ve only ran into this issue in older campgrounds in the Southern US *
steve dunham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 07:33 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
TTMartin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Venice, Florida
Trailer: 2020 Escape 19
Posts: 1,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustin Richardson View Post
My family of three is heading out on a year long social distancing road trip. We’ve placed the order for a 21NE. However, I’ve recently become a bit concerned that the additional 2 feet of length compared to the 19 is going to put the combined length of our tow vehicle (Ram 1500 Crew Cab Short Box) and 21NE just over the 40 foot maximum that I see floating around the internet for the bulk of National Park and National Forest campsites. We plan to do a fair amount of light boondocking (i.e., less developed sites without hookups - not so much all out BLM-type boondocking). Our tow vehicle plus 21NE combined length will be 40 feet 9 inches. Does anyone have experience with a similar combined length tow vehicle trailer combo in National Park and National Forest campgrounds? Hoping that experience is positive. I’ve got a message out to Joldie at Escape to see if switching our order out to the 19 is still even an option or if the trailer has already started production. Another wrinkle is that we’re having BattleBorn LiFePO4 batteries installed in the 21, and wonder if those would even be installable by Escape inside a 19, since it looks like the batteries are usually outdoors on the 19? Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Maybe I’m just getting unnecessarily nervous about those 9 inches over 40 feet length? Thanks in advance!
Why not the 5.0 TA? It's overall length is a little shorter than the 19 when attached to the vehicle, I believe.
TTMartin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 07:33 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
HarleyD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Lakewood, Colorado
Trailer: 2018 5.0TA 'Liberty'
Posts: 250
Change to a 5.0TA, they are shorter overall.
__________________
HarleyD
2018 5.0TA--2016 F150 3.5EB 4X4
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." -- Jimmy Hendrix
HarleyD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 08:05 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
JStelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Friendswood, Texas
Trailer: 2015 Escape 19' (sold), Escape 5.0 as of August 2019 (sold)
Posts: 664
I wouldn’t worry about the extra 9 inches and stay with the 21. I’ve never had a problem with smaller sites (parking at an angle unhitched or adjacent to the trailer works). I’ve seen many cases of much larger rigs squeezing into small sites that probably should have been prohibited.
JStelly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 08:18 AM   #9
Member
 
canakiwi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Grand Forks, British Columbia
Trailer: 2018 Escape 21 & 2014 RAM EcoDiesel
Posts: 81
I have a 21C and the same RAM tow. At a few national parks, chiricahua, giant sequoia, have had to unhook the truck to fit in the site, but only once have i had to park away from the site and walk, which was not a problem really.
__________________
Kevin & Sharon
canakiwi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 10:36 AM   #10
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Vancouver, Washington
Trailer: 2020 Escape 21 NE
Posts: 10
Great to know! Thank you.
Dustin Richardson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 10:37 AM   #11
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Vancouver, Washington
Trailer: 2020 Escape 21 NE
Posts: 10
Thank you all for these very helpful responses! It's making me so much more comfortable with our 21 decision. As for the 5.0, I agree it looks like a great option (in some ways better), but we want to keep access to our truck's full bed and my wife doesn't particularly like the idea of sleeping on a different level. The 19 looked great too - we were just concerned about the narrowness for getting past one another, in particular, on a likely year-long trip.
Dustin Richardson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 11:10 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
sherminator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tigard, Oregon
Trailer: 2020 21NE - dual dinettes
Posts: 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustin Richardson View Post
Maybe I’m just getting unnecessarily nervous about those 9 inches over 40 feet length?
I am also getting a 21NE, and towing it with an F150 SuperCrew shortbed. We will be at about the same length - 40'6". The extra 6" will be painful in the event of a ferry crossing, but that is something we seldom do. I am not going to worry about campsites - I camp regularly with a guy who pulls a 28ft trailer behind a SuperCab with an 8' bed, and we can always find a campsite to accommodate him. (We usually camp in Forest Service campgrounds here in the PNW.)

One suggestion I will make - which I copied from others here - is to have Escape omit the number 21 from the front of the trailer. Many stickies that are called 21 foot trailers are actually longer - they do not include the length of the hitch. The 21NE is a true 21 foot (+2") trailer from hitch to bumper. Don't advertise your length and you may have to answer fewer questions. The ferry operators and other officials it is important to will measure anyways.
sherminator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 01:01 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
alanmalk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Arvada, Colorado
Trailer: 2015 E'21 - 'Velocity'. Tow: Toyota Tacoma V6, 4X4, manual.
Posts: 1,685
This is the road up to the Chisos Basin in Big Bend National Park - possibly the most desirable camping in the Park. The sign in this photo reads:
Trailers over 20' and RV's over 24' are not recommended due to narrow, winding road to the Basin and small campsites at this campground.

I, and and a number of owners of the E'21 have made the drive with no issues. The Park is concerned that you make the hairpin turns without crossing the yellow line. If you are comfortable with narrow & steep mountain roads this will be possible. The other concern is the campsites are small. You will likely have to detach the trailer and park your truck in the amphitheater parking lot which is 500 feet away. Again, no big problem if you are mobile enough to walk around the Park.

Now, if you attempt this in a 35' class A motor-home, be prepared for a whopping traffic ticket.

--
Alan
Attached Thumbnails
Trailer Limits.png  
alanmalk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 01:24 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
TTMartin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Venice, Florida
Trailer: 2020 Escape 19
Posts: 1,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanmalk View Post
This is the road up to the Chisos Basin in Big Bend National Park - possibly the most desirable camping in the Park. The sign in this photo reads:
Trailers over 20' and RV's over 24' are not recommended due to narrow, winding road to the Basin and small campsites at this campground.

I, and and a number of owners of the E'21 have made the drive with no issues. The Park is concerned that you make the hairpin turns without crossing the yellow line. If you are comfortable with narrow & steep mountain roads this will be possible. The other concern is the campsites are small. You will likely have to detach the trailer and park your truck in the amphitheater parking lot which is 500 feet away. Again, no big problem if you are mobile enough to walk around the Park.

Now, if you attempt this in a 35' class A motor-home, be prepared for a whopping traffic ticket.

--
Alan
And if you're involved in an accident expect to get a citation regardless of who was at fault.

Vehicle Length Limits & Advisories

Because roads in these parks are narrow, winding, and steep, longer vehicles often cross the double yellow line and pose a danger to other drivers. Because of this, advisories are in place on some park roads. Drivers will be held responsible for any hazardous conditions caused by their actions.
TTMartin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 02:10 PM   #15
Bea
Senior Member
 
Bea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Northern California, California
Trailer: 2019 Escape 21
Posts: 759
We second the option of sticking with the 21... if that's the layout you like best. We love National Parks and we've been able to squeeze and back our 21 way back into some pretty small sites because the back end of our trailer is high enough to go over rocks, logs or those traditional railroad ties that mark the sites. As long as your wheels are on the pad, and your TV is parked sideways, off the road so cars can pass, rangers are happy. -Bea
Bea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 05:28 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Olympia wa, Washington
Trailer: 5.0TA 2017
Posts: 2,255
last year i parked in a national camp ground and had
difficulty getting my 5.0 in but i finally got it in. unhitch and parked the truck at an angle next to the trailer.
Fox hunt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 05:40 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: SLO County, California
Trailer: 2014 Escape 21C 2019 Expedition
Posts: 5,210
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherminator View Post
.....One suggestion I will make - which I copied from others here - is to have Escape omit the number 21 from the front of the trailer. Many stickies that are called 21 foot trailers are actually longer - they do not include the length of the hitch
Yep, when asked from someone in a kiosk, etc. we tell them it's 18 feet- that's the length of the box.
__________________
"We gotta get as far away as we can!"
- Russell Casse, Independence Day
Rossue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 06:20 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
sherminator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tigard, Oregon
Trailer: 2020 21NE - dual dinettes
Posts: 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bea View Post
As long as your wheels are on the pad, and your TV is parked sideways, off the road so cars can pass, rangers are happy.
The only time I have ever had trouble was when we had a campground host who insisted that no tires touch dirt anywhere in any site. We had plenty of room to park our truck across the front of the site, but the tires touched dirt, and the host was not having any of that. We managed to comply, but that host sure spent a lot of time arguing with campers that weekend.
sherminator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2020, 06:49 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
arniesea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Bremerton, Washington
Trailer: 2019 5.0 TA
Posts: 1,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Lewis View Post

The overall length of my 21 Classic and Toyota Tacoma is 39 feet, one inch. I know this because the Washington State Ferry people measured it. If the combination had been over forty feet I would have had to pay a higher fare to get on the ferry. So you'll get dinged there.
This was one of the reasons we went with a 5.0. We live on the west side of Puget Sound from Seattle, an hour ferry ride. The overall length of our Tundra + the 5.0 is about the same (38') as our prior rig; a 2013 E19 + Tacoma. That extra charge on the ferry really adds up if one lives here!
__________________
- Arnie & Paula & Kizzy the rat terrier
https://www.arniesea.com
- 2019 5.0 TA, 2017 Tundra Platinum.
- Bremerton, WA
arniesea is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Escape Trailer Industries or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 2023 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.