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Old 12-20-2019, 08:47 PM   #61
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Tundra payload

Since this thread started with a question about a Tundra, I Googled, "how does Toyota calculate payload" and got the following from a footnote on a Toyota site:

"The maximum you can haul (payload) depends on base curb weight plus the total weight of any cargo. occupants and ... additional standard/optional equipment and accessories added by the manufacturer, dealers, and/or vehicle owners."

To me, this means all occupants, all stuff, and the pin/tongue weight.

Towing (pulling) ability may or may not include a driver or a passengers, but that's rarely a concern with an Escape.

I am painfully aware of the door jamb sticker for payload, since mine on my fully optioned Ram is a pitiful 961 pounds, if you can believe that. As a result, all bottled water or other beverages get to ride in the trailer and I'm on a diet.

Payload is any additional weight on your tow vehicle's four tires, no matter the source.

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Old 12-20-2019, 08:57 PM   #62
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I LOVE my 2014 Ford F-150. But gosh after reading UncleTim's post, I should probably sell my 1953 Ford F-100... because it won't last.
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Old 12-20-2019, 09:01 PM   #63
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I LOVE my 2014 Ford F-150. But gosh after reading UncleTim's post, I should probably sell my 1953 Ford F-100... because it won't last.
Yep! Get rid of that lemon!
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Old 12-20-2019, 09:06 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by Bill and Earline View Post
Since this thread started with a question about a Tundra, I Googled, "how does Toyota calculate payload" and got the following from a footnote on a Toyota site:

"The maximum you can haul (payload) depends on base curb weight plus the total weight of any cargo. occupants and ... additional standard/optional equipment and accessories added by the manufacturer, dealers, and/or vehicle owners."

To me, this means all occupants, all stuff, and the pin/tongue weight.

Towing (pulling) ability may or may not include a driver or a passengers, but that's rarely a concern with an Escape.

I am painfully aware of the door jamb sticker for payload, since mine on my fully optioned Ram is a pitiful 961 pounds, if you can believe that. As a result, all bottled water or other beverages get to ride in the trailer and I'm on a diet.

Payload is any additional weight on your tow vehicle's four tires, no matter the source.

Bill
Hi: Bill and Earline... I heartly recommend the "Kirkland Dog food diet", but SlimFast and light beer is easier to carry. Alf
BTW Merry Christmas to you and yours!!!
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Old 12-20-2019, 09:11 PM   #65
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Back at cha, diesel dragon.

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Old 12-20-2019, 10:01 PM   #66
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I'm not going to weigh in on the reliability of F150s as I've never owned one. But I will say, when I was planning to buy a 5.0TA and trying to decide on the right truck, at the time (2017) the F150 was the only truck on the market that was rated to tow a 5th wheel. There was quite a discussion about this on this forum, and whether this was something one should be concerned about or not. I thought that it was, based on what I knew at the time. And so do a lot of folks, which is why you're seeing them recommending a F-150 as the ideal tow for a 5.0TA.

While I ultimately decided against buying a F150 and a 5.0TA, what was most important to me was buying a truck with plenty of capacity to tow the trailer I eventually bought, so I wouldn't have to worry about things like whether the black and gray tanks were full, how I loaded my stuff into the trailer, and if I had enough capacity to bring my fishing pontoon. I already had enough to worry about.

The other thing I noticed was most people have very strong opinions about their tow vehicle, especially if it's a pickup, and will sing its praises no matter what. Not everyone mind you, but most. "I've towed my trailer XX,XXX miles with my XYZ truck and never had a problem, it tows great, I don't even know the trailer is back there". Etc. So therefore we should take this bit of anecdotal evidence and assume everything is OK, without bothering to check if the real life trailer specs are within the capability the truck is rated for. Ummm, that is not what I would recommend to anyone. I'm not about to ignore the words: "Combined weight of occupants and cargo should NEVER exceed X,XXX", and I don't think anyone else should either.

So for towing a 5.0TA with a Tundra with limited payload, or any vehicle for that matter, for sure you need to know the pin weight of your trailer when it's loaded for travel, and understand while air bags will level everything out, they will not increase the truck's payload, and their weight will actually count against it. The hitch will count against it as well. Having a full freshwater tank will lighten the pin, but full black and gray tanks will make it heavier. And in all cases the weight on the pin needs to be 15 - 20% of the gross weight of the trailer. So knowing the pin weight, or estimating on the high end, is essential.

There are numerous discussions about this topic in past threads on this forum, and it would be a good idea to take a look at them. They nearly all start out with something like "I want to buy a XXX truck, is this enough to pull a 5.0TA??". Lots of good information on how to manage this situation. Installing an Anderson hitch is a great start.

My friend, by the way, bought a 2018 Tundra and loves it. He did, however, have to give up on the idea of putting a light pickup camper on it, after he figured out its payload limitations. It would be great if Toyota would get on the stick and beef up their trucks' payload, in both the Tundra and Tacoma. And improve their fuel efficiency. Reliability aside, Ford, Chevy, and Dodge appear to be leading the way in their 1/2 ton lineups.

Anyway, if you can make the numbers work, I have little doubt you'll love your combination and will travel safely and with confidence. I'm betting you'll not be on here in a year telling us all you decided to sell your Tundra! Quite the opposite, I expect
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Old 12-20-2019, 10:07 PM   #67
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Whoops, F150s were the only HALF TON truck rated to tow a fifth wheel!
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Old 12-20-2019, 10:50 PM   #68
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There should be an intervention for those who think the rules of safe towing dont apply to them. Seems pretty arrogant actually.
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Old 12-20-2019, 11:02 PM   #69
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There should be an intervention for those who think the rules of safe towing dont apply to them. Seems pretty arrogant actually.

We should impeach them.
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Old 12-20-2019, 11:19 PM   #70
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Old 12-21-2019, 05:17 AM   #71
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Love my F150. Have loved each and every F150 I've owned, and every F150 owner I've ever met, from Jim to Donna to Reace along with many local friends, love their F150 too. There is a reason it's been the best selling truck in America for more than 4 decades. But feel free to contradict with anecdotes.
Do they treat the roads where you are? At 5 years mine started to show rust above the passenger side rear wheel. Other then that I'm at just under 100k, just 1 wheel bearing so far. The EcoBoost that everyone was afraid of in 2012 has worked out great.

Hope I didn't just jinx myself.
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Old 12-21-2019, 06:39 AM   #72
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You will be fine pulling this 5.0 with a Tundra. People are out there pulling them with even mid sized V6 trucks with no issues. You are not exactly latching on to the Queen Mary you know. A little common sense goes a long way even in today's world.
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Old 12-21-2019, 07:04 AM   #73
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I LOVE my 2014 Ford F-150. But gosh after reading UncleTim's post, I should probably sell my 1953 Ford F-100... because it won't last.
😂🤣😂
Was Toyota even a company when your F100 was built🤔
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Old 12-21-2019, 07:15 AM   #74
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About the 30's they were building at least trucks. In 1953 they were building this SG model.



Here is a 1953 Ford F100. Everyone loves trucks . Both were workhorses.

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Old 12-21-2019, 07:24 AM   #75
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Here is a 1953 Ford F100. Everyone loves trucks . Both were workhorses.

Ahhhh, that's a 1955. Or at least the grill is. 1953-1955 are the slant cabs and from a distance the only way to tell the difference between the years is by the grill.
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Old 12-21-2019, 07:29 AM   #76
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... If anyone with a gen2 5.0TA has measured it, that might help the original poster. ...
Thank you Jon for posting Frederick's data and thank you Ronn and MikeS for posting your pin weights. Very helpful.

If you have lots of payload margin, you can ignore the rest of this post. But if you don't, tank contents do affect your pin or tongue weight.

I have tongue weights from our 2014 19 with various tank contents:
360lb, full fresh water, empty gray, empty black
420lb, empty fresh water, empty gray, empty black
420lb, 1/3 fresh water, 1/3 gray, 1/3 black
The fresh water tank was 20 gallons, smaller than current models.

I suspect the pin weight variance on the 5.0TA is more than our 2014 19, as the pin carries more weight than the tongue plus the fresh tank is larger. It's probably over 100 pounds between empty and full fresh water. MikeS's data appears to support this. Again, if anyone has actual pin weights with known tank levels, particularly non-empty gray, that's helpful.

It's useful to know that equal amounts in fresh and gray didn't change the tongue weight. This is expected, as the fresh tank is behind the axles and gray tank in front of the axles, so they balance. The biggest difference would be between full fresh/empty gray and empty fresh/full gray.

If you always dump before traveling, the pin or tongue weight won't be more than everything empty, which is also useful to know. Since we sometimes stay at places with no dump or even no water, we need more payload margin.

All this to say, if you have little payload margin, tank contents may matter and it's another thing to think about. If you have lots of margin, none of this matters, and you don't have to think about it. Some may roll their eyes at this level of detail, but facts are pesky things that don't go away, even if you ignore them.

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Old 12-21-2019, 09:54 AM   #77
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Do they treat the roads where you are? At 5 years mine started to show rust above the passenger side rear wheel. Other then that I'm at just under 100k, just 1 wheel bearing so far. The EcoBoost that everyone was afraid of in 2012 has worked out great.

Hope I didn't just jinx myself.
And if you trade up youíll wind up with one of those infamous aluminum bodies than you wonít be able to drop boulders in. But it wonít rust 😎
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Old 12-21-2019, 11:47 AM   #78
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And if you trade up youíll wind up with one of those infamous aluminum bodies than you wonít be able to drop boulders in. But it wonít rust 😎


Wait, wait! Are you telling me I was misinformed and can't drop a boulder in our new F150? My salesman is going to get an earful!

Enjoy,

Perry
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Old 12-21-2019, 11:53 AM   #79
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Toyota Hilux 1 ton pickup

Toyota does build 3/4 and 1 ton pickups. They just canít sell them in this country. If you google Toyota Hilux 1 ton you will find pictures them. I just canít figure out how to post the pictures. We are on a mifi so maybe not enough juice.
If you search hard enough you will find that Toyota was taken to court back in the 70s by the big three trying to stop the import of theyíre trucks. They were allowed to import 1/2 tons but not higher. That is why the 1 ton that the sold around the mid 70s I believe, disappeared. Iím sure it still has something to do with why they donít increase theyíre payload.
Anyways the Tundra and Tacoma factoryís are at peak capacity. If you donít buy whatís on the lot there is anywhere from a 6 week to 3 month wait for delivery. My 14 Tacoma I waited 6 weeks my first Tundra was 8 weeks, my second Tundra was bought off the lot.
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Old 12-21-2019, 12:23 PM   #80
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Wait, wait! Are you telling me I was misinformed and can't drop a boulder in our new F150? My salesman is going to get an earful!

Enjoy,

Perry
Hi: Perryb67... Be careful with your tool boxes too!!! Alf
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