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Old 02-03-2016, 01:45 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacMan View Post
I have a backup camera and love it. It allows me to see cars up close to my rear when I cannot see them in the side mirrors - which is often when in traffic. Wireless and yes, I have ETI install the wiring while in production. Got mine from TADI Brothers and there are multiple models from which to choose. I'd do it again.
We too have the backup camera and love it . Also have towing mirrors , you can't have too many ways to see behind and around you . There is a reason most new vehicles all have back up camera 's installed on them now . Our camera also has sound if needed . Escape installed ours . Pat
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Old 02-03-2016, 01:59 PM   #22
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Note that new vehicles with back up cameras are set up so that they only work when in reverse. And, that's for a reason too.
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:13 PM   #23
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Note that new vehicles with back up cameras are set up so that they only work when in reverse. And, that's for a reason too.
You are correct Glenn . However as a extra means of seeing and hearing , backup cameras are very useful in our opinion. Pat
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:29 PM   #24
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Has anyone thought to check out whether using a backup camera while driving is legal, this is a quote from the distracted driving law in Alberta. I would think watching a backup camera screen might fall under the the 3rd condition.

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Distracted Driving Law in Effect - NEW
Effective January 1, 2016 the penalty for distracted driving in Alberta will be a $287 fine and three demerit points. Any charges or convictions laid before January 1, 2016 will result in a $287 fine but no demerit points (regardless of whether the ticket is paid before or after January 1).
The law applies to all motor vehicles as defined by the Traffic Safety Act. It restricts drivers from:
  • using hand-held cell phones
  • texting or e-mailing (even when stopped at red lights)
  • using electronic devices like laptop computers, video games, cameras, video entertainment displays and programming portable audio players (e.g., MP3 players)
  • entering information on GPS units
  • reading printed materials in the vehicle
  • writing, printing or sketching
  • personal grooming (brushing and flossing teeth, putting on makeup, curling hair, clipping nails or shaving)
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:32 PM   #25
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I use a portable one for hook up and wish I had one on the RAV for parking ( especially with the spare hung on the back ), but I don't see a use for a back up camera on the trailer.
I get out and do a walk around when backing into a site, and have assistance from my wife.
On the road, a back up camera will allow you to see a tailgater, and to fret and raise your blood pressure, all the while taking your eyes off the road ahead.
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:50 PM   #26
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I use a portable one for hook up and wish I had one on the RAV for parking ( especially with the spare hung on the back ), but I don't see a use for a back up camera on the trailer.
I get out and do a walk around when backing into a site, and have assistance from my wife.
On the road, a back up camera will allow you to see a tailgater, and to fret and raise your blood pressure, all the while taking your eyes off the road ahead.
Each to there own . This is a Democacy . You would be nuts driving and just looking at your back camera , not paying attention to what is in front of you . It is what it says it is a backup camera . Still glad we have it . Wouldn't Change a thing . It is a good idea we all don't think a like . We can just agree to disagree . Pat
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:56 PM   #27
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It seems to me that using a rear view camera while towing is no different than using a rear view mirror when not towing.
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Old 02-03-2016, 03:05 PM   #28
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It is what it says it is a backup camera .
Agreed. It is for backing up.
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Old 02-03-2016, 03:16 PM   #29
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Agreed. It is for backing up.
Ok . Pat
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Old 02-03-2016, 04:28 PM   #30
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It seems to me that using a rear view camera while towing is no different than using a rear view mirror when not towing.

Exactly right.
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:18 PM   #31
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After spending considerable time searching US Department of Transport, I came up with this ruling for requirements for backup cameras by 2018.

Quote:
On the other hand, the agency does not agree with Sony and Honda that this rule should not provide restrictions against excessive linger time. We do not agree that the rearview image display is no more distracting than a rearview mirror as an illuminated display has fundamentally different properties when compared to a mirror. For instance, the prolonged illumination of the required image at night would be particularly distracting when the vehicle is traveling forward. Furthermore, unlike mirrors required on passenger cars and trucks, the required field of view coverage under this rule does not provide useful information for the driver while the vehicle is moving forward. We also do not agree that driver distraction is not a proper concern of this rulemaking. As in every rule, NHTSA desires to be cautious and avoid situations that can potentially increase safety risks. UNQUOTE


You can read all you want, reams and reams, at:
https://www.federalregister.gov/arti...isibility#h-90
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:22 PM   #32
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...I don't see a use for a back up camera on the trailer.

Just because you do not understand an item's functionality does not mean that it has none. Others have posted how these devices have enabled them to tow more safely in ways that other devices do not. For me, I prefer to see as well as I can, in all directions while driving. When not towing I use my rear view mirror to see directly behind me. When towing, that mirror doesn't work. But my rear view camera does.
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:54 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by gbaglo View Post
After spending considerable time searching US Department of Transport, I came up with this ruling for requirements for backup cameras by 2018.

Quote:
On the other hand, the agency does not agree with Sony and Honda that this rule should not provide restrictions against excessive linger time. We do not agree that the rearview image display is no more distracting than a rearview mirror as an illuminated display has fundamentally different properties when compared to a mirror. For instance, the prolonged illumination of the required image at night would be particularly distracting when the vehicle is traveling forward. Furthermore, unlike mirrors required on passenger cars and trucks, the required field of view coverage under this rule does not provide useful information for the driver while the vehicle is moving forward. We also do not agree that driver distraction is not a proper concern of this rulemaking. As in every rule, NHTSA desires to be cautious and avoid situations that can potentially increase safety risks. UNQUOTE


You can read all you want, reams and reams, at:
https://www.federalregister.gov/arti...isibility#h-90
Back up cameras have prevented hundreds of fender benders when people back out or into parking spaces, and the display has not had an adverse effect on drivers when in use. They either look in the rearview mirror or they look in the display. This is simply another case of government bureaucrats talking out of their asses, claiming that gawking at a video display is more distracting than gawking at the rear view mirror, with absolutely no credible data to back up their claims.
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Old 02-03-2016, 05:58 PM   #34
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I have no issue with a backup camera used just for that, and think they should legislate that they all should function only when reversing, just as the ones on our vehicles do.

That center rear view mirror that I see people solely using is like looking down a tunnel, as does offers nothing in the way of a good peripheral view. I can't imagine a camera would improve this. It is fine for a check, but the side mirrors are more important to use. Heck, half my miles driven have been without one, at least one that worked without obstruction.

Oh well, while I am on this mini rant......
I am so amazed how many people just don't know how to use their side mirrors properly, and especially when reversing. I cringe when I see someone turning their heads and contorting their bodies while reversing, whether towing or not. Using mirrors allows you to look down both sides, and well out to the sides, as well as anything you are approaching except narrow objects. Using the mirrors allows you to be more aware of everything that is going on around you. This is where the backup cameras shine, allowing you to see these smaller objects.

Obviously people who choose to purchase anything are going to back up their decisions, heck I do the same thing with things I purchase quite often too. But like other items that attribute to distracted driving, we do need to limit their use.

Anyhoo, I have prattled on more than my fair share, I have more than said my piece, and shall move along. Sorry for being so noisy.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:23 PM   #35
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Back up cameras have prevented hundreds of fender benders when people back out or into parking spaces, and the display has not had an adverse effect on drivers when in use.
And, that's what the hearings are all about, with input from the major automakers and other interested parties. Where do you get the information you stated, that there is no data?
I'm not going to quote pages and pages. I provided the link.
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Old 02-03-2016, 06:33 PM   #36
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Hopefully they ban rearview mirrors while they're at it. People should be looking where they're going, right? Not at whatever is happening behind them. How dare automakers even build in such a useless and dangerously distracting device.
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Old 02-03-2016, 10:14 PM   #37
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And, that's what the hearings are all about, with input from the major automakers and other interested parties. Where do you get the information you stated, that there is no data?
I'm not going to quote pages and pages. I provided the link.
Because they are stating opinion, repeat opinion, when they state that the image from a mirror is substantially different from a monitor/display. If one uses either a mirror or a monitor properly, they periodically glance at it briefly and then return their eyes to the road ahead; they do not fixate on it. Show me data that proves looking at a rear view monitor is any different from viewing the same image in a mirror......that data does not exist. And if they truly believe monitors are inherently inferior to mirrors and have the problems suggested, it would seem contrary to mandate the installation of backup cameras in all vehicles as of May 2018. As I said, BUREAUCRATS, or should I say BBS (that's not British Broadcasting Service).
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Old 02-03-2016, 10:23 PM   #38
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Has anyone thought to check out whether using a backup camera while driving is legal, this is a quote from the distracted driving law in Alberta. I would think watching a backup camera screen might fall under the the 3rd condition.

Cheers
Doug

Distracted Driving Law in Effect - NEW
Effective January 1, 2016 the penalty for distracted driving in Alberta will be a $287 fine and three demerit points. Any charges or convictions laid before January 1, 2016 will result in a $287 fine but no demerit points (regardless of whether the ticket is paid before or after January 1).
The law applies to all motor vehicles as defined by the Traffic Safety Act. It restricts drivers from:
  • using hand-held cell phones
  • texting or e-mailing (even when stopped at red lights)
  • using electronic devices like laptop computers, video games, cameras, video entertainment displays and programming portable audio players (e.g., MP3 players)
  • ...
Why would looking at a rear-view camera be any different (for the purposes of distraction) from looking in the rear-view mirrors? The "using electronic devices" section must be taken in context - if applied indiscriminately you wouldn't be able to use the display in the middle of most modern vehicles, or even the instruments (which are an electronic device). The examples given are devices which show material unrelated to driving the vehicle, not the surrounding traffic.

By the way, the penalties are new but the rules have been around for a few years.
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Old 02-03-2016, 10:29 PM   #39
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I think there is a big difference between using a backup camera as it is meant to be used and to be using it as a cctv system to see how's following you while you are driving down the highway at 60 plus mph or driving around town where a child could run out between parked cars. It only takes a momentary lapse of attention to cause an accident.

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Old 02-03-2016, 10:33 PM   #40
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And how is attention directed at a rear view camera any different than attention directed at a rear view mirror? Do the electronics induce stupefaction in normal drivers that render them unable to make sound or timely decisions while driving?
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