composting toilet versus conventional

[Kingfish]

Originally Posted by AndNeitherDoI

Hey Perry, I think you misunderstood something originally asked for - "We would love to hear from people out there who have used a composting toilet."

People camp can camp in all kinds of different ways. Y'all get so excited to share an opinion about something they didn't ask for.



I don't know why every detractor cites environmental problems as a knock against these toilets. There is nothing environmental about RV's. For example, fiberglass doesn't decompose. So all of our Escape trailers are going in to the landfill to stay. The best environmental impact we could all make is to not get an RV.

And for the last part, no one thinks they're cool for their toilet. I don't even know where this comes from.

Oftentimes the impact from an expressed opinion hinges more on how one says it rather than what is said.

[HABBERDABBER]

Originally Posted by Viajante

I'm always perplexed by the animosity expressed toward composting toilets and the people wo have them in their trailers. But I've never seen any animosity toward people who have Escape 15A or 17A trailers. Apparently composting toilets are worse than having none at all.

But like you, I'm perplexed by those who sing their praises.
For my use and application, I just don't get it. Perplexed, also.

[Donna D.]

I don't care what people do to their trailer or how they outfit it. What I do care about is when someone says "better." Better is subjective, so better than what and for who? I can see using a composting toilet if stationary... like in a cabin. But not an RV. Carrying vinegar or using water to clean the urine diverter and then whatever needs to be mixed with the feces... coir? Kitty litter? I carry enough stuff for camping as it is! And dumping. Most use plastic bags and throw it in the garbage. I'm trying to use less plastic, not more.

As is said, most of us will run out of fresh water before we fill the black tanks. You can't just invent fresh water. May as well dump a black tank when refilling fresh water. So, I'm not sure how people can stay out for weeks. Unless they're also carrying a big ole water bladder in their tow vehicle. And I don't need to use fresh water to flush my toilet.

YMMV

[Perry Butler]

Originally Posted by tedtucci

Hello again,

We are considering a composting toilet for our 5.0. We would love to hear from people out there who have used a composting toilet. This is our first travel trailer with a toilet so black water tanks would also be new to us.
Any advice to novices in this area would be appreciated!

It's that last sentence in the OP that I responded to tedtucci's request for "advice to novices in this area". It certainly was not a response to AndNeitherDoI. However, like AndNeitherDoI I gave my opinion and as far as I know that's still allowed.

Originally Posted by Donna D.

As is said, most of us will run out of fresh water before we fill the black tanks. You can't just invent fresh water. May as well dump a black tank when refilling fresh water. So, I'm not sure how people can stay out for weeks. Unless they're also carrying a big ole water bladder in their tow vehicle. And I don't need to use fresh water to flush my toilet.

YMMV

One of our peeves is the lack of fresh water in our 5.0. Using our 2 and 3 gallon water jugs we have for carrying fresh water I filled about 10+ gallons to our fresh water tank at Chiricahua NM and another 5 gallons at Cochise. It's quite easy to do. But we're all different and many here don't understand the dry campers dilemma.

Like you said, YMMV.

Enjoy,

Perry

[Crazypill]

[Ian and Sue]

Originally Posted by AndNeitherDoI

Hey Perry, I think you misunderstood something originally asked for - "We would love to hear from people out there who have used a composting toilet."

People camp can camp in all kinds of different ways. Y'all get so excited to share an opinion about something they didn't ask for.



I don't know why every detractor cites environmental problems as a knock against these toilets. There is nothing environmental about RV's. For example, fiberglass doesn't decompose. So all of our Escape trailers are going in to the landfill to stay. The best environmental impact we could all make is to not get an RV.

And for the last part, no one thinks they're cool for their toilet. I don't even know where this comes from.

As a wastewater treatment plant operator...my concern is public health NOT environmental. When I use a dump station the waste gets treated so as not to be a public health hazard. Unfortunately the research I have done shows that the waste generated by "composting toilets" in RVs typically does not get fully treated and can still pose a health hazard both for pathogens and nutrient loads. IF you dispose of the urine and partially composted feces in a place that will provide futher treatment to make it safe...OK but then why bother If you think spreading it on the ground is OK or putting it in a dumpster is OK you are sadly mistaken....DO YOU KNOW WHEN YOUR WASTE IS NO LONGER A HAZARD? DO YOU KNOW HOW TO TELL? Composting is a valid treatment technique but an RV is usually not the right environment and many people do not know how to tell when the job is properly complete. Sorry unless you really know all the ins and outs of this method you are fooling yourself and endangering others....

[Ian and Sue]

Originally Posted by AndNeitherDoI

Hey Perry, I think you misunderstood something originally asked for - "We would love to hear from people out there who have used a composting toilet."

People camp can camp in all kinds of different ways. Y'all get so excited to share an opinion about something they didn't ask for.



I don't know why every detractor cites environmental problems as a knock against these toilets. There is nothing environmental about RV's. For example, fiberglass doesn't decompose. So all of our Escape trailers are going in to the landfill to stay. The best environmental impact we could all make is to not get an RV.

And for the last part, no one thinks they're cool for their toilet. I don't even know where this comes from.

Look at the title of the OP "Composting toilet versus conventional"

[gbaglo]

Originally Posted by Ian and Sue

Look at the title of the OP "Composting toilet versus conventional"

Thanks for the expert analysis Ian.

[sunrisetrucker]

Originally Posted by Ian and Sue

As a wastewater treatment plant operator...my concern is public health NOT environmental. When I use a dump station the waste gets treated so as not to be a public health hazard. Unfortunately the research I have done shows that the waste generated by "composting toilets" in RVs typically does not get fully treated and can still pose a health hazard both for pathogens and nutrient loads. IF you dispose of the urine and partially composted feces in a place that will provide futher treatment to make it safe...OK but then why bother If you think spreading it on the ground is OK or putting it in a dumpster is OK you are sadly mistaken....DO YOU KNOW WHEN YOUR WASTE IS NO LONGER A HAZARD? DO YOU KNOW HOW TO TELL? Composting is a valid treatment technique but an RV is usually not the right environment and many people do not know how to tell when the job is properly complete. Sorry unless you really know all the ins and outs of this method you are fooling yourself and endangering others....

Thank you


It's always good to hear from those people who really know what they are talking about.

[Ooshkaboo]

Originally Posted by Ian and Sue

As a wastewater treatment plant operator...my concern is public health NOT environmental. When I use a dump station the waste gets treated so as not to be a public health hazard. Unfortunately the research I have done shows that the waste generated by "composting toilets" in RVs typically does not get fully treated and can still pose a health hazard both for pathogens and nutrient loads. IF you dispose of the urine and partially composted feces in a place that will provide futher treatment to make it safe...OK but then why bother If you think spreading it on the ground is OK or putting it in a dumpster is OK you are sadly mistaken....DO YOU KNOW WHEN YOUR WASTE IS NO LONGER A HAZARD? DO YOU KNOW HOW TO TELL? Composting is a valid treatment technique but an RV is usually not the right environment and many people do not know how to tell when the job is properly complete. Sorry unless you really know all the ins and outs of this method you are fooling yourself and endangering others....

Me having no clue on the ins and outs, and you definitely seem to, what is the difference in a RV person hitting a dumpster and people with their dog bags and diapers-baby and adult?

[Ian and Sue]

Originally Posted by Ooshkaboo

Me having no clue on the ins and outs, and you definitely seem to, what is the difference in a RV person hitting a dumpster and people with their dog bags and diapers-baby and adult?

Good question...it is just as big a problem. Dumpsters have drain holes. Any feces from warm blooded animals poses two problems. One it carries pathogens that can make us sick if we ingest them...that can be from direct ingestion...yech! or for example by swimming in a nearby lake after a rainstorm washes it into the water and who doesn't get some water in their mouth when swimming? Two urine and feces both present a problem with nutrient loading...think the farmer spreading manure to fertilize the fields. And yes farm runoff is a serious part of the problem with pollution in our waterways.

[WillyB]

Garbage In - - Garbage Out

[vtskiguy]

I also want to hear from someone who actually has one

[Ooshkaboo]

Originally Posted by Ian and Sue

Good question...it is just as big a problem. Dumpsters have drain holes. Any feces from warm blooded animals poses two problems. One it carries pathogens that can make us sick if we ingest them...that can be from direct ingestion...yech! or for example by swimming in a nearby lake after a rainstorm washes it into the water and who doesn't get some water in their mouth when swimming? Two urine and feces both present a problem with nutrient loading...think the farmer spreading manure to fertilize the fields. And yes farm runoff is a serious part of the problem with pollution in our waterways.

While I was settin the woods on fire, it made me think of your very nicely put answer, or non answer. So I’m guessing this would mean Rv people using dumpsters is then no different from the diapers and doggy bags. I’m way convinced by you its a bad idea, but should be practiced across the board I’d guess.
So you get on this government program to burn the woods to grow the crop to feed the deer so they came be hunted because if they’re not hunted there’s too many. So the government pays to feed the deer, keeping the population up, but it also is supposed to prevent erosion, which wouldn’t happen if they’d leave it all be in the first place. All this also being done for environmental impact, all while the sky’s are dark for miles with smoke. The sky isn’t part of this particular government departments problem, that’s a different department.

[Ian and Sue]

Originally Posted by Ooshkaboo

While I was settin the woods on fire, it made me think of your very nicely put answer, or non answer. So I’m guessing this would mean Rv people using dumpsters is then no different from the diapers and doggy bags. I’m way convinced by you its a bad idea, but should be practiced across the board I’d guess.
So you get on this government program to burn the woods to grow the crop to feed the deer so they came be hunted because if they’re not hunted there’s too many. So the government pays to feed the deer, keeping the population up, but it also is supposed to prevent erosion, which wouldn’t happen if they’d leave it all be in the first place. All this also being done for environmental impact, all while the sky’s are dark for miles with smoke. The sky isn’t part of this particular government departments problem, that’s a different department.

I am only speaking ONLY of putting feces(partially composted from an RV composting toilet or not treated at all as in doggie bags or diapers) in a dumpster is not a good solution and can cause sickness and/or pollution. I am not at all speaking about the general use of a dumpster and its environmental impact.

[Ooshkaboo]

Originally Posted by Ian and Sue

I am only speaking ONLY of putting feces(partially composted from an RV composting toilet or not treated at all as in doggie bags or diapers) in a dumpster is not a good solution and can cause sickness and/or pollution. I am not at all speaking about the general use of a dumpster and its environmental impact.

I get that, and I can tell you know more about this subject than anyone I’ve come across, this subject always seems to come down to proper disposal. Other that that it’s just a personal choice. My point is it really necessary for Rv compost users to not use the dumpsters, trash cans, since the system is already being made mess by a much larger of the population who no one seems concerned about. A drop in the bucket, what am I missing.

Some would say but it all has to start somewhere, this being true in many cases I’m sticking with this one specific Rv disposal situation.

[Mike G]

It isn't as if multiple people are throwing diapers and/or doggie doo-doo into every dumpster at every campground, every day. So, relative to that, a dose of bacteria-laden compost might or might not be a "drop in the bucket" by comparison; it might actually be the only batch of bacteria-laden stuff left in that campground all week.

On the other hand, what are the odds that enough liquid will be deposited in that particular dumpster (from rain or whatever) to cause bacterial run-out before it's emptied?

But then, it does go to the landfill, and that's not good.

But then, there are millions of animals in the woods doing their business every day, so the stuff is everywhere.

Etc, etc. We could go 'round and 'round on this!

[Iowa Dave]

A good friend of mine from Kindergarten on was a fellow named Henry Orton. Henry was a daredevil and very impulsive. In second grade he got in trouble for doing something and the teacher asked why he did it. “Because so and so did it” and her response “ if so and so jumped off the Cedar River bridge Downtown would you? Never forgot that.

We graduated from high school and a year later (1967) I was driving over the Cedar River Bridge, Henry and his sister and her boyfriend were on the bridge sidewalk. About that time Henry hopped up on the concrete bridge rail and walked about a block to the end of the bridge. I said to myself “I’ll be damned”.

49 years later we were all retired and went to the 50th year high school reunion. The next morning we assembled to take tables and chairs back to the legion hall. Without looking behind him, Henry started backing his Chevy pickup way too fast for as many people as there were around. I was to the side but a big guy was right in the path of the pickup. I grabbed his belt and jerked him back and the truck missed him. It got real quiet. Scoop turned to me and said “I think you just saved my life”. It was chilling. Scoop weighed about 325 and so did I. He said “I’m glad it was you there.”

Impulsive behavior and doing what others do is never good.
Probably not appropriate to the discussion, but a lifetime of experiences. All with one guy.
Hope everyone had a good St. Patricks day, Don’t forget St.Joseph on the 19th.
Iowa Dave

[gbaglo]

Interesting that my post disappeared. I wonder why?
And yet, this remains:
"My point is it really necessary for Rv compost users to not use the dumpsters, trash cans, since the system is already being made mess by a much larger of the population who no one seems concerned about. A drop in the bucket, what am I missing". -said Ooshkaboo

[Donna D.]

Originally Posted by gbaglo

Interesting that my post disappeared. I wonder why?

You and Leo are trading insults. Be glad all I did was delete some posts.